Post-Game Talk: Pens 5, Habs 3 - Oh, Oh, Oh Part Deux

[SUBdrewgANS]

So did Malkin touch that puck or what?

 

[Peat]

The problem just doesn't reside with Letang, but the totality of the pair. Dumo (I won't rant on about him anymore), is nothing better than a 3rd pairing D man to go along with Letang's 2nd pairing head. This is exasperated by Sully's penchant of sending them out as if they are always the proper pairing for ANY role or situation. The constant mistakes by these 2 (I'll give Dumo the benefit that most of his are made in the O-zone) leads to GA and little 5v5 offense. Letang's mistakes are everywhere and he's rarely in position to recover from them.

Letang is 5th in 5v5pts/60 among our D, 5th!
Dumo is 4th
Conclusion: they aren't scoring anywhere near a 1st pairing

They are 6th and 7th in 5v5 GF%. (44% and 40% ie negative)
Conclusion: they aren't even treading water in goal differential at 5v5

When your first pairing isn't at least playing the other team even at 5v5, that has to made up by the 2 other pairings. This can be done/negated by Maatta's line, but now we rely on Ruh's line to be the difference maker. Read that again if you think this team has a chance in the playoffs. Flip a coin.

Using full season stats after a ridiculously out of character start to the season as a predictor of play-off success is foolish.

Letang and Dumo have 54%+ for CF%, FF%, SF% and GF% since the start of the year, despite having a sub 1 PDO. I'd call that outplaying the other team at 5v5.

 

[Andy99]

So did Malkin touch that puck or what?

I’m not sure he did...he didn’t act like he did...but, more importantly, from the video I don’t see how they prove that he did, so I think the goal will stay with Hornqvist...

 

[Gold Diamond]

Letang is so noticeable out there, in both good and bad ways. When he's on, he's great and producing points. When he's off, he is terribad and should be benched.

It's frustrating.

 

[The Old Master]

I’m not sure he did...he didn’t act like he did...but, more importantly, from the video I don’t see how they prove that he did, so I think the goal will stay with Hornqvist...

horny can keep the goal ......I just want to give geno an assist..... more points

 

[SUBdrewgANS]

I’m not sure he did...he didn’t act like he did...but, more importantly, from the video I don’t see how they prove that he did, so I think the goal will stay with Hornqvist...

Horse Hockey!

 

[JimmyTwoTimes]

Letang is so noticeable out there, in both good and bad ways. When he's on, he's great and producing points. When he's off, he is terribad and should be benched.


It's frustrating.

Hes still producing at a high enough level offensively that we would get a solid return if we did trade him.

Cant see the team doing it tho.

 

[Andy99]

horny can keep the goal ......I just want to give geno an assist..... more points

If he didn’t deflect the puck for the goal, then he didn’t get an assist on that play. He didn’t tip it to Horny or pass it. The only possible way he could get a point on that play was if it was his stick that deflected the puck through Horny’s legs and into the net...

 

[The Old Master]

If he didn’t deflect the puck for the goal, then he didn’t get an assist on that play. He didn’t tip it to Horny or pass it. The only possible way he could get a point on that play was if it was his stick that deflected the puck through Horny’s legs and into the net...

if the puck hit genos stick at the same time as horny's or just a split second before and then goes off horny's stick they would have to give him an assist. no?

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

Not the best of start but a solid performance after the 0-2 start
Nice to see so many Pnes fans in attendance, was awesome

And someone needs to talk to Letang, really turns the puck over way too many times.
I'm seriously starting to think it's time for the Pens to consider moving him in the off season

 

[Andy99]

if the puck hit genos stick at the same time as horny's or just a split second before and then goes off horny's stick they would have to give him an assist. no?

I guess but it didn’t look like that even slowed down...it looked like the puck passed through Horny’s legs after hitting one stick and the only question was who’s stick....the way G reacted, it didn’t seem like he thought it hit his stick but who knows. I hope someone is giving it a good look..hopefully G gets a point in some way on that play....

It’s like the single bullet theory...where’s the grassy knoll...and Zapruder when you need him?

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

horny can keep the goal ......I just want to give geno an assist..... more points

I can't believe he actually tipped that one
Was sitting right behind Niemi last night and you see Horny going down and still getting his hands on it
What a warrior that guy is, all over in the offensive zone

 

[Andy99]

Ok, looking at video of that goal again...I think only one of two things happened re Malkin...1) he put his stick in front of Horny’s and actually deflected the puck in the air and into the goal...the puck didn’t touch Horny, or 2) his stick was too late when he put it in front and a split second earlier the puck had already deflected off of Horny’s stick.....
So I stand by my claim that he either got the goal or got no point....

 

[The Old Master]

Ok, looking at video of that goal again...I think only one of two things happened re Malkin...1) he put his stick in front of Horny’s and actually deflected the puck in the air and into the goal...the puck didn’t touch Horny, or 2) his stick was too late when he put it in front and a split second earlier the puck had already deflected off of Horny’s stick.....
So I stand by my claim that he either got the goal or got no point....

i'm not say'en he did or didn't....just pointing out a possibility.

 

[MrBurghundy]

Am I the only one that doesn't give a flying **** that Rust scored the EN? Good for him. Someone gave him the puck, he had a clear line of sight, he took the shot.

I have exactly ZERO issues with that and if Malkin is mad, well, didn't he say he doesn't watch the scoring race? Just play your game Geno, being mad about this sort of **** is beneath him. Rust just got back from a concussion in a trying season for him, good for him for scoring in that game.

 

[Nadal On Clay]

Ok, looking at video of that goal again...I think only one of two things happened re Malkin...1) he put his stick in front of Horny’s and actually deflected the puck in the air and into the goal...the puck didn’t touch Horny, or 2) his stick was too late when he put it in front and a split second earlier the puck had already deflected off of Horny’s stick.....
So I stand by my claim that he either got the goal or got no point....

And they’ll probably won’t change Horny’s 200th goal.

 

[AverageJoeFan]

Pretty sure we could take about every thread this year and point out Letang as an issue more often than not. He's been the king of turnovers for years. Nothing new. I think what is newish is that he hasn't been able to physically make up for some mistakes with his speed. I think physically he not as strong as he used to be either. In prior years he could simply skate out of a check. Now, sometimes he cannot. So I think he need to change his mode of thinking a bit and the team as a whole has to support their D a bit better. He just isn't quite the same player after all of these health issues, but still pretty amazing D man.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Pretty sure we could take about every thread this year and point out Letang as an issue more often than not. He's been the king of turnovers for years. Nothing new. I think what is newish is that he hasn't been able to physically make up for some mistakes with his speed. I think physically he not as strong as he used to be either. In prior years he could simply skate out of a check. Now, sometimes he cannot. So I think he need to change his mode of thinking a bit and the team as a whole has to support their D a bit better. He just isn't quite the same player after all of these health issues, but still pretty amazing D man.

Which is what some of us warned everyone about at the beginning of the year.

I think that this off-season is the "Sell-High" point on Letang.

 

[Shady Machine]

Am I the only one that doesn't give a flying **** that Rust scored the EN? Good for him. Someone gave him the puck, he had a clear line of sight, he took the shot.

I have exactly ZERO issues with that and if Malkin is mad, well, didn't he say he doesn't watch the scoring race? Just play your game Geno, being mad about this sort of **** is beneath him. Rust just got back from a concussion in a trying season for him, good for him for scoring in that game.

You seem to be making a lot of assumptions here. I doubt Geno was legitimately mad.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Using full season stats after a ridiculously out of character start to the season as a predictor of play-off success is foolish.

Letang and Dumo have 54%+ for CF%, FF%, SF% and GF% since the start of the year, despite having a sub 1 PDO. I'd call that outplaying the other team at 5v5.

The GF% is the really shocking stat here, to be honest. Letang has been bleeding goals against this year, so for him to have a positive GF% is actually absurd.

The defense needs to be revamped this summer, though. I don't think you'd find too many people that disagree with that. It's either a player issue or a coaching issue, but I want my middle pair to be playing more than what Maatta and Schultz are currently playing. It causes you to overuse your bottom pair or give Letang too ridiculous of minutes. It has been better recently with Schultz (over 20 minutes TOI/game over his last 20 or so games, he has played well over that stretch too), but it's still too low for Maatta. I fully believe you need to have all of your top-4 D playing over 20 minutes a night, if you have one guy who can't play that many minutes, you need to find someone who can. Maatta's TOI/game isn't far off from Hunwick's TOI/game, that's ridiculous.

 

[wgknestrick]

Using full season stats after a ridiculously out of character start to the season as a predictor of play-off success is foolish.

Letang and Dumo have 54%+ for CF%, FF%, SF% and GF% since the start of the year, despite having a sub 1 PDO. I'd call that outplaying the other team at 5v5.

Do you win by out shooting the other team now?

CF and FF% also mean jack shit with respect to defense because it assumes all players give up (and take) equal SH% shots. It's only half of the equation. A shot in the crease has 15% of being a goal vs a point shot that has 3%. Do we really think that Letang isn't giving up prime scoring shots against? He has the worst on ice SV% of any of our D, while also having one of the lowest on ice SH%. GF% is what matters because it #1, counts on the scoreboard and #2, accounts for both QTY and QLTY aspects of shots. The team is generating lots of low % shots when Letang is on ice vs few high % shots against. The high qty of low % shots for is not enough to outweigh the insanely high SH% of the shots against. The team shoots about 2% lower than average with him on the ice, and our goalies save about 2% fewer shots against. You have to generate A TON more shots for to overcome allowing just a few HDSCA. If Letang was outplaying the other team at 5v5, he wouldn't be such a terrible player at 5v5 GF%. Again, it means nothing if he's leading the league in CF% if he's one of the worst in GF%. GF% wins cups. CF% sometimes wins internet arguments.

 

[BHD]

We're straying from what happened during the game last night. Post to your hearts delight in the off-day thread.