MXD
Original #4
- Oct 27, 2005
- 50,815
- 16,549
2-way/defense rank?
Kurri
Joliat
Moore
?
Yep. Then MSL.
Nah, I'd have MSL lower than that. He's got speed and some willingness, but he's not particularly good defensively.
That sounds a lot like the guy you have as your lock #1 Denneny doesn't it?
Nah, I'd have MSL lower than that. He's got speed and some willingness, but he's not particularly good defensively.
Moore was 36th in my initial ranking. While my opinion of him has improved, his failure to do anything productive after age 30 still really bothers me.
Moore was 36th in my initial ranking. While my opinion of him has improved, his failure to do anything productive after age 30 still really bothers me. I'm rolling Denneny, Joliat, St. Louis as my first 3 for sure. Kurri and Hull belong next to me. Hull was a very one dimensional guy, don't get me wrong, but that was probably some of the most effective specialist work in hockey history. I don't have a huge problem with his lack of overall game based on how good he was at what he did. Moore probably fits in at 6 there. Not sure what the rest of my ballot has in store. Definitely not Busher Jackson.
I'm still amazed by St. Louis' 2003-04 when he was the league's plus-minus leader. Finishes 4 points out of a Selke nomination with the second-most 1st Place votes out of anybody (on a 5-3-1 ballot, he would have finished just behind 2nd place John Madden). It had nothing to do with defense though: his plus-minus was created by an abnormal amount of even-strength scoring from his line.
Check out some similar TGA/PPGA numbers from the surrounding years:
2001: 64/15 (-4)
2002: Injury
2003: 65/10 (+10)
2004: 65/14 (+35)
2006: 70/13 (-3)
Virtually nothing changed about his teams' defense with him on the ice from year to year. The difference between him being a barely-plus/barely-minus player and being a league leader and Selke vote-magnet was scoring a lot of points.
Then I hope you had Pavel Bure really low as well...
Bure led the league in goals 3 times (more peak seasons than Moore) and did so without a dynasty (I think that his 2001 season, scoring 59 goals without another player on his team getting 59 points, is one of the best ever from a pure offensive perspective). I had Bure over quite a few guys on the ballot in this round, including, I believe, the one dimensional scorer that I'm giving a vote to.
Bure led the league in goals 3 times (more peak seasons than Moore) and did so without a dynasty (I think that his 2001 season, scoring 59 goals without another player on his team getting 59 points, is one of the best ever from a pure offensive perspective). I had Bure over quite a few guys on the ballot in this round, including, I believe, the one dimensional scorer that I'm giving a vote to.
Only 17 votes in so far...going to PM some of the voters from previous rounds and see if we can get a few more
I gather that it could influence the results at the top (order and number...)
I had Bure over quite a few guys on the ballot in this round
So did I.
But guys, Bure didn't fight as well as Iginla...
Unsure about that, just better for the project if the same people are reading the discussion thread and voting each round.
I've had some medical issues but i should be back in the voting and discussion soon enough now.