Rank Kirby Dach in draft 2022

[PoutineSp00nZ]

It's a fair question.

If someone asks you if you'd rather have a hotdog, a sandwich, or a massage, do you interject "one of those is not a food!". No, you just pick what you'd rather have.

Its not like that at all.

Its more like saying which would you rather have for dessert?

This delicious piece of cake . . . or this pile of flour, cocoa powder and sugar.

 

[ricky0034]

I think the real question on everyones mind is whether or not anyone would trade the 2037 1st overall for him

 

[GOALOFSSON]

I think the real question on everyones mind is whether or not anyone would trade the 2037 1st overall for him

Heard that is supposed to be a stronger draft class

 

[David Suzuki]

313th in xGF/60 among 552 forwards who played at least 200 mins at ES

Ignoring how silly expected goals are as a stat he isn't a goal scorer never has been and never will be so this is pretty meaningless.

 

[Xspyrit]

Ignoring how silly expected goals are as a stat he isn't a goal scorer never has been and never will be so this is pretty meaningless.

There’s nothing silly or meaningless here, you just have no idea what it means

It’s pretty clear when you say “he isn’t a goal scorer”, which has absolutely nothing to do with it

And if he is not a goal scorer ok, but what is he good at? Playmaking? Defense? Because him and the 2 superstars are getting owned in terms of scoring chances

 

[Colezuki]

There’s nothing silly or meaningless here, you just have no idea what it means

It’s pretty clear when you say “he isn’t a goal scorer”

And if he is not a goal scorer ok, but what is he good at? Playmaking? Defense? Because him and the 2 superstars are getting owned in terms of scoring chances

Do you know that expected goals favours pwf who score there goals in the key. And that players who score from the edges like caufield and Suzuki get ranked lower.

As an example, expected goals says Gallagher and is a better player then both. All I need to know about that stat is summarized right there.

It should be renamed scoring chances

 

[Aashir Mallik]

Top 10-15 at their position more or less. Suzuki could be anywhere from 5-15, Caufield anywhere from 5-10.

Suzuki is a top 5 Center….
Mcdavid, Draisaitl, Mackinnon, Crosby, Matthews, Thompson, Aho, Barzal, Zibanejad, Hughes, Barkov, Hischier and I could go on…

He’s around 15-25

Caufield a top 5-10 winger….he is listed as a right winger….
Kucherov, Rantanen, Pastrnak, Marner, Kaprizov, Kane, Nylander, ehlers, fiala, reinhart, Tkachuk, Meier, Stone, Svechnikov
he’s around 15-40

 

[Jack Spider]

It's a terrible poll. Good enough to shed light on habs haters though.

 

[Mrb1p]

Suzuki is a top 5 Center….
Mcdavid, Draisaitl, Mackinnon, Crosby, Matthews, Thompson, Aho, Barzal, Zibanejad, Hughes, Barkov, Hischier and I could go on…

He’s around 15-25

Caufield a top 5-10 winger….he is listed as a right winger….
Kucherov, Rantanen, Pastrnak, Marner, Kaprizov, Kane, Nylander, ehlers, fiala, reinhart, Tkachuk, Meier, Stone, Svechnikov
he’s around 15-40

I didn't say top 5, I excluded the top 5. All the bolded players (except Barzal) are right around point per game in this calender year...

As for Caufield, I'd have him 6th, maybe 7th depending on Kane on that list.
Cole Caufield is second in GPG behind Pastrnak in the calendar year, 4th with 40 in 72. Since Ducharme has been fired (7th of Febuary.), he is first.

By the way, you probably don't watch a lot of hockey to know this, but Kaprizov is a LW, Fiala currently plays LW, Tkachuk are both LWs and Meier is a LW.

Not far off, nice exercise I didn't even realize Caufield was the best goalscoring right winger since .

 

[Senor Catface]

I'm more curious how people would place him in the 1975 draft.

 

[Montreal Shadow]

McDavid, Crosby, Thompson, Hughes, Matthews and Mackinnon ? I guess 6-15, anywhere from there. Unless I missed someone head and shoulders better, I don't think so.

I think the league can sustain 15-25 superstars, mostly at F.

You can't possibly be serious. I can't stand delusional fans like this. As soon as we get a good player, they go absolutely insane with awful takes.

okay

Theres currently 9 players on pace for 50 goals.

Cole Caufield is one of them and he has the 3rd worst shooting percentage.

What is that if not for a star player ?

He actually needs to score 40-50 goals, not merely be on pace.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

Idk the 13th pick seems about right. He is a relatively average player at everything lol

 

[ole ole]

Suzuki is a top 5 Center….
Mcdavid, Draisaitl, Mackinnon, Crosby, Matthews, Thompson, Aho, Barzal, Zibanejad, Hughes, Barkov, Hischier and I could go on…

He’s around 15-25

Caufield a top 5-10 winger….he is listed as a right winger….
Kucherov, Rantanen, Pastrnak, Marner, Kaprizov, Kane, Nylander, ehlers, fiala, reinhart, Tkachuk, Meier, Stone, Svechnikov
he’s around 15-40

Not saying his a top 10 winger but in Caufield's defense this season he's sitting in the top 10 goal scorer all positions combine.
Only 3 RW have more goals than him and he sits 15th in points among RW.
That's a far cry from being as low as top 40.
Saying that Suzuki is around a top 15 C in the league is not a bad thing. It seems pretty accurate for now.
Sits 14th in goals and 17th in total pts

 

[ole ole]

You can't possibly be serious. I can't stand delusional fans like this. As soon as we get a good player, they go absolutely insane with awful takes.

He actually needs to score 40-50 goals, not merely be on pace.

I'm not one for using pace all the time but for argument sake lets just say he sits in 3rd spot among RW for goals so far this season.

Idk the 13th pick seems about right. He is a relatively average player at everything lol

Oh i have to strongly disagree, I have him at 12th

 

[Aashir Mallik]

I didn't say top 5, I excluded the top 5. All the bolded players (except Barzal) are right around point per game in this calender year...

As for Caufield, I'd have him 6th, maybe 7th depending on Kane on that list.
Cole Caufield is second in GPG behind Pastrnak in the calendar year, 4th with 40 in 72. Since Ducharme has been fired (7th of Febuary.), he is first.

By the way, you probably don't watch a lot of hockey to know this, but Kaprizov is a LW, Fiala currently plays LW, Tkachuk are both LWs and Meier is a LW.

Not far off, nice exercise I didn't even realize Caufield was the best goalscoring right winger since .

That is my fault I went on nhlratings website to see accumulates wingers list and mistaked it for just RW list

I don’t buy into the whole goals are better than assists debate, so I don’t see that raising his value personally

Going on hockey DB, hopefully I get this right this time lol, I’d say caufield is around 10-15

Kucherov
Pastrnak
Rantanen
Marner
Kane
Stone
Meier (Listed as RW on both nhl.com and hockeydb)
Nylander
Reinhart

Caufield/Zucarello/Bratt/Rust/wheeler fight out for the next couple spots.

 

[Mrb1p]

You can't possibly be serious. I can't stand delusional fans like this. As soon as we get a good player, they go absolutely insane with awful takes.

He actually needs to score 40-50 goals, not merely be on pace.

Hes scored 40 in hus last 70, its not even pace anymore.

That is my fault I went on nhlratings website to see accumulates wingers list and mistaked it for just RW list

I don’t buy into the whole goals are better than assists debate, so I don’t see that raising his value personally

Going on hockey DB, hopefully I get this right this time lol, I’d say caufield is around 10-15

Kucherov
Pastrnak
Rantanen
Marner
Kane
Stone
Meier (Listed as RW on both nhl.com and hockeydb)
Nylander
Reinhart

Caufield/Zucarello/Bratt/Rust/wheeler fight out for the next couple spot

So theres no way you actually think Reinhart, Meier, Zuccarello, Rust and Wheeler are actually better than Caufield, right?

 

[Aashir Mallik]

Hes scored 40 in hus last 70, its not even pace anymore.


So theres no way you actually think Reinhart, Meier, Zuccarello, Rust and Wheeler are actually better than Caufield, right?

Personally I have him 8 or 9, because going forward I think he’s better than rust and wheeler, but some also look at more than one year in which case rust and wheeler would be better because of them producing better in the past few years

Reinhart was a ppg last year. He has started slow but has picked it up, depending on how he finishes he could just caufield but currently I have him just below caufield, probably should’ve specified that

Zuccarello I have better because he’s outpacing him this year and he did it last year too, I understand he plays with Kaprizov, but his possession stats and production is too good to ignore

And Meier is just a better player

 

[Mickey Marner]

Connor Geekie is the closest comparable and he went 11th.

 

[Mrb1p]

Personally I have him 8 or 9, because going forward I think he’s better than rust and wheeler, but some also look at more than one year in which case rust and wheeler would be better because of them producing better in the past few years

Reinhart was a ppg last year. He has started slow but has picked it up, depending on how he finishes he could just caufield but currently I have him just below caufield, probably should’ve specified that

Zuccarello I have better because he’s outpacing him this year and he did it last year too, I understand he plays with Kaprizov, but his possession stats and production is too good to ignore

And Meier is just a better player

Since Ducharme left, Caufield is 40/62in 68 games.

In the same time frame:
Meier is (Who is currently playing left wing...) is 28/56 in 68 games.
Zuccarello is 23/71 in 65.
Rienhart is 26/58 in 65

I get you may be biased but this is quite the goalposts youre moving. Pick a narrative and stick to it, you can't just say X is better because hes pacing better and then say Y is better even though hes not producing as much and then Y.

Also its not unreasonable to think he's in the 8-9 range, which, by the way falls perfectly in the "5-10" range I gave you.

Looks like you agree with me and decided to pick a fight because he's a hab.

Connor Geekie is the closest comparable and he went 11th.

Production wise, sure.. But Dach was a much better player in juniors. The WHL is weak right now.

 

[Mickey Marner]

Production wise, sure.. But Dach was a much better player in juniors. The WHL is weak right now.

I agree Dach was better, but 2023 might be the greatest WHL draft class of all-time. Calling it weak is nonsense.

 

[Nikolajs Sillers]

How about Jagr?

 

[Xspyrit]

Do you know that expected goals favours pwf who score there goals in the key. And that players who score from the edges like caufield and Suzuki get ranked lower.

As an example, expected goals says Gallagher and is a better player then both. All I need to know about that stat is summarized right there.

It should be renamed scoring chances

I'm lost for words. I guess some people just can't read. You say something, they answer with something else, you reiterate and then they continue to argue...

I talked about xGF/60. If you don't know what it means, why don't you at least try to google it?

• xGF/60
  The amount of expected goals a team accumulates per-60 minutes of play.

Expected goals for or against (xGF or xGA): This stat is based on shot attempts that have been weighted for shot quality by factoring in things such as shot type, shot location, shot angle, and whether a shot was a rebound or rush shot. This does not tell if a shot actually resulted in a goal but rather the probability of scoring a goal based on the factors listed above. Expected goals models have been even better at predicting future performance than shot attempts alone.


In this case, we're looking at Kirby Dach so the stat I shared was how his team fares WHEN he is on the ice (at ES), nothing else.


And it doesn't need to "be renamed scoring chances", IT IS totally based on scoring chances already

 

[Xspyrit]

Not far off, nice exercise I didn't even realize Caufield was the best goalscoring right winger since .

WTF?

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You have 41,658 posts and talk about the Habs all the time but you don't know that Caufield has been playing on LW? On NHL.com, he's still among RWers in the stats section so you're basically telling us that you don't watch the games?

Top 10-15 at their position more or less. Suzuki could be anywhere from 5-15, Caufield anywhere from 5-10.

Since we can't look at the past to favorably rank Suzuki or Caufield, let's only look at this season :

14 RWs and 21 LWers currently have a better PPG than Caufield. Overall, 67 forwards currently have a better PPG (at least 10 GP, some guys like Ehlers have been injured for example)

In term of goals per game, it's much better since that his (only) elite skill. He's currently 11th among all forwards and Nichuskin only played 11 games so we could even say 10th, which is excellent but is it enough to call Caufield a top-5/10 winger?

Is Bo Horvat a top-5 forward in the league since he currently has the 4th best GPG in the league?

Suzuki 44th in PPG, 33rd GPG among all forwards. Among Centers only, 19th in PPG, 14th in GPG

Even for expected goals for, great that they have been opportunistic but not guaranteed it will last

Suzuki is 299th in xGF/60 among 358 forwards with at least 200 ES mins. Caufield is 268th

Where it goes bad for both is defensively, they are totally getting owned. 353th in xGA/60 for Suzuki, 356th for Caufield

I'd hold back a little bit before calling them SUPERSTARS

Not saying his a top 10 winger but in Caufield's defense this season he's sitting in the top 10 goal scorer all positions combine.
Only 3 RW have more goals than him and he sits 15th in points among RW.
That's a far cry from being as low as top 40.
Saying that Suzuki is around a top 15 C in the league is not a bad thing. It seems pretty accurate for now.
Sits 14th in goals and 17th in total pts

He's on LW (although he's more all over the place than anything)

NHL.com is pretty slow to change positions. Heck, Tim Stutzle is still a LW lol

Wait, are you not a Habs fan as well?

Production wise, sure.. But Dach was a much better player in juniors. The WHL is weak right now.

Do you ever stop spreading misinformation?

 

[DudeWhereIsMakar]

In my mock I had the Sabres taking Zegras and the Ducks taking Dach.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

In my mock I had the Sabres taking Zegras and the Ducks taking Dach.

I thought Zegras was going to LA King... and i was kinda hoping for cozens boldy or an outside shot at Turcotte (tho i thought hed be gone by 8 for sure)