Proposal: PIT-VGK

[Shaffer]

Pens trade Scott Wilson+2018 1st

Knights trades Erik Haula

Fair Value? Who adds? I’d bet Pens would need to add a little, but what?

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[Cunuck]

VGK adds.

 

[Shaffer]

VGK adds.

How much?

 

[PensandCaps]

Not trading a 1st for Haula...

 

[Cunuck]

How much?

To be honest I don't think the Pens send a 1st for a package centered around Haula. Much more likely that the pick is a 2nd.

 

[ViktorBaeArvidsson]

How is Haula worth a 1st? 3rd line centers = 1st or 2nd apparently...

 

[Soundgarden]

I don't think Vegas would have any interest in this one, Haula is one of our better forwards and Pittsburgh's 1st might as well be a high 2nd.

 

[BattleBorn]

Haula looks to be a future core player, I don't imagine he's going anywhere for anything anyone is willing to give up for him.

That said, I'd take a late 1st for him personally, and he's my favorite on the team.

 

[Shaffer]

How is Haula worth a 1st? 3rd line centers = 1st or 2nd apparently...

Haula has a great contract, fast, and can play two way which is exactly what Pittsburgh needs. A few years ago, the Pens trade their first for David Perron, who was a boardline second line winger with 2 yeas left. Centers are more valuable, especially younger and on good contracts. A 1st for Haula is reasonable.

 

[CupInSIX]

A non-lottery protected 1st? Vegas takes that and runs. Anything can happen and it's early in the season. Even a late 1st is too much to pass on.

 

[airbus220]

Vegas won't trade Haula this early. Vegas won't lose this asset if they keep him longer.
Also don't need Wilson on a 1-way contract. Wilson makes it even worse.

 

[Riptide]

Also don't need Wilson on a 1-way contract. Wilson makes it even worse.

Not sure how Wilson is seen as a negative asset.

 

[ViktorBaeArvidsson]

Haula has a great contract, fast, and can play two way which is exactly what Pittsburgh needs. A few years ago, the Pens trade their first for David Perron, who was a boardline second line winger with 2 yeas left. Centers are more valuable, especially younger and on good contracts. A 1st for Haula is reasonable.

I'm sorry but decent player is not worth a 1st. Maybe a 2nd if a team is desperate. Also, Vegas is succeeding and Haula is young, why would they trade him?

 

[rent free]

haula is a guy vegas would like to keep and build around. not all of their players are gonna be traded, only the pending ufa's

 

[Empoleon8771]

How is Haula worth a 1st? 3rd line centers = 1st or 2nd apparently...

It's not really much of a stretch. I compare Haula's value to Perron's value in 2014. Seems like an odd comparison, but many people here agreed that Perron in 2014 had equal value to Sutter in 2014, and Sutter in 2014 and Haula now are pretty comparable IMO. I think equating a 2nd line winger and a 3C in value is a fair estimate to make. I think a 1st for Haula is perfectly fine.

To the OP, I'd be happy to do this deal, but I think Vegas wouldn't do it right now. Wait until December or January and I think they'd do this, I think it's an excellent deal for both sides. The Penguins need a great 3C with a great contract more than they need a 1st, and Vegas needs 1st round picks more than they need a great 3C with a great contract.

Also don't need Wilson on a 1-way contract. Wilson makes it even worse.

To say Wilson is a negative asset is just nonsense.

 

[rent free]

a 1st for haula is a stretch for sure. his value is more of a 2nd.

 

[ViktorBaeArvidsson]

I'm sorry but if an owner gives up a 1st for Haula, that's a Forsberg type deal.

 

[Empoleon8771]

a 1st for haula is a stretch for sure. his value is more of a 2nd.

I really don't think it is, to be honest. I feel like people on this site overrate picks. When was the last time a cost controlled top-9 player (not limiting it to just centers) was only traded for a 2nd round pick? Using only 1sts, you have some comparables, like Perron in 2014.

I'm sorry but if an owner gives up a 1st for Haula, that's a Forsberg type deal.

It's really not, it's a perfectly good deal. How is that at all like a Forsberg type deal? Forsberg was a should be top-10 pick that was traded for a 31 year old winger. The Penguins 1st will likely be near the bottom and Haula is a 26 year old 3C.

Look at the Perron trade (the first one the Penguins made), was that a bad deal? Hell, you could even point to the first Perron trade to Edmonton as accurate value for Haula, that was a 2nd and Paajarvi (solid young player at the time).

 

[Riptide]

I'm sorry but decent player is not worth a 1st. Maybe a 2nd if a team is desperate. Also, Vegas is succeeding and Haula is young, why would they trade him?

If Pittsburgh is looking to get someone before the TD... they're going to have to pony up. Fair market price (whatever it actually is) isn't going to work - Pittsburgh will have to pay to get a deal done now before the TD or whenever it's convenient for LV. This is Pittsburgh trying to fill a need... not LV shopping someone.

 

[rent free]

I really don't think it is, to be honest. I feel like people on this site overrate picks. When was the last time a cost controlled top-9 player (not limiting it to just centers) was only traded for a 2nd round pick? Using only 1sts, you have some comparables, like Perron in 2014.

perron was a scoring winger, haula's a defensive center/ scoring winger > defensive center in today's nhl

 

[Empoleon8771]

perron was a scoring winger, haula's a defensive center/ scoring winger > defensive center in today's nhl

People at the time were saying Sutter and Perron were equal in value (Edmonton wanted Sutter straight up for Perron IIRC), which puts Sutter's value at a 1st. I think it's perfectly fair to say that Sutter in 2014 and Haula now are comparable players.

I'd not even remotely second guess giving up a 1st round pick for Haula. I'd do that trade in a second. I don't think it's an overpayment, and even if it was, who cares? It's not a significant overpayment and I'd rather have a good 3C for 3 years over getting good value in a trade. It's not like the Penguins are giving up Sprong for Haula.

 

[rent free]

People at the time were saying Sutter and Perron were equal in value (Edmonton wanted Sutter straight up for Perron IIRC), which puts Sutter's value at a 1st. I think it's perfectly fair to say that Sutter in 2014 and Haula now are comparable players.

just because edm wanted sutter, doesnt mean his value equals perron. they probably needed sutter at the time more than they needed perron which is why they'd want sutter for perron

 

[Riptide]

a 1st for haula is a stretch for sure. his value is more of a 2nd.

Even if this is true - and I do not believe that's the case... why is LV moving him for a 2nd+, especially what should be a pretty late 2nd? That would be something they'd do if they had or wanted to move him. But understandably that's probably not the case.... which means you have to pony up and convince them they should make the deal. Which means you're offering up a 1st+.

 

[Empoleon8771]

just because edm wanted sutter, doesnt mean his value equals perron. they probably needed sutter at the time more than they needed perron which is why they'd want sutter for perron

It's still not a stretch to say that a good defensive 3C is equal in value to a 2nd line winger. I really don't see why it's controversial to say that. I don't have a problem with giving up a 1st for a Haula caliber center even remotely, and even if it was an overpayment, who cares? The Penguins aren't giving up a NHL ready Sprong for a 3C, so why should I be concerned if the Penguins give up a 1st and Scott Wilson for Haula instead of a 2nd and Scott Wilson?

 

[rent free]

Even if this is true - and I do not believe that's the case... why is LV moving him for a 2nd+, especially what should be a pretty late 2nd? That would be something they'd do if they had or wanted to move him. But understandably that's probably not the case.... which means you have to pony up and convince them they should make the deal. Which means you're offering up a 1st+.

yah i can agree with this.