Value of: Shea Weber for Seabrook

[CristianoRonaldo]

Lol i'm not a fan of Weber, but that's a joke...

 

[Viqsi]

People are forgetting that if Weber retires before his contract ends, it won't be the Habs that will be slapped with the cap bill - it will be the Preds. His contract is bad, but it's not that bad for the Habs because of that... it's potentially quite bad for Nashville though.

Technically incorrect. Both can be hit with the bill; it's just that they have separate bills. Nashville's is hideously large. Montreal's is relatively small, but it's been building up.

If Weber retired at the end of this year, the Habs would have a $8,285,714 cap advantage credit to take care of, spread over the remaining eight years of his contract (or, a little over $1.03m/yr in cap hit). However, since subsequent years (the 2018-2019 season and beyond) have him earning below his cap hit, that cap advantage credit gets whittled away a bit (the difference is $1,857,143 for that season plus the three after it), so it's to Montreal's benefit for him to delay his retirement. After five seasons (not counting this one), the problem for Montreal pretty much goes away entirely (his actual pay in that fifth season drops to $3m, making a $4.8m cap difference, which nicely swallows any remaining advantage credit with room to spare).

Nashville, OTOH, would be best served by him either retiring immediately, or (ideally) playing out every year of his contract. They already have just shy of three times that cap advantage credit already built up ($24,571,428!), and that'll be spread out over however many years are left on Weber's contract when he retires. For example, at the end of this season it'd be about $3.07m/yr for eight years; next season it's $3.51m/year for seven years, season after that $4.1m/year for six years, and so forth. Yes, that does mean that if Weber retires the season before his very last one on his contract, Nashville would ostensibly have a $24.5m cap penalty for that one year. (I suspect that the Preds would have a long discussion with the NHL about mitigating that before it comes to that, tho. My bet is that they take the penalty, but spread it out over the number of years that were left on Weber's contract when he was traded (10), for a ~$2.46m/year penalty for a decade.)

So the Habs do have something to worry about, but it gets overlooked because of the extreme disaster potential for the Preds and because if he plays 'till he's 37 the Habs are basically fine.

 

[Esq]

Weber is the better player, and Seabrook is not nearly as bad as most whiny Hawks fans make him out to be.

Still, Hawks would have to add significantly to make this fair.

 

[rent free]

how come seabrook is bad now?

 

[A Loyal Dog]

For anyone saying Weber's contract's bad... It's okay everyone... He's going to go LTIR in 6 years (knee problems).

 

[Hawkaholic]

how come seabrook is bad now?

He was bad the last couple years, so far this year, he has been pretty good.

 

[Deam78]

It's a "Value Of" thread, not a trade proposal thread. The thread is more about discovering if some sort of trade could work or not.

You're supposed to decide what the value is to make it a fair deal, not the original post. For example...

Weber for Seabrook + Schmaltz + 1st

is totally different value compared to

Weber for Seabrook + Coughlin + 7th

This is actually a good return I think... But no retaining for sure. I'm high on Schmaltz so maybe not all MTL fans would do it, but then again I'm not sure Chicago would do it either haha

 

[Habs Halifax]

Habs will not trade Weber for Seabrook. Lets say our ship is sinking and we continue to struggle to score goals and miss the playoffs as a healthy team. Lets say we then do a rebuild. Then we trade Weber for prospects and picks to a contender. This is the only situation I see the Habs trading Weber.

Weber for Seabrook + only makes sense for the Blackhawks.

 

[thesaadfather]

This is actually a good return I think... But no retaining for sure. I'm high on Schmaltz so maybe not all MTL fans would do it, but then again I'm not sure Chicago would do it either haha

Yeah, Schmaltz stole the 2C spot from Anisimov and looked very good after being recalled last year. In the bit that we've seen him this year, he's been flat-out great and looks like a perfect match for Kane. He's improved significantly and consistently since being drafted. The kid is a star in the making. Seabrook was pretty good with Kempny last year as well, so I don't see it being worth it at all for the Hawks to trade Schmaltz just to get rid of Seabrook. Good job jumping on the Schmaltz hype train though, I think you'll be saying "I told you so" as the year goes on.

 

[Habs Halifax]

For anyone saying Weber's contract's bad... It's okay everyone... He's going to go LTIR in 6 years (knee problems).

Weber's contract is bad for the Preds. They have a total of $24.6M they are on the hook for in recapture penalties if Weber retires early. Considering his salary drops to $3M when he is age 37 and then $1M in the last 3 years when he is 38, 39, 40, we can assume that he does not play hockey at the age of 38 and possibly even at 37. So you are really looking at Weber for the next 6 years (age 32-37) at $7.86M AAV with a high degree of probability.

It will be interesting to see how many players actually play those $1M years in their contract when teams were trying to take advantage of a loop hole in the previous CBA. Hossa started this year with the "skin infection" and who's next? Luongo, Zetterberg, Parise, Carter, Suter, Weber.

 

[Frank Drebin]

What IN the f***?!

 

[beowulf]

Ya no as seems to be the consensus.

 

[Halla]

What a bad deal for MTL. You must be a Leafs fan and wish we make a bad deal.

good detective skills considering his location says toronto lol

 

[Agalloch]

good detective skills considering his location says toronto lol

I didn't check that, that's funny !

 

[webersshot]

We dont need an overhaul...we just need to add to what we have. and Hope Juulsen and Mete pan out...Drouin is 22, Hudon is 21...lekonen 20, calm down people...breath lord almighty we're a week in..lol

 

[Ducks in a row]

What possible reason would Montreal have to trade away Weber (with some retention) for Seabrook especially so soon after trading Subban for Weber? Even with a pick going Montreal way it would still be a crazy proposal.

 

[General Disarray]

Subban for Weber was a terrible and laughable trade, but is the Weber contract really that bad? From my understanding the pay goes down as he ages. So they'll be paying him like 3-4 million at age 37, that doesn't seem that bad.

 

[beowulf]

Subban for Weber was a terrible and laughable trade, but is the Weber contract really that bad? From my understanding the pay goes down as he ages. So they'll be paying him like 3-4 million at age 37, that doesn't seem that bad.

It's not the money it's the cap hit.

 

[Hostile Offer]

This is actually a good return I think... But no retaining for sure. I'm high on Schmaltz so maybe not all MTL fans would do it, but then again I'm not sure Chicago would do it either haha

Chicago wouldn't do it, they have a good one in Schmaltz for a long time. But as a Habs fan I wouldn't do it either since that leaves our D core simply awful.

 

[lifelonghockeyfan]

Since Seabrook has a NMC and a high restrictive NTC, why would anyone even think he would accept a trade to Montreal.

 

[ColdSteel2]

Nah, we'll just compliance buy out Seabs in the next CBA.

 

[nickdawg95]

Okposo + Bogosian for weber

 

[ColbyChaos]

Id rather just keep Schmaltz and co if acuring weber means thinning our forward depth. People make seabrook out to be someone who isnt even a NHL level defenseman whe he is still pretty sollid just no longer a lowend number 1 great #2 guy he was in the past. The team loves him anyway

 

[zeke]

The criticism of Weber was highly exaggerated by the analytics community.

When you look at xgf, and factor in quality of competition, Weber is still an elite dman in this league.

Seabrook is barely top-4 quality anymore.

 

[BleedBlue14]

This is terrible for both sides.

Weber is better than Seabrook, but his contract is even LONGER and terrible for a team that already lacks flexibility. Plus it's not like swapping one slow Dman out for another is going to help the Blackhawks.

Seabrook is not good anymore and wouldn't help the Habs at all.


I think both teams are just gonna wait it out and cross their fingers for compliance buyouts after the next lockout.

Or maybe some cap circumvention

Blackhawks would and should jump all over this. Their window is closing. Once Kane loses ability the team goes down the drain and they will need to start a rebuild. They have some decent pieces but they are so top heavy that they're bound to implode here shortly. This would be extremely beneficial to them to get out of the Seabrook contract and add Weber at the same time.

I don't understand the Weber hate. He's still a valuable piece his contract is just a bit rough. Habs issue is scoring not defense. You guys can't rely on only having JD andPatches as impact players.