Round 2, Vote 7 (HOH Top Centers)

[Hawkey Town 18]

Apologies for the delay in getting votes tallied. Was dealing with a family emergency yesterday. Hoping to have results out tonight, if not, tomorrow for sure. Hope everyone is having a happy holiday.

 

[MXD]

Apologies for the delay in getting votes tallied. Was dealing with a family emergency yesterday. Hoping to have results out tonight, if not, tomorrow for sure. Hope everyone is having a happy holiday.

No problem !

How many votes in ?

 

[Hardyvan123]

Question hardy -- do you use raw numbers to compare playoffs ? Because I never saw you favor the older player... And playoff scoring in Smith's era was extremely low, probably the lowest it would ever be.

I never compare raw numbers to raw number, not even for era, context is always very important to me and Hooley is a support type of player.


I have him higher than bobby but he will come up at the stage where the separation between him and say a guy like bobby will be not alot and comes down more to a matter of preference.

The 80's, when bobby played most of his hockey also weren't as difficult, in terms of competition as say the mid 90's.

No doubt Hooley's non NHL resume will be brought up but how impressive is it really as there is almost zero context for it.

He will be discussed when he comes up and no doubt most of his resume will be around quotes from the time period.

 

[Hardyvan123]

Apologies for the delay in getting votes tallied. Was dealing with a family emergency yesterday. Hoping to have results out tonight, if not, tomorrow for sure. Hope everyone is having a happy holiday.

No rush, hope all is well and an extended thanks from everyone here for your efforts.

Seasonings greeting to you and your family and to everyone here.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Apologies for the delay in getting votes tallied. Was dealing with a family emergency yesterday. Hoping to have results out tonight, if not, tomorrow for sure. Hope everyone is having a happy holiday.

On this of all days, I don't think anyone is going to be bothered by your putting family first.

 

[tony d]

Yeah, don't worry about being late on this vote. Release it when you can.

 

[Sentinel]

I rank Malkin a tad higher than Lindros. Geno has the potential to expand the gap if he has at least one more great performance (regular season, playoffs, or internationally).

 

[Hardyvan123]

I rank Malkin a tad higher than Lindros. Geno has the potential to expand the gap if he has at least one more great performance (regular season, playoffs, or internationally).

These 2 guys will be an interesting comp with Lindros being a greater regular season force and Malkin the better playoff guy.

Should be close between the 2 but Malkin will pull away in any future project we do.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

These 2 guys will be an interesting comp with Lindros being a greater regular season force and Malkin the better playoff guy.

Should be close between the 2 but Malkin will pull away in any future project we do.

Malkin's been a first team all-star 3 times. That's pretty good regular season stuff for a center.

 

[Appleyard]

These 2 guys will be an interesting comp with Lindros being a greater regular season force and Malkin the better playoff guy.

Should be close between the 2 but Malkin will pull away in any future project we do.

I understand why people would think that (and I agree that Malkin has a better playoff record.) But maybe it is not too big a gap in individual performance.

Lindros was 3rd amongst centres in playoff PPG in the 1990's after Gretzky and Lemieux, and 3rd amongst centres in playoff GPG as well.

Malkin in the 00's was 2nd in playoff PPG amongst centres (after Crosby) and 5th in playoff GPG amonst centres.

In this decade Malkin is 3rd amongst centres in playoff PPG and 10th in playoff GPG amongst centres (with more than 20 games played.)

So in their peak they had similar playoff credentials amongst their peers... but of course Malkins 08-09 playoffs put him a step ahead. (and his peak is already as long as Lindros's.)

Though Malkins 08-09 playoffs (36P 1.5PPG in a 5.48 GPG playoffs) matches up similarly to Lindros's 96-97 playoffs individually (26P at 1.38PPG in a 5.34 GPG playoffs) though Malkin still ofc gets the edge not only for more PPG but the Conn Smythe and cup.

 

[Hardyvan123]

I understand why people would think that (and I agree that Malkin has a better playoff record.) But maybe it is not too big a gap in individual performance.

Lindros was 3rd amongst centres in playoff PPG in the 1990's after Gretzky and Lemieux, and 3rd amongst centres in playoff GPG as well.

Lindros sample is exactly 50 games and Malkin does have that Conn Smythe, even if he had Sid as the top center on his team, it's hard to say with a straight face that Lindros was the 3rd best playoff center in the 90's isn't it?

Malkin can make the claim for top 3 much more than Eric can, sure Eric has more competion but he's not even in my top 5 playoff centers for the 90's.

http://www.hockey-reference.com/pla...val=&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&order_by=points

Malkin in the 00's was 2nd in playoff PPG amongst centres (after Crosby) and 5th in playoff GPG amonst centres.

In this decade Malkin is 3rd amongst centres in playoff PPG and 10th in playoff GPG amongst centres (with more than 20 games played.)

20 games played? Seriously?

So in their peak they had similar playoff credentials amongst their peers... but of course Malkins 08-09 playoffs put him a step ahead. (and his peak is already as long as Lindros's.)

Though Malkins 08-09 playoffs (36P 1.5PPG in a 5.48 GPG playoffs) matches up similarly to Lindros's 96-97 playoffs individually (26P at 1.38PPG in a 5.34 GPG playoffs) though Malkin still ofc gets the edge not only for more PPG but the Conn Smythe and cup.

Ya sure if one forgets about the impact of GP and takes it in the absolute best case context for Eric and worst light for Malkin.

I'll still take Malkin and his playoff resume over Eric's, so far.

 

[Appleyard]

Lindros sample is exactly 50 games and Malkin does have that Conn Smythe, even if he had Sid as the top center on his team, it's hard to say with a straight face that Lindros was the 3rd best playoff center in the 90's isn't it?

Malkin can make the claim for top 3 much more than Eric can, sure Eric has more competion but he's not even in my top 5 playoff centers for the 90's.

http://www.hockey-reference.com/pla...val=&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&order_by=points


20 games played? Seriously?




Ya sure if one forgets about the impact of GP and takes it in the absolute best case context for Eric and worst light for Malkin.

I'll still take Malkin and his playoff resume over Eric's, so far.

As I said... Malkin has a better resume, and should be considered the better player. I was merely stating that Lindros was no slouch in the playoffs himself... and in the games he did play produced at an impressive rate.

 

[ted2019]

I'm glad to se that 3 out of My top 4 made the next jump up ( Francis was 3rd on My list) I had.
1. Ullman
2. Cowley
3. Francis
4. Bentley

 

[Theokritos]

The other thing that doesnt make sense is what were these guys doing chewing tobacco in a full contact sport like hockey doing anyway? You get hit and swallow it, your throwing up right there on the ice.

When your playing hockey generally your mouth gets dry, you need liquids in the form of H20, and chewing tobacco would be about the worst thing you could be doing for that. Youd be leaking black juice like a Zombie. Theres some serious physical exertion going on along with full contact. So imagine your Nels Stewart parked out front like Espo taking repeated cross checks & shoves to the back. Well, if theres anything in your mouth TDMM very good chance yer gonna swaller. You swallow a chaw of Skoal or whatever, you'll be throwing up before it gets halfway down. I just dont know what to make of that whole story. Just strikes me as implausible. Not saying those guys & others back in the day didnt do it, and if they did might well have spit at goaltenders, opponents, accidental like on the Refs' CCM's in a faceoff. But.......... color me skeptical.

Late bump for an addition courtesy of Joe Pelletier:

 

[Killion]

^^^ Learn something new everyday. I had no idea about that.