Speculation: Rumour, Trade, and Free Agent Speculation 2018-19 - Part XI

[YWGinYYZ]

Continued from: Speculation: - Rumour, Trade, and Free Agent Speculation 2018-19 - Part X

Very low IMO. I haven't ever stated that they would have had that in mind at the time. They couldn't have known months earlier. He .... and Sundin too, only illustrate that high quality prospects are still available at that point in the draft.

OK, yes in that sense situation matters. The Jets situation at the time made it an option for them. Panarin might be too. Room could be made for him. But whats the point? He isn't a need.

Yes the pick is in that 50/50 range. So are rental players. Brassard, Duchene, Dzingel, etc, etc. The list of disappointing rentals is long. 50/50 might be optimistic. Stastny worked out well. Hayes is OK so far, but most of his points have come in just 3 of his 14 games, so I'm reserving Judgement. But I'm optimistic that he will be a success.

Edit: Missed your last para. I don't think that is true at all. I know it certainly isn't in my own case. I've stated several times that the low probability of a hit makes it all the more important to hang onto them because you need more chances.

We too often forget about the additional pieces too. Lemmy was a high(ish) pick and has already proven out. He might be worth more than that late first.

They are, but they are very uncommon, as illustrated by the draft pick value analyses above.

After catching up on this thread I see how you have spent your day Mort . As mentioned earlier we can agree to disagree on this one and we pretty much have run through our arguments a dozen times over by now. So I'm ready call it a day on this one. We can pick it up again next TD when I'm arguing that Chevy needs to all he can and be even more aggressive to help us repeat as cup champs , and you will argue that now it is vital to conserve assets to ensure we contend for as many cups as possible down the line. Anyways no matter how contested the debate is, I always appreciate how respectful you remain to everyone you engage with.

Ok Mort thanks for slowing the pitch down for the old guy because I can quote this one.

I have generally been more skeptical of the rental game as far as asset usage for all the reasons listed by the posters who don’t like it. That being said there are very smart posters who are rental Hawks so I am very bipolar on the topic.

My hopes are that Chevy pulls a Sakic level Hail Mary miracle out for flashy show pony cancer boy like Dutch who is at best level with Trouba value wise long term IMO.

While it would have been nice to have both, did we really end up with a worse C prospect in Gustafson? Very different players but David has performed well at a men's level and has performed similiarly to Veleno in equiviliant age international play (not the be all end all).

I personally have been less than impressed with what i have seen from Veleno in international play. He spends too much time on the perimiter. He is having a big season but this is his fourth QMJHL year.

I don't particularly like rentals but I think we had a solid draft last year even taking into account we didn't have a first.

I wasn't as big of a fan of making the Hayes move this year but if we can convince him to resign it won't be too bad.

I liked the Stastny move last year at the deadline and we got robbed out of a trip to the final by being to spent after our Nashville series. 3 rounds deep was an amazing ride last year and I would love to get to final against either Montreal or Toronto this year.

I missed having a 1st round pick at the draft in 2018. Veleno would have been a good prospect for the cupboard..... A potential 2nd line centre behind Schief.

This year I was hoping that Chevy would stand pat...... and not trade out 1st. I liked the D men pick ups @ the deadline and even Heinrichs for a 7th. I hope Heinrichs does not play more than 1 game in the 4 rounds that we play in the playoffs this year.

I did not want to trade our first this year 2019 as I was planning on going to the draft again ( this year in Vancouver)..... I am not going now as we do not have a 1st pick anymore.

I have enjoyed Hayes play for the Jets so far and I think he can be a difference maker for us in the playoffs this year.

I do not want to trade our 2020 1st ...... next year.

It is suppose to be a strong draft and I do not want to go 3 years without a first round pick.

Click to read more...

 

[DEANYOUNGBLOOD17]

I was at 2016 draft when we drafted Laine and Stanley in 1st round.
I was going to this years draft in Vancouver until we traded our 1st.
I have family in Vancouver and some behind the scenes access... to enjoy the event even more.

The draft weekend is all about Friday night and round one.
There is a lot of Buzz on Fri. Night..... on Sat the arena is 60 % full and is harder to follow as all the picks are made quickly from the draft floor.

Speculation.... When does Winnipeg get awarded to host the N.H.L. entry draft. With the completion of T.N. square and new hotel nearing completion.

We have great weather in June and would be well set up for the event with the walkways connecting Arena/convention centre/hotels and nearby bars watering holes (Tavern/Moxies/The Met/E.Castle/ThePony/Brown social/Shannons/Earls/The Pint)

All these close bars would be a hit at the actual draft. A celebration of hockey street party flowing out of T.N square..... or from the forks.

Winnipeg (city) could finally put a positive spin throughout the N.H.L. for a change.

2020 draft site will be announced soon. Does T.N.S.E. really know how to keep a secret. Could it be Winnipeg?

I would think 2021 would be the earliest we could expect it. We could celebrate our 10th completed season since relocation. (11 th draft since relocation)
........ time flys when you are trying to win "The StanleyCup".

 

[nobody imp0rtant]

We have great weather in June and would be well set up for the event with the walkways connecting Arena/convention centre/hotels and nearby bars watering holes (Tavern/Moxies/The Met/E.Castle/ThePony/Brown social/Shannons/Earls/The Pint)

The Pint has closed. No loss, the food there was dreadful and the beer selection was pretty mainstream. Something else is moving in but can't remember what.

 

[ps241]

The Pint has closed. No loss, the food there was dreadful and the beer selection was pretty mainstream. Something else is moving in but can't remember what.

“Local”

Owned by the Fuller family (Joey, earls). Local is a brand cousin to Joey. Smart operators but a dodgy location choice IMHO. The lure of owning the land and building probably drew Jeff to this deal.

 

[Gm0ney]

“Local”

Owned by the Fuller family (Joey, earls). Local is a brand cousin to Joey. Smart operators but a dodgy location choice IMHO. The lure of owning the land and building probably drew Jeff to this deal.

The Pint was doing pretty well I thought. Reasonably steady-to-packed whenever I've been there.

 

[ps241]

The Pint was doing pretty well I thought. Reasonably steady-to-packed whenever I've been there.

I think things had changed. They overspent on real estate initially. Had a good run in the honeymoon stage but had lost volume and deep discounted a bit too much to chase $. I think on non event nights things dropped off allot and I heard they were pursuing the really young crowd late night which is a tough end of the business.

I heard they sold the property to recoup some money for shareholders.

Maybe they will pop up again in a better location, who knows?

 

[Gm0ney]

From our erstwhile boardmate Aavco (well, Dreger is the originator I suppose if you want to get technical):


Jets interested in Joakim Nygard. Another winger? Where does he fit? Free assets are free assets and I know nothing about the guy, but still doesn't seem like an area of need.

 

[GeorgeJETson]

From our erstwhile boardmate Aavco (well, Dreger is the originator I suppose if you want to get technical):


Jets interested in Joakim Nygard. Another winger? Where does he fit? Free assets are free assets and I know nothing about the guy, but still doesn't seem like an area of need.

The "Whilee" Plan, maybe?

 

[Heldig]

So this CONTENDER turns out are pretenders.

Who are the coaching candidates to replace Maurice this summer?

Which star forward(s) is most likely to be traded in the summer?

Who is the core going forward?

 

[kittiecarlyle]

From our erstwhile boardmate Aavco (well, Dreger is the originator I suppose if you want to get technical):


Jets interested in Joakim Nygard. Another winger? Where does he fit? Free assets are free assets and I know nothing about the guy, but still doesn't seem like an area of need.

Saw the segment last night and they just replayed on 1290. While they mentioned lots of teams interested I did not hear Winnipeg stated. They did say Ottawa and Calgary though.

 

[Trinity]

From our erstwhile boardmate Aavco (well, Dreger is the originator I suppose if you want to get technical):


Jets interested in Joakim Nygard. Another winger? Where does he fit? Free assets are free assets and I know nothing about the guy, but still doesn't seem like an area of need.

Maybe the interest in Nygard is so that we can trade one of our existing wingers for a D-man.

 

[Pensionsraddare]

From our erstwhile boardmate Aavco (well, Dreger is the originator I suppose if you want to get technical):


Jets interested in Joakim Nygard. Another winger? Where does he fit? Free assets are free assets and I know nothing about the guy, but still doesn't seem like an area of need.

This guy plays for my team in Sweden, Färjestad. He has McDavid speed on the ice and i'm not kidding. No one is even close to catch up with him. Great technique as well. Very fun player to watch. Only minus is that he isn't much of a finisher. Even if he has pretty good numbers he actually misses more open chances than most of the players. He creates so many open chances by his own because of his speed. Not sure if he will ever be the clinical finisher you could ask for, but if he does i am almost sure he will put up great numbers on the highest level.

 

[lanky]

Assumptions: Trouba is traded for futures. Myers and Chiarot get better money elsewhere. Erik Karlsson signs in San Jose.

Question: Tim Heed looks like an interesting option given that there are so few RD available on the open market. Would you be upset if he's the only vet brought in after Trouba, Myers and Chiarot leave?

Morrissey - Byfuglien
Kulikov - Niku
Samberg - Heed
Beaulieu - Poolman

Moose
Stanley - Kovacevic

Is that too much of a step back for the Jets? Do we need to trade futures in this scenario for more help?

 

[Jimmyjets]

Assumptions: Trouba is traded for futures. Myers and Chiarot get better money elsewhere. Erik Karlsson signs in San Jose.

Question: Tim Heed looks like an interesting option given that there are so few RD available on the open market. Would you be upset if he's the only vet brought in after Trouba, Myers and Chiarot leave?

Morrissey - Byfuglien
Kulikov - Niku
Samberg - Heed
Beaulieu - Poolman

Moose
Stanley - Kovacevic

Is that too much of a step back for the Jets? Do we need to trade futures in this scenario for more help?

I don't think that Heed is the answer. He's 28 years old and has played 65 NHL games. We also still have Morrow who can play both sides.

I'm a huge Samberg fan but he probably spends the early part of the year at least with the Moose. Niku will be a Jet full time and so will Poolman.

I agree with your assumptions on Trouba, Myers and Chiarot leaving but I don't think we bring anyone in and go:

Morrissey Buff
Beaulieu Niku
Kulikov Poolman
Morrow

Stanley/Samberg and Nogier/Kovacevic would be the injury replacements with the Moose.

I just don't know who the long term top pair RD will be once Buff moves on or starts to decline. Hopefully they're acquired in the Trouba trade. If not we need to seriously consider moving a forward for someone.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I don't think that Heed is the answer. He's 28 years old and has played 65 NHL games. We also still have Morrow who can play both sides.

I'm a huge Samberg fan but he probably spends the early part of the year at least with the Moose. Niku will be a Jet full time and so will Poolman.

I agree with your assumptions on Trouba, Myers and Chiarot leaving but I don't think we bring anyone in and go:

Morrissey Buff
Beaulieu Niku
Kulikov Poolman
Morrow

Stanley/Samberg and Nogier/Kovacevic would be the injury replacements with the Moose.

I just don't know who the long term top pair RD will be once Buff moves on or starts to decline. Hopefully they're acquired in the Trouba trade. If not we need to seriously consider moving a forward for someone.

I'd swap Boy-leeou and Kulikov, but either way that D corps gets a lottery ticket.

 

[Bob E]

Niku in top 4 next year could be disastrous. He would be playing 20+ mins mostly against the other teams 2nd line.

He has a lot of defensive development to do in order to play against top lines in the nhl. Against weaker teams, sure, but not against strong teams. Pairing him with Kulikov or Beaulieu wouldn’t help, as a top 4 answer. That could work as a bottom pairing though.

If the Jets move Trouba (which is likely), they will need to get a minute munching shut down dman to replace him.

Morrissey-X
Samberg-Buff
Beaulieu-Niku
Poolman

We will need to move a forward for a dman. Question is who, for whom?

 

[Whileee]

Niku in top 4 next year could be disastrous. He would be playing 20+ mins mostly against the other teams 2nd line.

He has a lot of defensive development to do in order to play against top lines in the nhl. Against weaker teams, sure, but not against strong teams. Pairing him with Kulikov or Beaulieu wouldn’t help, as a top 4 answer. That could work as a bottom pairing though.

If the Jets move Trouba (which is likely), they will need to get a minute munching shut down dman to replace him.

Morrissey-X
Samberg-Buff
Beaulieu-Niku
Poolman

We will need to move a forward for a dman. Question is who, for whom?

I think Niku would likely struggle defensively playing a lot against top opposition. If Trouba is gone, I think the Jets need to bring in another strong defensive defenseman that can play top-4 minutes. Stralman is a UFA that TB likely can't afford to re-sign, so he might be an interesting short-term option. Not sure about his injury situation though - he's missed over 30 games this season.

I think Samberg will quickly be better defensively (i.e. without the puck) than Niku, but I think he'll perhaps need half a season to get up to pro speed. If the Jets weren't in a contending window in a very competitive division then I think he would start next season in the NHL, but given their situation I think he will likely get some AHL seasoning before making the jump.

I think the Jets consider Poolman to be NHL-ready, so look for him to start next season on the Jets roster.

To be honest, I think the Jets might be better with Chiarot over Beaulieu in a bottom-pairing role. I just don't think Beaulieu brings enough focus to every shift.

Myers is a bit of a wild card. If the Jets trade Trouba, I wouldn't be surprised if the Jets re-sign Myers, though I think it would be highly risky and perhaps unwise. However, if we go strictly by the stats, it is interesting (and perhaps surprising) to note that other than the 2017/18 season when Myers was recovering from major off-season surgery, Myers has been a "plus" in adjusted expected goals plus-minus per 60 (xGPM_60) and in Corsi plus-minus per 60. This is based on Evolving Hockey's "Regularized Adjusted Plus Minus" methodology, which adjusts for game context and players on his team and the opponents. My main concern is that the Jets would have to overpay Myers as a pending UFA, considering his relative on-ice contribution.

 

[Bob E]

I think Chiarot might get overpaid as well. Maybe not as much as Myers, but more than he’s worth.

I agree Chiarot is more valuable than Beaulieu. If Chiarot can be signed for around $2 mill per, I would be ok with him coming back.

I think Samberg is nhl-ready, more so than Niku. Niku is more flashy with the puck, but I’m not sure how far that goes with Maurice if you can defend well.

I think we could see:

Morrissey-Myers
Samberg-Buff
Chiarot-Niku
Poolman

Buff will take the ‘kid’, Morrissey will be used to support and cover Myers, and Chiarot will support a developing Niku. Poolman jumps in for injury, or for Niku against ‘heavy’ teams. We see Stanley at some point next year as well if injuries happen on the left side.

I would swap Trouba for Myers in a nanosecond, but that’s likely not an option.

 

[lanky]

Stralman is a UFA that TB likely can't afford to re-sign, so he might be an interesting short-term option. Not sure about his injury situation though - he's missed over 30 games this season.

I'm not too familiar with Stralman or Heed, or GAR, but I checked the GAR chart for both guys and Heed looks like a stronger contributor. Stralman's age alone would make me cautious to hire him as a stop gap.

 

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

If we lose Trouba and don't add an impact defensemen our D is going to blow.

 

[GaryPoppins]

If we lose Trouba and don't add an impact defensemen our D is going to blow.

Spoiler... It already does.

 

[TheJadePipe]

Assumptions: Trouba is traded for futures. Myers and Chiarot get better money elsewhere. Erik Karlsson signs in San Jose.

Question: Tim Heed looks like an interesting option given that there are so few RD available on the open market. Would you be upset if he's the only vet brought in after Trouba, Myers and Chiarot leave?

Morrissey - Byfuglien
Kulikov - Niku
Samberg - Heed
Beaulieu - Poolman

Moose
Stanley - Kovacevic

Is that too much of a step back for the Jets? Do we need to trade futures in this scenario for more help?

Still hoping we just overpay Trouba

 

[Atoyot]

Assumptions: Trouba is traded for futures. Myers and Chiarot get better money elsewhere. Erik Karlsson signs in San Jose.

Question: Tim Heed looks like an interesting option given that there are so few RD available on the open market. Would you be upset if he's the only vet brought in after Trouba, Myers and Chiarot leave?

Morrissey - Byfuglien
Kulikov - Niku
Samberg - Heed
Beaulieu - Poolman

Moose
Stanley - Kovacevic

Is that too much of a step back for the Jets? Do we need to trade futures in this scenario for more help?

I like Tim Heed, but calling a guy with 65 career games a vet might be a stretch.

 

[lanky]

I like Tim Heed, but calling a guy with 65 career games a vet might be a stretch.

Meh. This is his tenth pro season.

 

[ratbid]

Hey Everyone, Vancouver fan coming with a quick question (I hate posting in the trade thread). What's Winnipeg's plan for Trouba?

Vancouver needs to chase high end RD and I thought Trouba would be a very good option. Vancouver also looks like they're swapping Management this off season and I'm assuming their first priority would be Defence. We could also pay Trouba the big money he'll be getting without gutting our team.

Is he on the outs in Winnipeg (seems that way based on comments above), what would he be worth in a trade (obviously a lot) and what is Winnipeg looking for?

Now I don't think Vancouver would be willing to move the 2019 1st (draft in Vancouver) and for sure not Boeser/Horvat/Petey/Hughes because the idea is the build around them. That does limit the quality assets we have to swap which I understand.

I think everything else (2019 picks other than first round, anything in 2020, every other prospect/roster player) would be available (eg. 2019 2nd 2020 1st + Juoloevi/Madden/Hutton/Stetcher or something like that?). Anything worthwhile there for Winnipeg?