Everyone on here has a direct ear to the GMs and can read their GM's mind. Its a pretty remarkable collection of insiders. I understand the offense that is taken with posts by other teams' fans, but am confused since they have the GM's ears, too. #confused.
Rumor: Rick Nash Mega Thread -- All Rumors/Proposals here
- Thread starter LEAFANFORLIFE23
- Start date
Anyone want to remind me the last time a top prospect was moved for a rental? Guys like Fabbro and Tolvanen aren't getting moved in a Nash deal.
LOUPREDSFAN
Registered User
We aren't going to trade a first for a an aging Nash that's a UFA at the conclusion of the season
Yes you are.
Off the top of my head, Angelo Esposito kind of fit that description when he was part of the Hossa deal. Nicolas Bergfors was also fairly highly touted when he was part of the Kovalchuk trade. Those trades were a long time ago and Kovalchuk and Hossa were both superior players at the time compared to Nash.
- Oct 3, 2013
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Someone will.We aren't going to trade a first for a an aging Nash that's a UFA at the conclusion of the season
LOUPREDSFAN
Registered User
- Oct 3, 2013
- 37,326
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Doesn’t matter who to me.
I could see Nashville doing it straight up, but I doubt the Rangers get Fabbro or Tolavanen back.
LOUPREDSFAN
Registered User
Well the deal is off unless you send us your coach too. Ours turns good dmen into hot garbage so I can only imagine what would happen to Emelin in our "system". I'm anxious to see if Anthony Deangelo's minus rating is going to surpass his jersey number over the rest of this season.
Also, those guys were traded 4 and 5 years after being drafted. Those teams had a much better idea of what the players upside was at that point.
KingWantsCup
#FightLikeHell
Gaustad for a 1st really changed everything. 1sts are where deals start for the top TDL rentals.
Erat had another 2 years on his contract, so it wasn't a rental.
The right hockey trade comes along and I am sure that Nashville would have Fabbro on the table. Just not for a rental.
Erat wasn’t quite a rental if I recall correctly as he had another year. I also recall at the time that some thought that Forsberg was heading into bust territory.
Armourboy
Hey! You suck!
The market has changed a whole lot since that deal was done. That trade was done in what 2010?
Nash might ultimately get a 1st, but the idea he draws a first and a top prospect is ludicrous. Rentals just don't bring that.
My bad. I need to check these things out better. The way it worked out I think they would have preferred he was.
I think Nash gets severely underrated by a lot of people because his shooting percentage has been low 2 of the last 3 years and because he adds value differently than a typical offensive star.
He's 21st in the NHL in shots on goal this year, behind only Burns, Ovechkin, Tarasenko, Seguin, Kane, Kane, Kucherov, Kessel, Eichel, Trocheck, Skinner, Pacioretty, Hall, Jones, Gallagher, Marchessault, Tavares, Bergeron, Josi, and Hoffman. That's a really good list of players. His goal scoring is lower because he's only scoring on 9% of his shots this year, which is the 2nd worst in his career and well below his 12% career average. But shooting percentage is a notoriously fickle stat that tends to mean revert, so it's very likely the low shooting percentage is just a fluke. At his typical shooting percentage, he'd be on pace for 31 goals this year, which I think is a more accurate reflection of what someone acquiring him should expect from him and makes him a very valuable player.
The 2nd thing to understand is that Nash gets a limited amount of power play time and scores almost all his goals at even strength. That would make him especially valuable to a team with a good power play like Pittsburgh, Tampa Bay, Winnipeg, San Jose, or Nashville, for example, because it means that more of his scoring will be legitimately additive or incremental, instead of coming at the expense of a player who is already productive on the power play (which is one reason why Shattenkirk wasn't a great fit in Washington).
In addition to that, he's great defensively, has playoff experience, and is a good locker room presence.
If I were Nashville, I wouldn't give up Tolvanen either, but I think concluding that he's not worth at least a late 1st round pick+ would be a mistake for a team that has a legitimate shot at the cup and could use another forward.
He's 21st in the NHL in shots on goal this year, behind only Burns, Ovechkin, Tarasenko, Seguin, Kane, Kane, Kucherov, Kessel, Eichel, Trocheck, Skinner, Pacioretty, Hall, Jones, Gallagher, Marchessault, Tavares, Bergeron, Josi, and Hoffman. That's a really good list of players. His goal scoring is lower because he's only scoring on 9% of his shots this year, which is the 2nd worst in his career and well below his 12% career average. But shooting percentage is a notoriously fickle stat that tends to mean revert, so it's very likely the low shooting percentage is just a fluke. At his typical shooting percentage, he'd be on pace for 31 goals this year, which I think is a more accurate reflection of what someone acquiring him should expect from him and makes him a very valuable player.
The 2nd thing to understand is that Nash gets a limited amount of power play time and scores almost all his goals at even strength. That would make him especially valuable to a team with a good power play like Pittsburgh, Tampa Bay, Winnipeg, San Jose, or Nashville, for example, because it means that more of his scoring will be legitimately additive or incremental, instead of coming at the expense of a player who is already productive on the power play (which is one reason why Shattenkirk wasn't a great fit in Washington).
In addition to that, he's great defensively, has playoff experience, and is a good locker room presence.
If I were Nashville, I wouldn't give up Tolvanen either, but I think concluding that he's not worth at least a late 1st round pick+ would be a mistake for a team that has a legitimate shot at the cup and could use another forward.
I think Poile would definitely trade away a first round pick for Nash. After the Turris deal, he specifically mentioned that it was important to keep his 1st in case he needed to make additions later. Nash is worth a first and maybe a little bit more, and I bet Poile would be willing to pay that. The problem is that the ask is more than that at the moment, so they're all playing the waiting game.
LOUPREDSFAN
Registered User
I appreciated your stance. From interviews that Poile has done, he's not looking at parting with a first for a rental. we've already dealt our 2nd rd pick. If we are going to trade a first itll be for someone with term like Hoffman or Pacicoretty or some other player with term. we have already dealt so many prospects that we really need the high picks. We got Tolvanen with our 30th overall pick, who says it wont be another prospect of that talent level. Nash would also be playing on the 3rd line with Nashville and isn't going to get that extra powerplay time. The Turris Line has been dynamite and the JOFA line is the JOFA line. I really do not see Poile making a trade for Nash
That's not true. There was some speculation as to if Washington thought that he may bust, but it was a widely panned move the minute it happened.
Armourboy
Hey! You suck!
Exactly.
I don't think the issue is the 1st, as you said he saved it for a reason. The problem is the little + that should be added.
I'd say Poile is more than willing to throw another pick in there ( like a 3rd or 4th) or a lower level prospect. However, as long as that little + is Fabbro or Tolvanen, he is going to be perfectly happy to sit there with his arms crossed.
I think that any team that trades a 2018 first for Rick Nash will regret it by the end of the playoffs as Nash is not a difference maker. Having said that, it wouldn't surprise me if a team gets desperate and does trade a 1st to the Rangers-who will jump for joy at the return.
Armourboy
Hey! You suck!
I disagree with you quite a bit on this. I think Nash is exactly who he wants, and I think he is more than willing to give up the first, he just isn't willing to give up much more than that first to get him.
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