Player Discussion: Nazem Kadri - January 2016

[BertCorbeau]

I'd have zero problem giving Kadri a 3-4 year extension. I don't think the Leafs would have an issue with that either. Maybe 5 years if the cap is right.

Babcock has liked Kadri and has played him a lot over the last few weeks. He's creating a lot of chances. He's played a far better 200 foot game. Better on faceoffs as well. All the little things people kept giving him crap for.

I don't disagree that this is a result business and so far and his offensive numbers haven't been good at all, but I think we can all agree that he's been very good despite that. I'd be pretty surprised if he doesn't get really hot soon and catches up to a solid stat line.

I'm not sure I'd extend him quite yet .. But he's doing everything asides from actually producing on the scoresheet right, so there'd be some consideration.

Worth noting that something different about this year is that with Kessel gone, Kadri faces tougher competition in terms of lines and d pairings he matches up with. I give him credit for being able to create chances and play at both ends of the rink.

But he still has to start producing a little more.

I'd look at a 2-3 year extension on around ~$4.5 right now. Gives him a shorter term to still earn a big pay day, and allows the Leafs to at the very least have another stop gap while Nylander/Marner and the other kids break into the NHL (I'm of the opinion that Bozak should be sold high this year if he keeps it up, but that's another topic) .. As those ELC's expire Kadri's salary could be moved off the books.

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[Optimist]

S% fluctuates randomly.

Turnovers require having the puck. He was great at gaining the zone tonight.

Until he shot the puck into the shin pads of the opposing defence. That's my point.

 

[Ovate]

Until he shot the puck into the shin pads of the opposing defence. That's my point.

And my point is it's better to have the puck and turn it over than never have the puck at all.

Look at the league leaders for turnovers. Top 5 is Subban, Doughty, Seabrook, Benn, and Burns.

 

[HellasLEAF]

Everyone is tradeable. Thats particularly why I love that Babs and Lou speak so high of him. Either they truely see something valueable and special in him and want him to be here long term, which I would love, or they know how to market him to other gm's and know what value to get back.

I trust our coaching and management fully, for the first time in a long time, so either decision they decide to make, I think they will be smart about it.

Well, they gave him a one year deal, put him top line and pp for pretty much the season to date, and have pumped his tires publicly at every opportunity.

Sounds to me like they are both developing him and upping his potential value as much as possible.

 

[mikebel111*]

Well, they gave him a one year deal, put him top line and pp for pretty much the season to date, and have pumped his tires publicly at every opportunity.

Sounds to me like they are both developing him and upping his potential value as much as possible.

I agree

 

[mikebel111*]

Looks like his "hot streak" is over. He's back to taking terrible shots and turning over the puck. Oh well. I guess it was fun while it lasted.

Nope nice try though

Hope he continue to live up to expectations!

 

[mikebel111*]

Until he shot the puck into the shin pads of the opposing defence. That's my point.

Yet had a lot of shots

You do know a SOG means it reached the net. Looks like Kadri of this season again. What a stud. Creating chances and taking quality shots(learn what that is).
Hope he continues to play solid hockey. His great play continues to last. Back to no turnovers and nice shots. Yup hope he continues this as you are angry by it

 

[mikebel111*]

Over dramatic last post intentionally but some times its required on few posters.....

 

[HockeyCA]

I'm just gonna say what a lot of other people are thinking.. Irrational. Some posters.

It's odd, that's all I'm gonna say. In regards to Kadris play, as I've said from the beg of this season I expected him to not fulfill the expectations of his most ardent supporters. I thought he wouldn't fulfill expectations because I just don't view him as that great of a player. He has his moments, but the consistency and nightly effort just isn't there. He will never be anything more than a decent supporting player on a losing team, IMO.

 

[johnny_rudeboy]

I'm just gonna say what a lot of other people are thinking.. Irrational. Some posters.

It's odd, that's all I'm gonna say. In regards to Kadris play, as I've said from the beg of this season I expected him to not fulfill the expectations of his most ardent supporters. I thought he wouldn't fulfill expectations because I just don't view him as that great of a player. He has his moments, but the consistency and nightly effort just isn't there. He will never be anything more than a decent supporting player on a losing team, IMO.

He is not given any rope to hang him self with and as long as the management keeps working with him and praising him he will continue to behave him self. I wonder what will happen when perhaps we have a young team with more players in need of special attention, can Kadri keep up his professionalism on his own or will he fall back to do what got him suspended last season?

But yes, he is progressing at least even do being 25 and a forward is not when you should be still seen as a work in progress. But that he got talent is not anything anyone can dispute. Nice hands and at times a nice shot.

Good news about him having 2 more RFA years. Would add a bit to his trade value, no?

 

[Gramsci]

The Leafs traded Alexander Steen when he was the same age as Kadri after he put up 4 points in 20 games.

 

[johnny_rudeboy]

The Leafs traded Alexander Steen when he was the same age as Kadri after he put up 4 points in 20 games.

Yeah, but Steen was put on the 4th line by Wilson because he simply did not like him.

 

[Koolboss]

He wasn't great last night, but he did gave Towes a hard time throughout the game. I see a bounce back tonight against the Bruins.

 

[Gramsci]

Yeah, but Steen was put on the 4th line by Wilson because he simply did not like him.

That's not true at all. He was averaging 15:37 per game and getting pp duties. That's 2nd/3rd line ice time.

 

[Gramsci]

Steen

21 yrs: 0.60 ppg (17.5 min/g)
22 yrs: 0.43 ppg (15.5 min/g)
23 yrs: 0.55 ppg (18 min/g)
24 yrs: 0.35 ppg (15.5 min/g ... traded after 20 games)
25 yrs: 0.69 ppg (16 min/g)


Kadri

20 yrs: 0.41 ppg (15.5 min/g)
21 yrs: 0.33 ppg (14 min/g)
22 yrs: 0.92 ppg (16 min/g)
23 yrs: 0.64 ppg (17.5 min/g)
24 yrs: 0.53 ppg (17.5 min/g)
25 yrs: 0.52 ppg (18 min/g)

 

[Gallagbi]

So what's the point with the Steen comparison? That we shouldn't trade Kadri for an awful return?

 

[Gramsci]

So what's the point with the Steen comparison? That we shouldn't trade Kadri for an awful return?

Patience.

 

[OvenMittz*]

So what's the point with the Steen comparison? That we shouldn't trade Kadri for an awful return?

Hell no, we learned from that .

A poster above made a good point though that I've always been wary about.
Will Kadri go back to his ways when the coaching staff pays less attention to him when the new rookies come into the Line up??

Will he degress once he gets his payout? Is he a type of player that needs to be coddled and always on watch by the coaching staff to keep him from slacking??

The past tells us that he is that type of player, but we still have to give him the benefit of the doubt and hope he's matured through this season..

Only time will tell and I'll at least give him the chance to prove that when it happens before I claim that's who he is.

 

[mikebel111*]

Hell no, we learned from that .

A poster above made a good point though that I've always been wary about.
Will Kadri go back to his ways when the coaching staff pays less attention to him when the new rookies come into the Line up??

Will he degress once he gets his payout? Is he a type of player that needs to be coddled and always on watch by the coaching staff to keep him from slacking??

The past tells us that he is that type of player, but we still have to give him the benefit of the doubt and hope he's matured through this season..

Only time will tell and I'll at least give him the chance to prove that when it happens before I claim that's who he is.

Kadri does at times need a kick in the butt to get him going. He was fine yesterday in terms of trying to get Teows off his game, but he and the team can be a lot better in their play.

Unless his play and production completely falls off a cliff, or Leafs get a good offer, I think he will be resigned but still lots of hockey to be played

 

[Hockey Talker29]

He is not given any rope to hang him self with and as long as the management keeps working with him and praising him he will continue to behave him self. I wonder what will happen when perhaps we have a young team with more players in need of special attention, can Kadri keep up his professionalism on his own or will he fall back to do what got him suspended last season?

I don't think Kadri will ever be in a situation that is as toxic as last year's Leafs team.

Carlyle's Leafs biggest issue was that there was no accountability on the roster. No matter what the first line did, it always got the most ES and PP time. It was never broken up for significant stretches.

David Clarkson was dressed every game, and regularly got PP time, despite being one of the worst players in the league.

Players like Jake Gardiner and Morgan Rielly were scratched for making bad plays that young defensemen make.

When the "1st line" is clearly not giving it 100% out there, and an AHL caliber player is getting PP time, how do you think it makes the other players on the team feel?

Kadri never cheats this team on the ice. He's not a great player. But he tries hard. He plays much more physical hockey than a guy his size probably should. The way I see it, he got fed up last year with the mechanics of the coaching staff, because they were inconsistent.

That's when Shanahan stepped in and set him straight. Shanahan also fired about 25 or so employees, including the whole coaching staff. Then he traded Phil Kessel, who was undoubtedly the biggest issue in the room.

I don't think for 1 second that if Naz starts goofing off, that he won't be healthy scratched or have his ice time cut. Same goes for JVR, and everyone else.

Kadri knows that hard work actually pays off with Babcock running things. You are rewarded for hard work. And you are punished for poor work ethic.

It sounds like common sense, but this is the biggest difference between how Carlyle's Leafs and Babcock's Leafs operate. You can probably count on one hand the number of times this year that the Leafs had mailed it in.

Last year, I'd probably have used all of my fingers and toes counting how many listless efforts this team put in.

My point is that I don't expect Naz's behavior to worsen, because Babcock has properly instituted accountability on this team. Kadri wants to play, and he knows working hard will let him play more. Simple. Just like it should be.

 

[HockeyCA]

I don't think Kadri will ever be in a situation that is as toxic as last year's Leafs team.

Carlyle's Leafs biggest issue was that there was no accountability on the roster. No matter what the first line did, it always got the most ES and PP time. It was never broken up for significant stretches.

David Clarkson was dressed every game, and regularly got PP time, despite being one of the worst players in the league.

Players like Jake Gardiner and Morgan Rielly were scratched for making bad plays that young defensemen make.

When the "1st line" is clearly not giving it 100% out there, and an AHL caliber player is getting PP time, how do you think it makes the other players on the team feel?

Kadri never cheats this team on the ice. He's not a great player. But he tries hard. He plays much more physical hockey than a guy his size probably should. The way I see it, he got fed up last year with the mechanics of the coaching staff, because they were inconsistent.

That's when Shanahan stepped in and set him straight. Shanahan also fired about 25 or so employees, including the whole coaching staff. Then he traded Phil Kessel, who was undoubtedly the biggest issue in the room.

I don't think for 1 second that if Naz starts goofing off, that he won't be healthy scratched or have his ice time cut. Same goes for JVR, and everyone else.

Kadri knows that hard work actually pays off with Babcock running things. You are rewarded for hard work. And you are punished for poor work ethic.

It sounds like common sense, but this is the biggest difference between how Carlyle's Leafs and Babcock's Leafs operate. You can probably count on one hand the number of times this year that the Leafs had mailed it in.

Last year, I'd probably have used all of my fingers and toes counting how many listless efforts this team put in.

My point is that I don't expect Naz's behavior to worsen, because Babcock has properly instituted accountability on this team. Kadri wants to play, and he knows working hard will let him play more. Simple. Just like it should be.

Sounds like just a bunch of excuses to justify his "me first" attitude, which has plagued him since he junior days. I think it would be wise to build around players where you don't have to make up such malarkey to begin with.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I don't think Kadri will ever be in a situation that is as toxic as last year's Leafs team.

Carlyle's Leafs biggest issue was that there was no accountability on the roster. No matter what the first line did, it always got the most ES and PP time. It was never broken up for significant stretches.

David Clarkson was dressed every game, and regularly got PP time, despite being one of the worst players in the league.

Players like Jake Gardiner and Morgan Rielly were scratched for making bad plays that young defensemen make.

When the "1st line" is clearly not giving it 100% out there, and an AHL caliber player is getting PP time, how do you think it makes the other players on the team feel?

Kadri never cheats this team on the ice. He's not a great player. But he tries hard. He plays much more physical hockey than a guy his size probably should. The way I see it, he got fed up last year with the mechanics of the coaching staff, because they were inconsistent.

That's when Shanahan stepped in and set him straight. Shanahan also fired about 25 or so employees, including the whole coaching staff. Then he traded Phil Kessel, who was undoubtedly the biggest issue in the room.

I don't think for 1 second that if Naz starts goofing off, that he won't be healthy scratched or have his ice time cut. Same goes for JVR, and everyone else.

Kadri knows that hard work actually pays off with Babcock running things. You are rewarded for hard work. And you are punished for poor work ethic.

It sounds like common sense, but this is the biggest difference between how Carlyle's Leafs and Babcock's Leafs operate. You can probably count on one hand the number of times this year that the Leafs had mailed it in.

Last year, I'd probably have used all of my fingers and toes counting how many listless efforts this team put in.

My point is that I don't expect Naz's behavior to worsen, because Babcock has properly instituted accountability on this team. Kadri wants to play, and he knows working hard will let him play more. Simple. Just like it should be.

Nice post! I just bolded a couple of parts I thought were particularly good but I agree with every word!

Sounds like just a bunch of excuses to justify his "me first" attitude, which has plagued him since he junior days. I think it would be wise to build around players where you don't have to make up such malarkey to begin with.

Sounds like you just don't like Kadri. When all else fails, fall back on the "attitude argument".

 

[OvenMittz*]

I don't think Kadri will ever be in a situation that is as toxic as last year's Leafs team.

Carlyle's Leafs biggest issue was that there was no accountability on the roster. No matter what the first line did, it always got the most ES and PP time. It was never broken up for significant stretches.

David Clarkson was dressed every game, and regularly got PP time, despite being one of the worst players in the league.

Players like Jake Gardiner and Morgan Rielly were scratched for making bad plays that young defensemen make.

When the "1st line" is clearly not giving it 100% out there, and an AHL caliber player is getting PP time, how do you think it makes the other players on the team feel?

Kadri never cheats this team on the ice. He's not a great player. But he tries hard. He plays much more physical hockey than a guy his size probably should. The way I see it, he got fed up last year with the mechanics of the coaching staff, because they were inconsistent.

That's when Shanahan stepped in and set him straight. Shanahan also fired about 25 or so employees, including the whole coaching staff. Then he traded Phil Kessel, who was undoubtedly the biggest issue in the room.

I don't think for 1 second that if Naz starts goofing off, that he won't be healthy scratched or have his ice time cut. Same goes for JVR, and everyone else.

Kadri knows that hard work actually pays off with Babcock running things. You are rewarded for hard work. And you are punished for poor work ethic.

It sounds like common sense, but this is the biggest difference between how Carlyle's Leafs and Babcock's Leafs operate. You can probably count on one hand the number of times this year that the Leafs had mailed it in.

Last year, I'd probably have used all of my fingers and toes counting how many listless efforts this team put in.

My point is that I don't expect Naz's behavior to worsen, because Babcock has properly instituted accountability on this team. Kadri wants to play, and he knows working hard will let him play more. Simple. Just like it should be.

That's very true.. I don't know if I can completely put the blame on him for that because the management itself was a joke and I don't know what was said or happened behind closed doors to allow that to happen because at times he wasn't happy with it.. But at the end of the day he has to be at fault for that.

 

[johnny_rudeboy]

Sounds like just a bunch of excuses to justify his "me first" attitude, which has plagued him since he junior days. I think it would be wise to build around players where you don't have to make up such malarkey to begin with.

Excuses? Perhaps not. But explanations at least.

 

[Gallagbi]

Sounds like just a bunch of excuses to justify his "me first" attitude, which has plagued him since he junior days. I think it would be wise to build around players where you don't have to make up such malarkey to begin with.

There's a big difference between building with and building around. I haven't read many (id say any) people wanting to build around him.