Series Talk: Playoff Qualifier Series: Minnesota Wild vs Vancouver Canucks (VAN wins 3-1)

[2Pair]

Granlund didn't have trouble putting up numbers w/ Koivu and he's a bottom 6 center.

Zuccarello isn't being paid $6M to be the 3rd best player on his line.

When Granlund actually did anything in Minnesota Koivu had seasons of 45 and 58 points and Staal had 76 and 65.

 

[Spurgeon]

Koivu is now, he wasn't 3 years ago.

So find a way for Zuccarello to at least be the 2nd best player on a line.

How many points do you think Staal puts up playing with Greenway and Hartman?

How many forwards scored 60 points this season?

Zuccarello is more detrimental to Parise's game than Parise is to Zuccarello's game. Zuccarello is abysmal in his own zone. I think it's hypocritical to complain about Parise's contract and performance, but defend the $6M we're paying Zuccarello. Zuccarello should be expected to elevate his teammates, not be elevated by them.

I'm someone that thinks he should've been playing with Fiala and Staal too because we needed an offensive 5 v 5 group. However, he's someone that ultimately is going to be overpaid for the life of his contract, going to require us to protect him in the ED, and will block cheaper/younger players.

I'd much rather be paying $6M to Granlund this offseason instead of Zuccarello.

 

[16thOverallSaveUs]

It’s hard to say that MN delivered to Zuccarello. He played like the player we expected over a stretch where Staal was a ppg center. If he has a top 6 center, he will give 60 points. The issue is, we don’t have one for him to play with. I would’ve tried, Zucc-Staal-Fiala, personally.

 

[Spurgeon]

When Granlund actually did anything in Minnesota Koivu had seasons of 45 and 58 points and Staal had 76 and 65.

His "bad" seasons were better than Zucc's season.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Zuccarello is more detrimental to Parise's game than Parise is to Zuccarello's game. Zuccarello is abysmal in his own zone. I think it's hypocritical to complain about Parise's contract and performance, but defend the $6M we're paying Zuccarello. Zuccarello should be expected to elevate his teammates, not be elevated by them.

I'm someone that thinks he should've been playing with Fiala and Staal too because we needed an offensive 5 v 5 group. However, he's someone that ultimately is going to be overpaid for the life of his contract, going to require us to protect him in the ED, and will block cheaper/younger players.

I'd much rather be paying $6M to Granlund this offseason instead of Zuccarello.

He won't be overpaid if we can find a way to play him with good players.

Granlund and his fewer points in more minutes of ice time playing with Matt Duchene?

 

[fentonsbrainchild]

It’s hard to say that MN delivered to Zuccarello. He played like the player we expected over a stretch where Staal was a ppg center. If he has a top 6 center, he will give 60 points. The issue is, we don’t have one for him to play with. I would’ve tried, Zucc-Staal-Fiala, personally.

A lot of our issues would be solved in a world where Eric Staal isn't by far the best center and by a larger margin the best offensive center.

 

[2Pair]

Zuccarello is more detrimental to Parise's game than Parise is to Zuccarello's game. Zuccarello is abysmal in his own zone. I think it's hypocritical to complain about Parise's contract and performance, but defend the $6M we're paying Zuccarello. Zuccarello should be expected to elevate his teammates, not be elevated by them.

I'm someone that thinks he should've been playing with Fiala and Staal too because we needed an offensive 5 v 5 group. However, he's someone that ultimately is going to be overpaid for the life of his contract, going to require us to protect him in the ED, and will block cheaper/younger players.

I'd much rather be paying $6M to Granlund this offseason instead of Zuccarello.

You do understand that Zuccarello was much better than Parise was this year, correct? Parise is detrimental to anyone and everyone that he plays with.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

X - Staal - Fiala
Kaprizov - X - Zuccarello

If we can plug the X's with guys that reasonably belong there, it's a legit top 6.

Parise - Eriksson Ek - Kunin
Foligno - Sturm - Hartman

This is a legit bottom 6.

 

[Spurgeon]

He won't be overpaid if we can find a way to play him with good players.

Granlund and his fewer points in more minutes of ice time playing with Matt Duchene?

If we could have gotten Granlund at a discount because of his shitty performance in Nashville, I'd have been ecstatic.

You do understand that Zuccarello was much better than Parise was this year, correct? Parise is detrimental to anyone and everyone that he plays with.

By what metric?

 

[16thOverallSaveUs]

X - Staal - Fiala
Kaprizov - X - Zuccarello

If we can plug the X's with guys that reasonably belong there, it's a legit top 6.

Parise - Eriksson Ek - Kunin
Foligno - Sturm - Hartman

This is a legit bottom 6.

I think a lot depends on Kaprizov and the Quality of the Center addition this summer. If Fiala ends up being the only player that can drive a line really well, we might have a hard time competing with some of the teams in our Division that do have 2 “1st lines”

 

[Spurgeon]

X - Staal - Fiala
Kaprizov - X - Zuccarello

If we can plug the X's with guys that reasonably belong there, it's a legit top 6.

Parise - Eriksson Ek - Kunin
Foligno - Sturm - Hartman

This is a legit bottom 6.

Like the lineup. Wonder what we'll end up doing with Greenway and Donato this offseason.

 

[Webster]

Perhaps Zuccarello can return to the Stars. He had lots of success there, and became a fan favorite. Deal went down because of a 1st round pick the Stars would have to give up to the Rangers.

Maybe the Wild can retain some?

 

[2Pair]

If we could have gotten Granlund at a discount because of his shitty performance in Nashville, I'd have been ecstatic.



By what metric?

Pretty much Every metric outside of rebound goals on the PP

 

[Spurgeon]

Pretty much Every metric outside of rebound goals on the PP

Zuccarello is near the bottom of every possession and scoring chance metric at 5v5.

 

[16thOverallSaveUs]

Crazy to think that Fiala ended the year 14th on the team in TOI/GP and people still though BB was a good coach

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Zuccarello is near the bottom of every possession and scoring chance metric at 5v5.

And towards the top of the production metrics at 5v5.

 

[Spurgeon]

And towards the top of the production metrics at 5v5.

So is Galchenyuk and Foligno.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

So is Galchenyuk and Foligno.

And you say Zuccarello can't elevate his line mates...

 

[Spurgeon]

And you say Zuccarello can't elevate his line mates...

 

[Webster]

Zuccarello is near the bottom of every possession and scoring chance metric at 5v5.

It doesn't make sense to look at any Zuccarello stats this season, it's been a huge mess for him, and the management is certainly a guilty party here. But I'm 100% sure you'll see a very different player next season, if the Wild have figured out how to use him. Kaprizov will also be here, this should help.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

It doesn't make sense to look at any Zuccarello stats this season, it's been a huge mess for him, and the management is certainly a guilty party here. But I'm 100% sure you'll see a very different player next season, if the Wild have figured out how to use him. Kaprizov will also be here, this should help.

How much did Zuccarello play with Stepan in New York?

 

[Spurgeon]

It doesn't make sense to look at any Zuccarello stats this season, it's been a huge mess for him, and the management is certainly a guilty party here. But I'm 100% sure you'll see a very different player next season, if the Wild have figured out how to use him. Kaprizov will also be here, this should help.

I don't think Zucc was ever able to settle into a line. Similarly to Granlund, he may need to build that chemistry with his linemates to really start producing. Hopefully he finds a consistent line next year with a scorer like Kap that he can feed passes to. I just have not been impressed by his overall game and am hoping he's not going to be another of the Wild's failed 30+ winger signings.

 

[2Pair]

Zuccarello is near the bottom of every possession and scoring chance metric at 5v5.

using your own link-
Goals/60 Zuccarello = .79 Parise = .62
Assists/60 Zuccarello = 1.22 Parise = .96
Points/60 Zuccarello = 2.01 Parise = 1.58
Penalties drawn/60 Zuccarello = 1.08 Parise = .83
Giveaways/60 Zuccarello = .94 Parise = 1.51
Takeaways/60 Zuccarello = 2.09 Parise = .89

 

[Webster]

How much did Zuccarello play with Stepan in New York?

He played some games with him, but mostly with Brassard as his center. When Brass was traded Zibanejad became the new guy in the middle, had plenty of chemistry too.

 

[Spurgeon]

using your own link-
Goals/60 Zuccarello = .79 Parise = .62
Assists/60 Zuccarello = 1.22 Parise = .96
Points/60 Zuccarello = 2.01 Parise = 1.58
Penalties drawn/60 Zuccarello = 1.08 Parise = .83
Giveaways/60 Zuccarello = .94 Parise = 1.51
Takeaways/60 Zuccarello = 2.09 Parise = .89

Never said Parise was better in every category. His individual possession metrics are significantly better than the difference in production stats.

Also, giveaway/takeaways are largely regarded as an unreliable statistic.