Saskin to be Ousted?

[Wetcoaster]

Reports have players circulating a petition to remove Ted Saskin. There is a lot of dissatisfaction over what some players perceive as a culture of secrecy and side deals being made without consent as the never-ending CBA continues to be negotiated.
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/news_story/?ID=160678&hubname=nhl

Yesterday, corroborating sources confirmed there are 30 different secret side agreements to the Collective Bargaining Agreement that was ratified last summer that NHL players have not been informed about.

"Ted never mentioned any of them until he got caught," Chelios said.

"If we provide false and misleading information to our clients, we can be decertified by the PA," said a player agent who requested anonymity. "If they provide false and misleading information, can we decertify them? They watch us. Who watches them?"

http://torontosun.com/Sports/Hockey/2006/03/30/1512268-sun.html

The NHLPA meeting in Whistler in July could prove very interesting..... a coup is possible.

Is the return of Bob Goodenow on the horizon?

Click to read more...

 

[Resolute]

Your question makes absolutely no sense. After the way Goodenow repeatedly screwed up in the last negotiation, I do not see any reason why the players would want him back.

It is also very debatable just how many players actually make up the group of dissidents. Given it has constantly been the same merry little band of fools, led by Chelios, making the comments, it is impossible to gauge what level of dissatisfaction exists, and quite frankly, I see no reason to take Chelios at his word.

 

[Wetcoaster]

Your question makes absolutely no sense. After the way Goodenow repeatedly screwed up in the last negotiation, I do not see any reason why the players would want him back.

It is also very debatable just how many players actually make up the group of dissidents. Given it has constantly been the same merry little band of fools, led by Chelios, making the comments, it is impossible to gauge what level of dissatisfaction exists, and quite frankly, I see no reason to take Chelios at his word.

How did Goodenow screw up????

If the players had followed his advice and strategy they would have been in a much stronger position. He was clear from the get go that at least 1 1/2 years would have to be burned to face down the owners. The players folded and went with Saskin. Bad move IMHO.

 

[Bring Back Bucky]

Your question makes absolutely no sense. After the way Goodenow repeatedly screwed up in the last negotiation, I do not see any reason why the players would want him back.

It is also very debatable just how many players actually make up the group of dissidents. Given it has constantly been the same merry little band of fools, led by Chelios, making the comments, it is impossible to gauge what level of dissatisfaction exists, and quite frankly, I see no reason to take Chelios at his word.

Maybe Chelios should make some veiled threats at Saskin's family???? Just to show he's as classy as ever.

 

[hockeydadx2*]

Maybe Chelios should make some veiled threats at Saskin's family???? Just to show he's as classy as ever.

Maybe McCabe and Esche could go back to refusing to play under any cap, for any figure, at any time.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

How did Goodenow screw up????

If the players had followed his advice and strategy they would have been in a much stronger position. He was clear from the get go that at least 1 1/2 years would have to be burned to face down the owners. The players folded and went with Saskin. Bad move IMHO.

I don't think the players told Goodenow to offer a 24% rollback on salaries across the board but keep everything else as is, like Goodenow did in his early December proposal. Even if it was a PR ploy as some here suggested, that move alone backed the players into a corner and the owners were all too happy to accept it and start piling things on to favor them; the owners at that point figured if the players were willing to give a major concession like that unprompted, the union was going to fold first and it was just a matter of waiting them out. Once Goodenow offered the 24% rollback, any advantage the players might have had was completely undermined and no matter what deal the players struck after that was going to have that rollback in it.

That is how Goodenow screwed up. Had he held his ground, his chances of getting something better for the players would have been much higher.

 

[Egil]

How did Goodenow screw up????

If the players had followed his advice and strategy they would have been in a much stronger position. He was clear from the get go that at least 1 1/2 years would have to be burned to face down the owners. The players folded and went with Saskin. Bad move IMHO.

And how could giving up over $2 BILLION of player salaries be considered a "good" strategy? That is a terrible plan.

 

[CBJ goalie]

Probably just the same group of militant players trying to keep stirring ***** up.
Here's a real quesion: how much longer can Klatt and Irbe stay bitter?

If there was a real problem with the way Saskin was handling/leading the NHLPA, wouldn't there be more voices complaining? And when I say more, I mean different players.
Many players have gone on record saying they're very happy with the leadership they've been getting from Saskin.

 

[hockeytown9321]

Probably just the same group of militant players trying to keep stirring ***** up.
Here's a real quesion: how much longer can Klatt and Irbe stay bitter?

If there was a real problem with the way Saskin was handling/leading the NHLPA, wouldn't there be more voices complaining? And when I say more, I mean different players.
Many players have gone on record saying they're very happy with the leadership they've been getting from Saskin.

According to Chelios(who as we know is a reprehensible person and habitual liar), the Red Wings took a vote on Saskin and it was 20-1 against him.

 

[Alan Jackson]

For what its worth, this letter is from Saskin responding to these allegations:

“You suggest that these ancillary agreements constituted a set of private deals between me and Bill Daly.To the contrary, all of them are agreements between the NHL and NHLPA and all were reviewed by our entire team, including the Executive Committee, Bob Goodenow, Ian Pulver, Ian Penny, other in-house staff, our outside legal counsel and our outside business consultants. Some of them were signed by me and some by Ian Pulver. The material provisions contained in the ancillary agreements were discussed with the Executive Board during the CBA ratification process. Finally, the entire Executive Committee, including (take note of this name) TRENT KLATT .... have had their own copies of the ancillary agreements since July of 2005.
None of the ancillary agreements conflicts with the terms of the full CBA text, which everyone received. In fact, they benefit the Players by addressing areas of the CBA we wanted to clarify so that there could be no disagreement between the parties on certain issues. People familiar with labour law and practice know that there is nothing unusual or sinister about drafting side or ancillary agreements to a collective bargaining agreement. They are commonly used for purposes of safeguarding confidential data, for drafting purposes and for purposes of agreeing on certain details that are entirely consistent with the CBA provisions.â€

 

[GSC2k2*]

According to Chelios(who as we know is a reprehensible person and habitual liar), the Red Wings took a vote on Saskin and it was 20-1 against him.

You say that with more than a hint of sarcasm, Hockeytown, yet the fact of the matter is that Chelios is by all appearances what you say he is.

 

[GSC2k2*]

How did Goodenow screw up????

If the players had followed his advice and strategy they would have been in a much stronger position. He was clear from the get go that at least 1 1/2 years would have to be burned to face down the owners. The players folded and went with Saskin. Bad move IMHO.

You continue to spread the myth - even months after the fact now - that Goodenow was saying it would take over a year to break the owners. In truth, he was saying that for public consumption while privately advising many that the owners would crumble well before that.

He had no exit strategy when his assumption proved fatally false. He lost his job for that reason and that reason alone. You know this, yet you continue with your dribblings otherwise. Why?

 

[Ted Hoffman]

Is this the same Chris Chelios who swore he hated the Red Wings so much that if he had to choose between playing for the Red Wings or retire, he'd retire because he would NEVER play for the Red Wings?

I'm just asking ...

 

[FlyerFan]

You continue to spread the myth - even months after the fact now - that Goodenow was saying it would take over a year to break the owners. In truth, he was saying that for public consumption while privately advising many that the owners would crumble well before that.

He had no exit strategy when his assumption proved fatally false. He lost his job for that reason and that reason alone. You know this, yet you continue with your dribblings otherwise. Why?

The strategy was simple. How long could the NHL go on without playing any hockey? Two years? Three years? Four years? Eventually the NHL would have to put SOMETHING out there on the ice, either through impasse and or replacement players for which Goodenow would be waiting.

 

[Resolute]

How did Goodenow screw up????

If the players had followed his advice and strategy they would have been in a much stronger position. He was clear from the get go that at least 1 1/2 years would have to be burned to face down the owners. The players folded and went with Saskin. Bad move IMHO.

The players had a hell of a lot more to lose sitting out more than one season than Goodenow did. When did the union finally crack? When Goodenow started talking about it taking two full years, or longer, before the lockout would end.

You are a player, you and your bretheren just lost over $1 billion collectively. The owners have shown absolutely no signs of cracking, and your leader is calling on you to give up another $1-2 billion?

Goodenow's strategy was entirely dependent on the assumption the owners would cave. His fatal flaw was that his players recognized that it wasnt going to happen before he did.

 

[Burke's Evil Spirit]

I wonder if the engine that powers Chris Chelios' career is fueled by spite against Saskin.

 

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

I thought that there were more and more players signing on board. Last I heard, Chelios was going to Philadelphia to talk with the Flyers players about Saskin. I think that there was probably some underhanded dealings that were done, but I don't think it's anything that will call for Saskin's removal. However, I think players are going to start point fingers at guys like Linden, Guerin, etc....instead. I could see the NHLPA executive committee falling apart and those players making up the NHLPA be snubbed by their fellow brethren.

The thing that I think will happen is that Saskin is going to surround himself with a bunch of Saskin guys though to try to put some spin control on this. As for what Hatcher said recently about another Eagleson situation developing, it wouldn't surprise me at all.

 

[me2]

You continue to spread the myth - even months after the fact now - that Goodenow was saying it would take over a year to break the owners.

We all know if the players had held out for 10 years they'd be sooo much wealthier.

 

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

Any way you look at it, Saskin has a huge job on his hands to get everyone onboard with his vision for the future of the NHLPA. There's no doubt about that. This is going to get ugly and it won't surprise me if there's a huge split amongst the players. And if the NHLPA ever decertifies because of that, it can get real ugly, real fast.

 

[Hasbro]

How did Goodenow screw up????

If the players had followed his advice and strategy they would have been in a much stronger position. He was clear from the get go that at least 1 1/2 years would have to be burned to face down the owners. The players folded and went with Saskin. Bad move IMHO.

Not auditing the owners' report also gave them an air of legitimacy, he never put a conving reason for a capless league on the table and the he did nothing to win the pr battle.

 

[blamebettman*]

You continue to spread the myth - even months after the fact now - that Goodenow was saying it would take over a year to break the owners. In truth, he was saying that for public consumption while privately advising many that the owners would crumble well before that.

He had no exit strategy when his assumption proved fatally false. He lost his job for that reason and that reason alone. You know this, yet you continue with your dribblings otherwise. Why?

yes, because you know exactly what Goodenow said in private?

vidkun saskin and his henchmen will pay for their crimes, the whole story hasn't been told yet...but none of this is Goodenows fault. It's all on Saskin and his hijackers.

yea, now they're crying for Goodenow to come back. But Bob shouldn't, he should screw those who stabbed him in the back, those that facilitated it, those that did nothing. Now the union needs him just like they needed him after Eagleson...what he should do is let them wilt and die with Saskin or another one of Buttmans henchmen.

 

[GSC2k2*]

yes, because you know exactly what Goodenow said in private? you're an idiot mr. hutz.

vidkun saskin and his henchmen will pay for their crimes, the whole story hasn't been told yet...but none of this is Goodenows fault. It's all on Saskin and his hijackers.

yea, now they're crying for Goodenow to come back. But Bob shouldn't, he should screw those who stabbed him in the back, those that facilitated it, those that did nothing. Now the union needs him just like they needed him after Eagleson...what he should do is let them wilt and die with Saskin or another one of Buttmans henchmen.

Thanks for your contribution to the discussion, Bob.

Several players made assertions to the effect of what I posted.

"They" are not crying for Goodenow to come back. Chris Chelios, Trent Klatt and a merry band of forty middle school graduates are.

Bob Goodenow failed to heed the words of Marvin Miller. A union leader does not dictate the positions of the union.

 

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

Thanks for your contribution to the discussion, Bob.

Several players made assertions to the effect of what I posted.

"They" are not crying for Goodenow to come back. Chris Chelios, Trent Klatt and a merry band of forty middle school graduates are.

Bob Goodenow failed to heed the words of Marvin Miller. A union leader does not dictate the positions of the union.

Actually, it's more than forty. Last I read, there was about 140 players that jumped on board with the Chelios/Klatt ouster and it looks like there might be more. Like I said previously, it won't surprise me if there is a move to try to decertify, a dumb move, but a move none the less that might be made.

I don't blame Saskin for this mess though. If anything, the mess has to fall on the shoulders of the NHLPA for originally backing up Goodenow and then flopping on him once things got tight. Actually, I blame Trevor Linden 100% for the mess that the NHLPA is in right now. That puke was the one who trumpeted Goodenow's plan and then once things got tight, he did a complete 180.

 

[GSC2k2*]

Actually, it's more than forty. Last I read, there was about 140 players that jumped on board with the Chelios/Klatt ouster and it looks like there might be more. Like I said previously, it won't surprise me if there is a move to try to decertify, a dumb move, but a move none the less that might be made.

I don't blame Saskin for this mess though. If anything, the mess has to fall on the shoulders of the NHLPA for originally backing up Goodenow and then flopping on him once things got tight. Actually, I blame Trevor Linden 100% for the mess that the NHLPA is in right now. That puke was the one who trumpeted Goodenow's plan and then once things got tight, he did a complete 180.

Nowhere have I seen any such references to 140 players. You mentioned that you have read it. Can you tell me where you have seen it? A link is not required, but i would like to know the publication. I assume that you are not going to refer me to some offhanded statement by Doofus Chelios himself where he said that. I would give that as much credibility as him saying a billion players agreed with him.

Your post still assumes that Goodenow had a 1-2 year plan. He had NO SUCH PLAN. His plan was to say that in the belief that the owners would buy it and run screaming to Bettman demanding a settlement. He never in fact had a plan to actually sit out a year or two. Several players have stated that Goodenow had assured them that the owners would crack and it would not take that long.

 

[SGY19]

Good for the players. I know if I was a player I wouldn't want someone running the NHLPA that just rolls over and gives in to negotiations with the owners. Something is wrong and Chelios is right to look in to it. Chelios just might be right that the Saskin is tied in too closely with Bettman and the owners. This was such a lopsided victory for the owners that it's almost obvious that something is wrong.