PC Building Guide and Discussion #11 (everything is expensive...)

[Kestrel]

Yes, I installed Windows 10 Home on both the hard drive and the SSD. I got to Bios and switched the start up order so that it would boot the SSD first. I got to a black screen where it said I needed to have a proper boot device and I don't really know why. I'm not really too annoyed at this point so I just switched the order back.

Might be more than you feel like doing tonight, but I'd be tempted to unplug the hard drive, then install to the SSD, and see if I could get it to boot. If it works, then I would plug the hard drive back in.

 

[Sarcastic]

When you were picking the boot order, what is the name of the one that works?

Usually with 10 it's called simply "Windows boot loader" as opposed to the name of the HDD/SSD. And if you have two installs of windows there might be two of them.

I'll check on that in the afternoon. I do vaguely recall seeing them. Not too urgently wanting to make that change since things seem generally faster and my games have been moved to the SSD which should take care of the biggest stuff.

Might be more than you feel like doing tonight, but I'd be tempted to unplug the hard drive, then install to the SSD, and see if I could get it to boot. If it works, then I would plug the hard drive back in.

I know for sure it's installed properly on the SSD and I can get it to boot there. Just not sure why it's not going through properly but again, not too big of a deal at this point.

Thanks a lot @SniperHF, @Kestrel, and @flyingkiwi for your help and support the last couple weeks. I think we've cleared the majority of problems at least. Gonna restart with all the drivers and stuff installed and hopefully no more problems.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

Lets put you guys to the test because I have no f***ing clue how to fix this. Honestly, the PCI-E card may be the only way that it could work as it has nothing to do with the I/O portion on the back.

This started on Thursday, June 7th where I was starting to get half of my download speed on my desktop. Thought rebooting the router and the modem would fix it, but no. Even after everything I've done (listed below) I still have half download speed on my desktop, but my upload is normal. To preface, I have Windows 10 Pro, I didn't do any recent updates for my computer when this happens. I barely update and reset my computer as is, so updating wouldn't be the issue.

• Rebooted router and modem several times, including leaving them off of power for at least 5 minutes, half speed.
• Comcast came and checked all my connections and made sure everything was working as it should be. Hell, the guy gave me faster internet speed than before, half speed.
• Replaced the router with a faster and better one, half speed.
• Replaced the Ethernet cable going from my router to my desktop with a brand new one, half speed.
• Laptop using WiFi, direct LAN port and USB Gigabit adapter to both the modem and the router give me max speed.
• Phone/WiFi was giving full speed before and after the new router.
• Switched ports on both the old router and the new router with both the old and new Ethernet cables, half speed.
• USB Gigabit interface gives me half on my desktop but full on my laptop with connected through the router.
• Updated Windows fully to see if that was a reason, half speed.
• Ran the speed test with everything updated, but with all other programs off on my desktop, half speed.
• Tested it with the firewall off, half speed.
• Tried disabling IPv6 on my NIC card, half speed.
• NIC is running in Gigabit Full Duplex mode.
• Updated NIC drivers. Even uninstalled the drivers fully, then reinstalled them again. Half speed.
• Ran Malwarebytes and found nothing.
• I have a PCI-E Intel Gigabit NIC on the way and it will be here Tuesday so I will test that out but I'm not expecting it to be any better to be honest.
• The only thing I can think of that actually updated on Thursday was Steam and as I said before, I would get the same issue with it on and off.
• Did Speedtest on both Edge and Chrome.
• Tried the USB Gigabit adapter on a front USB port to see if getting away from the back I/O would work and nope, half speed.

So I am at the end of my rope for the most part. 300 Mbps is what I should be getting on this system but I'm generally getting between 130 and 150 on this desktop while everything wireless in my home gets close to or at 300 Mbps. The fact that the USB Gigabit device and on my onboard gigabit work the same way on my machine makes me think it's either something with my motherboard and its chipset, or it's something with Windows. Any and all advice would be greatly appreciated.

PS - My upload is about 11/12 Mbps on both this desktop with the issue and on my laptop/phone.

 

[SniperHF]

It seems to me that you have done just about everything to eliminate problems outside of your system.
I didn't see you mention if you tried the PC direct to the modem though?

About the only other thing I can think of you can try until you get your new NIC, is maybe run Wireshark and see if you can find an abnormal amount of errors like collisions, runts, giants, etc.

This started on Thursday, June 7th where I was starting to get half of my download speed on my desktop.

Are you sure it wasn't doing this before and you just didn't notice? I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have noticed

Ran the speed test with everything updated, but with all other programs off on my desktop, half speed.

speedtest.net?
Have you tried something else like a file transfer via the LAN?

 

[SniperHF]

Oh and one other random thought, if you manually force your desktop to run at 100mbps (full duplex) instead of gigabit, do you get all 100 mbps?

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

At 100 Mbps Full Duplex, I had 94.59 Mpbs down with speedtest. I just got 148 Mbps when I went back to gigabit full duplex. Like I said, even my phone's WiFi is doing 300 Mbps. I'm actually considering buying a WiFi USB adapter, but I may get the same shit since the USB Gigabit adapter is pulling those awful speeds.

I would have noticed considering how much shit I also download. I have not done the PC directly to the modem yet, no. I was thinking that if my laptop was pulling the same speeds via LAN from the modem and the router just the same, then I would have the same luck with my current PC.

Another thing I tested was to put the USB Gigabit adapter into a front USB I/O port since that is not connected to the back I/O port directly and got the same thing as well, half speed. I haven't done a speed test over LAN yet. I can hooked my laptop back up and copy something sizable over to it to make sure really gets a workout.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

I transferred a 9 gig file from my 1TB SSD on this desktop to my laptop via Ethernet and it was going at 106MB/s, which is 848 Mbps.

 

[SniperHF]

I transferred a 9 gig file from my 1TB SSD on this desktop to my laptop via Ethernet and it was going at 106MB/s, which is 848 Mbps.

Both wired I take it?

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

That is correct.

 

[SniperHF]

That is correct.

So 848 Mbps seems to me to be a pretty reasonable throughput on a gigabit connection. So if you're internet connection is 300mb, and you can get more speed than that on your LAN, I think that should rule out a problem with your system?

If you hadn't said it was working right before, I'd think you have a router throughput problem. Meaning the router's CPU can move packets quickly between the Wifi and the WAN port for some reason, but not the LAN and the WAN port. But you also replaced the router

Either way, time to try direct to the modem I think.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

I mean 300 Mbps, not 300 mb/s.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

This fixed it. Dear god this was dumb.

Windows 10 Internet Speed Half of what Windows 7 is on EXACT same Hardware - [Solved] - Networking

 

[Sarcastic]

Something vastly different from my previous stuff but a buddy was looking to get a new computer. He showed this one to me and it seems pretty decent for the cost.

https://m.bestbuy.ca/en-CA/product/...tx1050-windows-10-g11cd-bs51-gtx1050/10583705

I tried emulating the build and seeing if I could coax anymore value from roughly the same price but didn't really get much more value aside from adding 4GB more RAM but at the cost of Windows 10 and the optical drive. Would you guys recommend this as a pretty solid deal instead of going through the motions and making a build in this case?

 

[SniperHF]

I tried emulating the build and seeing if I could coax anymore value from roughly the same price but didn't really get much more value aside from adding 4GB more RAM but at the cost of Windows 10 and the optical drive. Would you guys recommend this as a pretty solid deal instead of going through the motions and making a build in this case?

It seems about in line with the prebuilts on Newegg price wise. The Extra 4GB goes a long way in some modern games which can press systems that only have 8GB.

I always go for a build if possible since the quality of the pieces inside it will be higher.
But in this price range just buying one is fine too.

One thing on the side of building it would be you can get the slightly newer and faster i3 8350 (the current equivalent thereabouts to the i5 7400, both are $214 on newegg) instead of the older 7xxx CPU. The practical speed difference between the two isn't massive but it is about 20%. Or you could drop down to the i3 8100 which is still about 8% faster but it's only $154

 

[Sarcastic]

It seems about in line with the prebuilts on Newegg price wise. The Extra 4GB goes a long way in some modern games which can press systems that only have 8GB.

I always go for a build if possible since the quality of the pieces inside it will be higher.
But in this price range just buying one is fine too.

One thing on the side of building it would be you can get the slightly newer and faster i3 8350 (the current equivalent thereabouts to the i5 7400, both are $214 on newegg) instead of the older 7xxx CPU. The practical speed difference between the two isn't massive but it is about 20%. Or you could drop down to the i3 8100 which is still about 8% faster but it's only $154

Yeah he's pretty unsure of doing a build for a first time. I even offered some of my stuff but I think he'd rather not go through those hoops. I don't disagree after what you guys have listened to me complain about.

ABS Versa Intel Core i3-8100 (3.60 GHz) 4-Core 8 GB DDR4 1 TB HDD NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050 2 GB Windows 10 Home 64-Bit Desktop PC ALI185 - Newegg.ca
https://m.bestbuy.ca/en-CA/product/...tx1050-windows-10-g11cd-bs51-gtx1050/10583705

Between the two though, I'm guessing the Bestbuy is better for the 4GB extra RAM if his intent is for gaming. I'm not totally sure I still follow what processing power would be best applied towards.

Inspiron 5680 VR Ready Gaming Desktop | Dell Canada

I'm not sure where these various parts fit on the spectrum but I'm thinking it's all relatively close. I'm not sure why the Dell website is $50 less than the other two though.

 

[flyingkiwi]

Got a $40 bid on my broken motherboard.

Probably should have taken the $50 offer but it could still go up.

 

[SniperHF]

Yeah he's pretty unsure of doing a build for a first time. I even offered some of my stuff but I think he'd rather not go through those hoops. I don't disagree after what you guys have listened to me complain about.

ABS Versa Intel Core i3-8100 (3.60 GHz) 4-Core 8 GB DDR4 1 TB HDD NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050 2 GB Windows 10 Home 64-Bit Desktop PC ALI185 - Newegg.ca
https://m.bestbuy.ca/en-CA/product/...tx1050-windows-10-g11cd-bs51-gtx1050/10583705

Between the two though, I'm guessing the Bestbuy is better for the 4GB extra RAM if his intent is for gaming. I'm not totally sure I still follow what processing power would be best applied towards.

Inspiron 5680 VR Ready Gaming Desktop | Dell Canada

I'm not sure where these various parts fit on the spectrum but I'm thinking it's all relatively close. I'm not sure why the Dell website is $50 less than the other two though.

Yes they are all very close.
The i3 8100 is very similar to the i5 7400. But it is faster by a little bit.

The GTX 1050 is very similar performance wise to your old GTX 760, so that might give you a little idea of how it will run things.


The Dell has the best price/performance situation and it has 2 free RAM slots for future upgrades. And given that it's a full $100 cheaper than the Asus, you could outright buy another 8GB RAM and have 16GB Total for the same price. And the Dell has the faster CPU.

I'm also assuming the shipping and such works out the same price wise, it may not.

I do not like the ABS system. It has 8 GB RAM which isn't a huge problem, but it only has 2 RAM slots so you can't upgrade the RAM easily.

 

[SeidoN]

2600k installed and running. time to bench

 

[SeidoN]

EDIT: Fixed

 

[SeidoN]

i5 2500k @4.2Ghz vs i7 2600k @4.2Ghz

1080p@144hz
RX480
8GB DDR3
All games on High Preset (except PUBG lul)

Synthetic benchmarks are pretty similar to ones I can find online so not much point posting tbh.

Battlefield 1
i5 Usage - 100% on all cores constantly
i5 Experience - Stuttering mess. Even when the fps is above 60 it doesnt feel smooth and it dips into the 40s alot
i7 Usage - 70-95% on all threads
i7 Experience - Absolutely night and day. Runs like butter, absolutely fantastic. 80-100fps on High preset and VERY few drops into the 70s

Rainbow Six: Siege
i5 Usage - 100% on all cores constantly
i5 Experience - Mostly fine. A bit stuttery during explosions but alright. Not expecting too much improvement
i7 Usage - 60-80% on all threads
i7 Experience - Oh shit I was very wrong. Game is MUCH smoother now. A smoothness I didnt realise was possible. Average fps is alot better to but the minimums are WAY better.

PUBG
i5 Usage - 70-100%. Really depends on whats happening
i5 Experience - Its PUBG. It doesnt feel great anyway. But its not TOO bad when running around, but I get seriously hard lags in close range firefights or in big cities like Yasnaya. Not sure how much the i7 will help since the game is kinda jank anyway.
i7 Usage - 25-55%
i7 Experience - Much less laggy in the big towns. Firefight feel decently smoother, rest is up to Bluehole to fix haha

Fortnite
i5 Usage - 80-100%
i5 Experience - the game is butter smooth and runs well anyway. So whatever.
i7 Usage - 40-60%
i7 Experience - Minimum frames are better, as are average. Hard to tell since it ran fine on both CPUs

Hitman
i5 Usage - 85-100%. Picked this game because some maps devour my 2500k.
i5 Experience - Can be very stuttery on some maps. Sapienza town and the market in Marakesh hit fps pretty hard
i7 Usage - 50-85%
i7 Experience - Still drops under 60fps in the really populated areas, but not as pronounced and alot more playable.

Original Sin 2 (Specifically inside Fort Joy and Driftwood)
i5 Usage - 100%
i5 Experience - Stutters when panning the camera in towns, and in fights with alot of fire surfaces
i7 Usage - 70-80%
i7 Experience - Stutters 90% gone

 

[Kestrel]

i5 2500k @4.2Ghz vs i7 2600k @4.2Ghz

1080p@144hz
RX480
8GB DDR3
All games on High Preset (except PUBG lul)

Synthetic benchmarks are pretty similar to ones I can find online so not much point posting tbh.

Battlefield 1
i5 Usage - 100% on all cores constantly
i5 Experience - Stuttering mess. Even when the fps is above 60 it doesnt feel smooth and it dips into the 40s alot
i7 Usage - 70-95% on all threads
i7 Experience - Absolutely night and day. Runs like butter, absolutely fantastic. 80-100fps on High preset and VERY few drops into the 70s

Rainbow Six: Siege
i5 Usage - 100% on all cores constantly
i5 Experience - Mostly fine. A bit stuttery during explosions but alright. Not expecting too much improvement
i7 Usage - 60-80% on all threads
i7 Experience - Oh **** I was very wrong. Game is MUCH smoother now. A smoothness I didnt realise was possible. Average fps is alot better to but the minimums are WAY better.

PUBG
i5 Usage - 70-100%. Really depends on whats happening
i5 Experience - Its PUBG. It doesnt feel great anyway. But its not TOO bad when running around, but I get seriously hard lags in close range firefights or in big cities like Yasnaya. Not sure how much the i7 will help since the game is kinda jank anyway.
i7 Usage - 25-55%
i7 Experience - Much less laggy in the big towns. Firefight feel decently smoother, rest is up to Bluehole to fix haha

Fortnite
i5 Usage - 80-100%
i5 Experience - the game is butter smooth and runs well anyway. So whatever.
i7 Usage - 40-60%
i7 Experience - Minimum frames are better, as are average. Hard to tell since it ran fine on both CPUs

Hitman
i5 Usage - 85-100%. Picked this game because some maps devour my 2500k.
i5 Experience - Can be very stuttery on some maps. Sapienza town and the market in Marakesh hit fps pretty hard
i7 Usage - 50-85%
i7 Experience - Still drops under 60fps in the really populated areas, but not as pronounced and alot more playable.

Original Sin 2 (Specifically inside Fort Joy and Driftwood)
i5 Usage - 100%
i5 Experience - Stutters when panning the camera in towns, and in fights with alot of fire surfaces
i7 Usage - 70-80%
i7 Experience - Stutters 90% gone

Sounds like it was a worthwhile upgrade!

 

[Commander Clueless]

For some reason I miss my old 2600K right now....

 

[Kestrel]

For some reason I miss my old 2600K right now....

I actually have pretty nostalgic feelings about my Q9550 running an HD 5870 - but I'm sure glad I don't have to use it anymore!

 

[SniperHF]

Q9550

I don't think your Q9550 could have come within a stone's throw of matching Kaby Lake CPUs though

I might have to grab a 3770k when their prices drop a bit.

 

[Kestrel]

I don't think your Q9550 could have come within a stone's throw of matching Kaby Lake CPUs though

I might have to grab a 3770k when their prices drop a bit.

I'm pretty sure I could have thrown it just as far But yes, the X38 platform is HORRIBLY old and it shows, while some of those old i7's can still crank out some decent performance.