RW/LW Lucas Raymond - Frolunda HC, SWE JRs (2020, 4th, DET)

[Jim Morrison]

#BetterThanHoltz

Very short-sighted of you. I've watched a lot of both players here in Sweden and they are very different in their playing style. As stated earlier, Raymond is more of a slippery, agile, winger that is really noticeable when he has a good game - but he can also disappear when the deke isn't working as well. Holtz play a no bullshit kind of game which I believe will translate better to the senior level as he rarely has an off night. Both players are really exciting to watch though and the 2020 draft class is shaping up to be great for us. Theodor Niederbach has perhaps the most untapped potential and he isn't even in this tournament.

In my opinion Raymond should go to the CHL and play. I just feel like his game would develop more there than over in the SHL. Pretty controversial coming from a Swede I guess.

 

[Habs76]

Very short-sighted of you. I've watched a lot of both players here in Sweden and they are very different in their playing style. As stated earlier, Raymond is more of a slippery, agile, winger that is really noticeable when he has a good game - but he can also disappear when the deke isn't working as well. Holtz play a no bull**** kind of game which I believe will translate better to the senior level as he rarely has an off night. Both players are really exciting to watch though and the 2020 draft class is shaping up to be great for us. Theodor Niederbach has perhaps the most untapped potential and he isn't even in this tournament.

In my opinion Raymond should go to the CHL and play. I just feel like his game would develop more there than over in the SHL. Pretty controversial coming from a Swede I guess.

Lmao I'm kidding. Obviously I'm not coming to a conclusion off one game.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

I know they are both good players. They're very different though, and Raymond fits my preferred style a bit better. Always on the move, looking for open ice, winning puck battles and races and playing a high intensity style.

Holtz on the other hand will sit back and allow the game to come to him. Can change the game with one shot, and keeps defenders and goalies honest as he's always a threat to shoot or pass.

Personally, I'll take the speedy, electrifying winger over the sniper.

Farabee vs Wahlstrom... give me Farabee.. Although I think Holz is a cut above Wahlstrom and does more to drive plays. Raymond really drives the play.. He made a couple really nice rushes that resulted in weak backhands for shots.. so I'd like to see him finish some of his great plays off. nb: 1 game sample size for me... will watch again today.

 

[Habs76]

Farabee vs Wahlstrom... give me Farabee.. Although I think Holz is a cut above Wahlstrom and does more to drive plays. Raymond really drives the play.. He made a couple really nice rushes that resulted in weak backhands for shots.. so I'd like to see him finish some of his great plays off. nb: 1 game sample size for me... will watch again today.

I did like Wahlstrom more than Farabee. He has more raw talent. The shot, puckhandling and skating, he just has that dynamic offensive talent that Farabee doesn't have.

Now Holtz certainly has some of those qualities but his skating was a tad disappointing yesterday. What did catch me off guard though was his offensive vision. I was under the impression we were talking about a pure offensive sniper, so seeing him make some of those nifty passes cross-ice was nice. He really uses his deadly shot to keep goalies and defensemen honest, but he's a sneaky good playmaker as well.

 

[theslatcher]

I did like Wahlstrom more than Farabee. He has more raw talent. The shot, puckhandling and skating, he just has that dynamic offensive talent that Farabee doesn't have.

Now Holtz certainly has some of those qualities but his skating was a tad disappointing yesterday. What did catch me off guard though was his offensive vision. I was under the impression we were talking about a pure offensive sniper, so seeing him make some of those nifty passes cross-ice was nice. He really uses his deadly shot to keep goalies and defensemen honest, but he's a sneaky good playmaker as well.

Holtz himself when asked about how it felt yesterday said it didn't feel good for his own part, so eh, will probably do better as the tournament goes on, it is August after all.

 

[Jim Morrison]

I did like Wahlstrom more than Farabee. He has more raw talent. The shot, puckhandling and skating, he just has that dynamic offensive talent that Farabee doesn't have.

Now Holtz certainly has some of those qualities but his skating was a tad disappointing yesterday. What did catch me off guard though was his offensive vision. I was under the impression we were talking about a pure offensive sniper, so seeing him make some of those nifty passes cross-ice was nice. He really uses his deadly shot to keep goalies and defensemen honest, but he's a sneaky good playmaker as well.

His skating does need work, but he kind of reminds me of Tavares in that way. Not super fast but "smart" skating and positioning. His hockey-IQ is really high so he almost never gets caught in a bad position where his speed works against him. Both have a great knack for finding both garbage goals and thundering slappers/wristers. Atleast that's the impression I've gotten by watching him. We'll see how it translates.

But hey, this is a Lucas Raymond thread

 

[DDRhockey]

Holtz himself when asked about how it felt yesterday said it didn't feel good for his own part, so eh, will probably do better as the tournament goes on, it is August after all.

Good to see holtz critical of himself. Peter forsberg was never happy with his play

 

[Habs76]

Holtz himself when asked about how it felt yesterday said it didn't feel good for his own part, so eh, will probably do better as the tournament goes on, it is August after all.

Good to hear. Gotta be your own toughest critic.

 

[G0bias]

Very short-sighted of you. I've watched a lot of both players here in Sweden and they are very different in their playing style. As stated earlier, Raymond is more of a slippery, agile, winger that is really noticeable when he has a good game - but he can also disappear when the deke isn't working as well. Holtz play a no bull**** kind of game which I believe will translate better to the senior level as he rarely has an off night. Both players are really exciting to watch though and the 2020 draft class is shaping up to be great for us. Theodor Niederbach has perhaps the most untapped potential and he isn't even in this tournament.

In my opinion Raymond should go to the CHL and play. I just feel like his game would develop more there than over in the SHL. Pretty controversial coming from a Swede I guess.

That's interesting, considering the comments about his game above.
If he's sometimes too reliant on his individual puck skills and could learn to find more ways to be effective when time and space are limited, shouldn't the SHL(or any men's league) be precisely what he needs in this case rather than juniors?

 

[VictorLustig]

High end Swedish prospects should take the Elias Pettersson/William Nylander route if possible. J20 at 16 -> Allsvenskan in their draft year -> SHL. So many players lose their creative side when taking the step from J20 straight to the SHL. Hopefully Holtz and Raymond are up for the challenge.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Raymond scored 2 nice ones today.. 1 shorty.. Looked good again

 

[TheWhiskeyThief]

High end Swedish prospects should take the Elias Pettersson/William Nylander route if possible. J20 at 16 -> Allsvenskan in their draft year -> SHL. So many players lose their creative side when taking the step from J20 straight to the SHL. Hopefully Holtz and Raymond are up for the challenge.

Did those SHL/Allsvenskan loan rules happen?

It will be interesting to see if Raymond gets a game or 2 in the CHL. Wouldn’t be unreasonable to see him dress against Vienna or Aalborg.

 

[Frk It]

 

[VictorLustig]

Did those SHL/Allsvenskan loan rules happen?

It will be interesting to see if Raymond gets a game or 2 in the CHL. Wouldn’t be unreasonable to see him dress against Vienna or Aalborg.

Raymond won't get loaned to Allsvenskan for more than a few games. School gets in the way.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I don't know if he's the best prospect at the Hlinka, but I don't think any prospect has played better at this tournament so far.

 

[Hfbsux]

Clutch play on the gwg for Sweden at :44 of the 3rd. Sweden won 2-1 against Russia, they're now heading for gold. Broberg and Raymond were absolute studs in this game.

 

[AirJordan]

Studs in this game hf tends to massiv overrating their shiny new toys. Sweden generated maybe a handful dangerous opportunities. Two periods they were completly outplayed. Raymond in gerenell had 2, 3 strong playes, outside of that i did not even notice him. No clue what game you saw...

 

[Hfbsux]

Studs in this game hf tends to massiv overrating their shiny new toys. Sweden generated maybe a handful dangerous opportunities. Two periods they were completly outplayed. Raymond in gerenell had 2, 3 strong playes, outside of that i did not even notice him. No clue what game you saw...

Raymond was all over the ice, making good plays defensively and offensively, using his blazing speed. Pretty hard to miss.. It was a good competitive game. Both team played their system well so the chances were limited. The number of opportunities is a factor but I put even more stock into how a prospect perform overall in those tight game. Also, most of Sweden opportunities had Raymond involved in them.

I could have said the same for Podkolzin who had a really good game, really strong on the puck.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Raymond has been the best player at this tournament.

 

[DDRhockey]

Studs in this game hf tends to massiv overrating their shiny new toys. Sweden generated maybe a handful dangerous opportunities. Two periods they were completly outplayed. Raymond in gerenell had 2, 3 strong playes, outside of that i did not even notice him. No clue what game you saw...

Atleast we dont cheat our way to the final like canada

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Atleast we dont cheat our way to the final like canada

So now Canada cheated. ok

 

[JAS 39 Gripen]

So now Canada cheated. ok

Wrong thread, bad series-picker

 

[Iceman]

So now Canada cheated. ok

Ask Robin Lehner.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Of the five games Sweden played, Raymond had to have been the best player on the ice 3 or 4 of them.

 

[VictorLustig]

Pretty easily the best Swedish player IMO. One of the best in the tournament as an underager. Should tear up the Hlinka next year.