PHX: Mueller vs Hanzal

Discussion in 'NHL Draft - Prospects' started by Mr.Brownov*, May 2, 2007.

  1. Mr.Brownov*

    Mr.Brownov* Guest

    Who makes it out of camp next year as the more NHL ready prospect?
    What are the differences between the two?
    And which will be the more productive player throughout their NHL careers?

    Thank you
     
  2. LeafsrGods*

    LeafsrGods* Guest

    Hanzal, thats my opinion though.
    Hanzal plays on an average team, Mueller plays on a very strong team.
    I think Hanzal will be more productive throughtout career.
     
  3. PhoPhan

    PhoPhan Registered User

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    They're both good, but Mueller is a dramatically better player in nearly all facets. Mueller is basically a lock to make the team in the fall, whereas Hanzal will likely begin in the AHL. They're both dynamic playmakers, and while Hanzal's hockey sense is very good, Mueller's is outstanding.

    In their primes in the NHL, I see Mueller putting up 35 or 40 goals and 60 to 70 assists. Hanzal's top end is more along the lines of 30 goals and 40 assists - certainly not shabby, but not as good as Mueller.
     
  4. I'll be shocked if Mueller isn't in the NHL and Hanzal is.
     
  5. Mr.Brownov*

    Mr.Brownov* Guest

    Excellent! Thank you for the serious responses. If there's any WHL area fans here that have watched them throughout this past season, your info would be also greatly appreciated.
     
  6. Rabid Ranger

    Rabid Ranger 2 is better than one

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    So? Mueller almost made the Yotes out of training camp THIS YEAR and had a great all-around season. He's a much more well-rounded player than Hanzal and has a very pro-friendly feel for the game in all three zones, especially on the PP. I wouldn't be surprised if he's on one of the top two lines coming out of training camp this fall.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2007
  7. Mike8

    Mike8 Registered User

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    So just a notch below Crosby. Sounds realistic and conservative for Mueller.
     
  8. Stajan Fan

    Stajan Fan Registered User

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    That's probably why he said "in their primes". Crosby is 19 years old, not really in the prime of his career yet. ;)
     
  9. Mike8

    Mike8 Registered User

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    I'm not sure what Crosby's age has to do with anything. Predicting a good prospect to be a notch just below Crosby and in the Jagr/Hossa/Thornton scoring-range reeks of blind optimism.
     
  10. Wow, that's a bit high, IMO. I think he'll be a PPG'er, but I think 100+ points may be a little too much to ask. But you never know.
     
  11. PhoPhan

    PhoPhan Registered User

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    I didn'tmean for it to be conservative, but it's definitely not unrealistic.

    Optimistic? Sure, that's why I said he can get to it, and in his prime. These are not totals he'll put up next year, and not totals he'll ever approach necessarily. But he does have the potential. I didn't say he will put these numbers up, only that he could.

    Blind? No. Mueller is an extremely dynamic offensive player, putting up ridiculous numbers on a defensive-minded team. His hockey sense and creativity with the puck lend themselves to a productive professional career. My "blindness" is based on a myriad of scouting reports, game footage, and discussions with scouts. Whence comes yours?
     
  12. Buffalo87

    Buffalo87 thehosers dot com

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    To be fair you said you see him getting that, basically saying that you think that's the type of numbers he'll put up. While I don't think that's necesarily out of the question, I think he'll be closer to 85-90 points in his prime. Maybe 100 if put in the right situation and with Hanzal, Wheeler, Yandle, and maybe Lisin and Kaigorodov, that could be a possibility.
     
  13. LeafsrGods*

    LeafsrGods* Guest

    I also think a 100 points or more is asking a bit much out of him, he will be a fine ppg+ player, and there is a chance that he does score 100 points or more. In fact, i think the 2006 NHL entry draft from #1-#14 have a chance to score 100 points or more. Well, any prospects can score 100+ points or more, they just need to work hard thats all.
     
  14. PhoPhan

    PhoPhan Registered User

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    Do we really need to have this debate for the billionth time on these boards? No one here (that I know of, at least) has a crystal ball, so when someone makes a prediction, they're saying that they think something can happen, not that they know that it will.
     
  15. Buffalo87

    Buffalo87 thehosers dot com

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    Ok, and am I allowed to share my thoughts? You gave your opinion, I have a slightly different opinion so I shared mine.
     
  16. BuddehJuS

    BuddehJuS Registered User

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    I agree, I think Mueller will be a PPG player, if he we're ever to break a 100 points, he would have to be in a perfect situation. As a yote fan, would I love to see him break it? Sure, but I just don't see it happening. I think Hanzal will peak at 70.
     
  17. Riggins

    Riggins Registered User

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    You forgot homerism in your list of what you are basing it on.

    Mueller is a great prospect and I see him as a future PPG player. Sure Everett is a defensive team but it's not like they can't score and place no emphasis on offense, Hamill had 93 points.
     
  18. Fleury14

    Fleury14 Remember the Kipper

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    I think it's more likely that Mueller will be a Rolston-type player, as opposed to a 100-point producer.
     
  19. PhoPhan

    PhoPhan Registered User

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    This thread has been a primer on that which is always misconstrued at HF. In addition to my prediction being a top-end, everything-goes-right situation, it was entirely objective. If you care to do some research, you'll find that I was pimping Mueller long before the Coyotes drafted him, and that I had him in the top 5 of my draft rankings.

    In comparison to Hamill, not only did Mueller score at a better rate (78 points in 51 games, a 1.52 PPG clip compared to 93 points in 69 games, a 1.34 PPG clip), he was a noticeably better defensive player, inasmuch as he was a defensive player. Hamill is an offensive player on an otherwise defensive team, whereas Mueller is legitimate two-way threat.
     
  20. LeafsrGods*

    LeafsrGods* Guest


    Tell me the age difference, and the ice-time difference, and then we will talk:p:
     
  21. WADEugottaBELAKthat

    WADEugottaBELAKthat Flynt Flossy

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    Did I mention that..
    Technically Red Wings Fan there is no age difference. Get rid of the tunnel vision bud.

    Zach Hamill - 09/23/88

    Peter Mueller - 04/14/88

    The only reason they are in different draft years is because the draft is inbetween thier birthdays:teach:

    Both Hamill and Mueller were both drafted in the 2003 Bantam Draft.
     
  22. WADEugottaBELAKthat

    WADEugottaBELAKthat Flynt Flossy

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    Did I mention that..
    That's ambitious.... but if Muller ends up on a line with a top-notch scorer this is not overly ambitious.

    In five years Mueller might end up being the best forward out of last years' draft. There are few NHL'er NOW who can pass like that guy. He needs to get stronger legs though...he's a bit too slow right now.
     
  23. Mike8

    Mike8 Registered User

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    I don't think you're blind, and I do think you're a good poster, but I have a pet-peeve with the if-everything-goes-right discussion. I see no point in discussing if everything goes right, so-and-so's potential exceeds Crosby's!, or something along those lines. There's just not much point in them. Nothing ever goes absolutely right.

    When discussing potential, why not try to be realistic? It's understood that we'll make assumptions on the optimistic side (i.e. the player, first of all, makes the NHL; secondly, we assume no hindering injuries, few problems adjusting their game to the pros, etcetera.). Beyond this, I see no point in making optimistic assumptions. They are too far removed from reality to be worthwhile.

    Mueller's a good, dynamic offensive talent. But he's not a rare talent. I would wager most NHL clubs feel confident they have a talent in their prospect pool roughly equivalent to Mueller. So to claim Mueller, in his prime, can achieve a 110-120 point-level--which is something even Crosby (yes, I know he's 19) has trouble achieving; a level which the Thorntons, Jagrs of the league attain only rarely, and elite offensive talents such as Spezza, Heatley, Lecavalier, et al. have yet to ever achieve is, well, a little beyond optimistic and realistic. These elite talents were better players in their pre-NHL career than Mueller has been, and yet they have trouble surpassing the 100-point mark.

    For my own prediction: I would say Mueller more realistically will fall in the 65-80 point range in his prime, which--contrary to predictions on potential around here--is still very, very good, and worthy of being a good, but not spectacular first-line impact player.
     
  24. Devils Advocate

    Devils Advocate mmmmmm....Crow.

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    You might want to start your own message board where you can impose your beliefs on everyone so that they only respond in a manner acceptable by you.

    good luck with that.
     
  25. PhoPhan

    PhoPhan Registered User

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    Personally, I feel the "most likely" scenario is just as nebulous as the "best case" one, but I would argue that even if he doesn't max out his potential, he will still be a point per game player in all likelihood.

    While I agree Mueller isn't a "rare" talent in the vein of a Crosby or a Thornton, I would argue that most teams do not have a player like him in their respective prospect pools. Of forwards currently not in the NHL, I would put him in the top tier without question. He was arguably the best player in the CHL last year (or at least the WHL).
     

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