Confirmed with Link: Sanford resigns with Blues 2 year 3 mill (1.5 mill AAV)

[Meatball]

Ah, another Ranksu necro thread bump.

 

[Ranksu]

Ah, another Ranksu necro thread bump.

I thought it would be ideal to keep in topic at one place. Looks to me like that in every thread there is Sanford talk and feels like it kind of get lost out there.

 

[Ranksu]

He gets nowhere near the ice time that those 2 get and isn’t on the powerplay.

His ice time is really not a big deal at all. Chief plays him like a 3rd liner, which is what he is.

Maybe some one like @Brian39 or @stl76 could take a deeper look for about Sanford icetime and his usage in linemates. Still it doesn't fit for 2nd liner position point wise when playing with ROR - Perron duo.

Only problem what I think is we dont have enough sample size for another forward who could have played in with ROR - Perron line. Feels like it has been forced with Sanford and we lack of real potential produce in there knowing how good that duo really is.

 

[Reality Czech]

Perron is having his best career by point wise, ROR having almost as good last season point wise.
Why Sanford is still producing so far behind them. Ofc Sanford hasnt played same amount of games and occasionally played different lines, powerplay. but not that often.

He should produce much higher level playing with ROR and Perron.

I bet we would get more out of Perrin and ROR IF there would play with them REAL top6 winger and not like Chief's spoiled kid.

As a founding member of the "Zach Sanford isn't that bad" club, I thought I should respond. I went over to QuantHockey to check the Blues scoring stats per 60 minutes. I was somewhat surprised that Sanford is actually 7th in the team in points per 60 minutes, just behind ROR. If you look at even strength points per 60 minutes, Sanford is actually third (yes, third) on the team behind Tarasenko and Thomas.

So maybe, just maybe Sanford isn't as bad as you and others have been saying. Just because he plays on the 2nd line, doesn't mean he gets the same opportunities as Perron and ROR. 46% of Perron's points have come on the PP, while 35% of ROR's have.

So, sure...we might get better results from another player on that line, but I don't see anyone on the Blues who is better suited to play with 57/90 right now.

You're welcome.

St. Louis Blues @ NHL - 2019‑2020 Stats

 

[stl76]

As a founding member of the "Zach Sanford isn't that bad" club, I thought I should respond. I went over to QuantHockey to check the Blues scoring stats per 60 minutes. I was somewhat surprised that Sanford is actually 7th in the team in points per 60 minutes, just behind ROR. If you look at even strength points per 60 minutes, Sanford is actually third (yes, third) on the team behind Tarasenko and Thomas.

So maybe, just maybe Sanford isn't as bad as you and others have been saying. Just because he plays on the 2nd line, doesn't mean he gets the same opportunities as Perron and ROR. 46% of Perron's points have come on the PP, while 35% of ROR's have.

So, sure...we might get better results from another player on that line, but I don't see anyone on the Blues who is better suited to play with 57/90 right now.

You're welcome.

St. Louis Blues @ NHL - 2019‑2020 Stats

This is pretty much what I expected. It's remarkable that all 21 of Sanford's points have come at even strength.

Had a longer response typed out but accidentally closed the window and lost it. Oh well, will try to write out a longer response tomorrow but need to get some sleep

Here is the brief synopsis of what I wrote:

1) not a good idea to compare per 60 stats between players that play vastly different minutes - ROR averages 20:27 min (15:34 ES), Perron 18:23 (15:33 ES), Sanford 12:46 (12:21 ES). If Sanford played more minutes, his per 60 numbers would be way, way lower - and that's not even taking into account different quality of competition/matchups, game situations, zone starts, ect that would come with those larger minutes.

2) using the with/without line tool on natural stat trick, its clear that Sanford has a positive impact on the ROR - Perron duo

 

[simon IC]

Sanford is definitely talented. He is also capable of two-way play. Sometimes he's even physical! My issue with him is his inconsistency. I will never forget screaming at my monitor during the Boston series because Zach was literally standing there staring as the play went into our zone. Hopefully, he's outgrown that, and to be fair, he has been better recently. Once again, just the old man's eye test. I fully understand some fan's frustration with him.

 

[CaliforniaBlues310]

I don’t mind Sanford, but I wouldn’t be upset if he was the centerpiece in a trade for an upgrade at the deadline.

Kyrou and Kostin should get two of the spots in our top 9 next year, so I’m guessing it’ll be him and Bozak that’ll be gone.

 

[Reality Czech]

This is pretty much what I expected. It's remarkable that all 21 of Sanford's points have come at even strength.

Had a longer response typed out but accidentally closed the window and lost it. Oh well, will try to write out a longer response tomorrow but need to get some sleep

Here is the brief synopsis of what I wrote:

1) not a good idea to compare per 60 stats between players that play vastly different minutes - ROR averages 20:27 min (15:34 ES), Perron 18:23 (15:33 ES), Sanford 12:46 (12:21 ES). If Sanford played more minutes, his per 60 numbers would be way, way lower - and that's not even taking into account different quality of competition/matchups, game situations, zone starts, ect that would come with those larger minutes.

2) using the with/without line tool on natural stat trick, its clear that Sanford has a positive impact on the ROR - Perron duo

Sure, I know that the stats can be misleading. But I also don't think we should expect much more from him considering how limited his ice time is. It's kind of surprising that people are still criticizing Sanford despite the fact that he's been one of our best players the past couple of weeks. Ranksu said that Sanford should be producing more playing with ROR and Perron and I was merely pointing out that he's doing pretty well considering his minutes and usage. Perry and ROR haven't exactly been tearing it up at even strength either lately.

I don’t mind Sanford, but I wouldn’t be upset if he was the centerpiece in a trade for an upgrade at the deadline.

Kyrou and Kostin should get two of the spots in our top 9 next year, so I’m guessing it’ll be him and Bozak that’ll be gone.

Those two will have to earn a top 9 spot, and I think it's optimistic to expect both of them to be legit top 9 NHL players next year. Especially Kostin. I get the salary cap concerns, but not sure why we'd wanna dump Bozak to make room for an unproven, young player. He's solid defensively and on the PK, two things that can't be said of Kyrou and Kostin. Replacing Bozak and Sanford with Kyrou and Kostin doesn't seem like a move Armstrong and Berube would approve of. That's a move a non-playoff team would make, not a contending team that plays a heavy, defensive style.

 

[BlueDream]

Sure, I know that the stats can be misleading. But I also don't think we should expect much more from him considering how limited his ice time is. It's kind of surprising that people are still criticizing Sanford despite the fact that he's been one of our best players the past couple of weeks. Ranksu said that Sanford should be producing more playing with ROR and Perron and I was merely pointing out that he's doing pretty well considering his minutes and usage. Perry and ROR haven't exactly been tearing it up at even strength either lately.



Those two will have to earn a top 9 spot, and I think it's optimistic to expect both of them to be legit top 9 NHL players next year. Especially Kostin. I get the salary cap concerns, but not sure why we'd wanna dump Bozak to make room for an unproven, young player. He's solid defensively and on the PK, two things that can't be said of Kyrou and Kostin. Replacing Bozak and Sanford with Kyrou and Kostin doesn't seem like a move Armstrong and Berube would approve of. That's a move a non-playoff team would make, not a contending team that plays a heavy, defensive style.

Sanford is probably only traded for an upgrade. There would be no reason to use him as a cap dump when he only makes 1.5M. Even if he’s on the 4th line or press box, that won’t hurt the team and he can be a decently versatile piece to have to insert at certain times.

Bozak we just won’t be able to afford to keep.

We could spread out the offense with something like:

Schwartz-Schenn-Kyrou
Sanford-ROR-Perron
Blais-Thomas-Tarasenko
Steen-Barbashev-Sundqvist
Mac

There are lots of options. Kostin will probably see some call ups but will definitely need to earn a spot and beat someone out rather than be given one.

 

[Eye Test]

Bozak 50% retained for ??

 

[Majorityof1]

Bozak 50% retained for ??

Nothing reasonable would convince us to do that. We need to move his entire cap hit next year. We aren't keeping $2.5M in dead cap when we need to clear $6-7M to sign Petro + RFAs. Unless you take Allen's entire cap hit or Steen's as well.

 

[Stealth JD]

Bozak 50% retained for ??

why would the Blues retain on Bozak? if they did, it certainly wouldn't be for 50%...maybe 20% tops, and even that is unlikely. He's not Lucic for crying out loud.

 

[CaliforniaBlues310]

Sanford is probably only traded for an upgrade. There would be no reason to use him as a cap dump when he only makes 1.5M. Even if he’s on the 4th line or press box, that won’t hurt the team and he can be a decently versatile piece to have to insert at certain times.

Bozak we just won’t be able to afford to keep.

We could spread out the offense with something like:

Schwartz-Schenn-Kyrou
Sanford-ROR-Perron
Blais-Thomas-Tarasenko
Steen-Barbashev-Sundqvist
Mac

There are lots of options. Kostin will probably see some call ups but will definitely need to earn a spot and beat someone out rather than be given one.

Yep this is very in line with my thinking. I love Bozie, but we need the cap space, and I’m sure we could get a 2nd for him from a middle tier team.

If Sanford doesn’t get traded at the deadline(I think he will imo), I could definitely see him being on this team next year. In that case, Kostin would have to push somebody to the press box or down to our TBD affiliate.

Depending on if we want to use Thomas as a top 6 guy, or deepen our C depth, I could see either of these next year

Schwartz-Schenn-Tarasenko
Perron-O’Reilly-Kyrou
Blais-Thomas-Kostin
Steen-Barbashev-Sundqvist
MacEachern, DLR?

or

Schwartz-O’Reilly-Perron
Schenn-Thomas-Tarasenko
Blais-Sundqvist-Kyrou
Steen-Barbashev-Kostin

 

[Mike Liut]

I want Kostin, Kyrou and Sanford to be regulars next year and I want Bozak and Steen gone. Nothing personal to either, they both seem like great dudes, but we need the salary relief.

 

[CaliforniaBlues310]

I don’t mind Sanford, but I wouldn’t be upset if he was the centerpiece in a trade for an upgrade at the deadline.

Kyrou and Kostin should get two of the spots in our top 9 next year, so I’m guessing it’ll be him and Bozak that’ll be gone.

Zach saw this and told me to go **** myself

 

[shpongle falls]

As someone who was p-ssed about the Fabbri trade initially, Sanford has really come alive these past few weeks and I'm rooting so hard for this kid right now and am so happy he's finally finding his game! He's been through a lot with the major injury and losing his Dad at such a young age.

Good on the coaching staff to be patient with him for awhile now, I used to hate Sanny with ROR and DP but now he fits that line like a glove and he's on fire! He really seems to have an excellent one timer and should keep utilizing it.

He's still fairly young and hasn't even peaked yet imo...they definitely shouldn't trade him.

 

[lakai17]

4 goal game! Now what?

 

[Reality Czech]

Why this guy get so much love from Chief? IF he would have lush hair like Fabbri he would have been long gone already.

Do you understand now?

 

[Ranksu]

Do you understand now?

Watched afterward game, really impressive game by Sanford. I give credit for Sanford stepping up and finally score. Too many times saw him just waste great scoring chance.

Hey, have you take out of me your ignorelist? Welcome back.

 

[execwrite1]

Holy Pucks Batman - Zach Sanford is a really good NHL hockey player.

That's how you develop young talent. Same will happen for Kyrou and Kostin.

Patience, grasshopper.

 

[HighNote]

I like that there's not much talk about Sanford on the main boards. Only one thread made the day after his 4 goal night, and that didn't even make it to 2 pages.

Last 10 games: 9 goals, 14 points. This is the most confident I've ever seen him look, with and without the puck. He actually looks like an NHL player, whereas before he looked like a warm body going in and out of the lineup. There's no way he sustains this, but this has to be great for his confidence/growth. He's always had a great shot/great hands, but it seems as though his vision, play without the puck, and patience with the puck is starting to shine through. He's fun to watch right now.

 

[Stealth JD]

Also from Dom:

11. There are 20 players this season that have posted multiple four-point games, a collection of names ranging from the usual suspects like McDavid, Draisaitl and Nathan MacKinnon to players having break-through seasons like Mika Zibanejad and Bryan Rust. Also on the list? St. Louis’s Zach Sanford. That’s not a name I would’ve ever expected, but he makes the cut after a four-goal outburst on Feb. 13.
He’s in good company here and looks like a guy who deserves a few more minutes. Sanford averages 13:20 of ice-time per game this season but ranks 14th in the league in points-per-60 at 2.75. The Blues’ 3.15 goals-per-game is only average, but they could feasibly see an offensive boost from an internal promotion.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Bozak is 3rd in Points/60 on the team during EV, but that doesn't mean he should now get more minutes.

Sanford has looked like a quality middle 6 player though, and he's versatile enough to play in any situation.