PC Building Guide and Discussion #11 (everything is expensive...)

[Bocephus86]

Alright, so I've been going back and forth for months about whether to buy a new monitor or not (mostly restless my PC is done, basically - built it not even a year ago so I can't get away with replacing parts, yet...) and wanted some advice on a particular one I have my eye on.

I play mostly RPGs and Strategy/Sim games (Witcher 3/Fallout/Skyrim/Total war/Civ/Xcom etc) so I'm looking for something more immersive and vibrant, so I've settled on ISP (with advice from here).

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIACVB5CN6597

Price is reasonable, reviews are great. Couple of questions: Is it worth going to this "mid level" or should I save up and go to G-sync and/or 4k? 27 inch is about what I think I want (currently on a 23 inch), much bigger would overwhelm the desk and I only use it as a PC monitor so I'm always close to it.

Also, 2k: I have a GTX1060 6gig; will I be able to max out games with the 2k resolution? I've been on the step below that forever (1080? I think) and am maxing games now, running no more than 72/73 degrees F at the most demanding times (Witcher cut scenes, strangely enough). I have my eye on that new Wolfenstein game too, for my first FPS in forever.

Is the jump to 2k that "worth it" as well? I've never seen it in action (a 2k display).

In short: Convince me I'm not wasting 325 dollars haha. I can repurpose my old monitor for a triple display at my workstation so I've already convinced myself that's saving me 120 bucks...

 

[SniperHF]

I think you could handle a 1440p monitor.

I'd want a little more than a 1060 6GB but it's right on the level of being usable.

Spoiler: Benchmarks

So you'll be cruising right around 60FPS average in a few titles you play @ Max @ 1440P .
But much lower in Witcher 3 for example.

If you aren't married to "max" however, you can gain a lot of frames for not much IQ loss. Witcher 3 is a great example of this. Foilage Distance and Shadows @ high vs ultra is worth 10 fps on my system and I can't hardly tell the difference.

Now the only hiccup is you're looking at 60FPS NOW, which means going forward you'll start to have worse performance quick. A few settings tweaks can solve the problem, or simply dialing back AA a little. AA btw is less necessary as you up resolution.

So IMO, yeah you can hack 1440p. I'd rather have a 1070+, but you'll be okay for now. In a year you might want a new card though.

I run 2560x1080 which is in between 1080 and 1440 and I have some performance to spare on an RX 580, which is pretty close to a 1060.

 

[Bocephus86]

Awesome, thanks for the response! I think I'm going to do it. Plus it'll give me a reason to upgrade my machine again in a year or so (like you mentioned); "silver lining".

 

[Hammettf2b]

hey guys,

i have my OS on my ssd right now, but all my game platforms on my hdd, whenever i want to open Steam, i have to go to the actual steam file in the hdd. if i try and make a shortcut to steam on the desktop it transfers all kings of files onto the desktop. is there a way to have steam on the desktop without being on the actual ssd?

 

[SniperHF]

hey guys,

i have my OS on my ssd right now, but all my game platforms on my hdd, whenever i want to open Steam, i have to go to the actual steam file in the hdd. if i try and make a shortcut to steam on the desktop it transfers all kings of files onto the desktop. is there a way to have steam on the desktop without being on the actual ssd?

Sounds like you don't have a shortcut on your desktop, you have the actual steam exe file? Because if you run the steam exe without the rest of its files it will rebuild itself.

Have you tried pinning it to your taskbar instead?

 

[Hammettf2b]

Sounds like you don't have a shortcut on your desktop, you have the actual steam exe file? Because if you run the steam exe without the rest of its files it will rebuild itself.

Have you tried pinning it to your taskbar instead?

ahhhhh, that makes sense. Thank you!!!

 

[Individual 1]

I have been thinking about building my parents a pc for Christmas since their's is horrible, I am not sure how I should go about it. I would like to keep it under $450 Canadian.

I would need to buy a power supply, motherboard, ram, ssd, and a cpu. Would a low end Zen cpu be best?

I also thought of using my old components and using this as an opportunity to upgrade my system. I currently have an I5 4690k, it would save me from trying to sell my cpu motherboard and ram in the future.

I am not that up to date on the new Intel cpu line compared to like the ryzen 1600 and have heard it is hard to get at the moment. What are the differences between the I5 8600k and the Ryzen 1600/1600x? I have a Noctua NH-D15 cpu cooler would I need to buy something for it to fit on the ryzen/Z370 motherboards?

 

[SniperHF]

I would need to buy a power supply, motherboard, ram, ssd, and a cpu. Would a low end Zen cpu be best?

That sounds really tough on a $450 CA budget, what will the system be doing?

The Intel will be quite a bit more expensive than the Ryzen.

The 1600 comes with a halfway decent cooler so you won't need to worry about that if you get it.

I added a 1600/motherboard combo, a 240gb ssd, 8gb ddr4 to cart and came up around $600 CA.

Using the 4690k you already have would definitely save some money since the CPU is the most expensive item on your list. Maybe use some of the savings to buy a nice case.

I'm not as up on all the parts as I usually am right now. But the short version is:
1600 - 6 slower cores but 12 threads
8600k - 6 really powerful cores but only 6 threads
4690k - 4 pretty powerful cores but only 4 threads

It's hard to say which one would be better without knowing what the system is used for, but I suspect any of them would do the job. Both the 1600 and the 8600k come in theoretically around the same speed but if you're using software that likes more logical threads the 1600 will win out. Or of you're running something like a game the 6 faster cores will be better.

One other option is the Core i3-8350K. Even though it's an "i3" (these labels are almost meaningless now) it's a 4 core CPU which is comparable to but faster than your 4690k. Though it could be argued the R5 1600 is better but it's situational.

 

[Individual 1]

That sounds really tough on a $450 CA budget, what will the system be doing?

Basically just browsing the web, and minor photo editing. They currently have a computer that is useless with an Intel Atom, 4gb of Ram the start time is horrendous and my father is obsessed with AVG which really eats at the very limited resources. The $450 would be for buying them a new power supply, motherboard, ram, ssd, and a cpu.

If the route I take is giving them my motherboard ram, and cpu I am not sure of the budget. I would need to get myself a i5 8600k or 1600 with a mb/ram, along with a psu and ssd for the parents system. It would only be a 128gb ssd.

 

[SniperHF]

Basically just browsing the web, and minor photo editing. They currently have a computer that is useless with an Intel Atom, 4gb of Ram the start time is horrendous and my father is obsessed with AVG which really eats at the very limited resources. The $450 would be for buying them a new power supply, motherboard, ram, ssd, and a cpu.
.

I'd look lower end even. A G4560 pentium 2c/4t would do the job and it punches way above its weight as an $85 processor.

The $129 Ryzen 3 1300x is a step up on the pentium and is pretty close to your 4690k.
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod...445&cm_re=ryzen_3_1300-_-19-113-445-_-Product

Both are quite a bit more affordable and make the $450 budget work. I doubt they'd even notice the capability difference.

EDIT: Just thought of something, the Ryzens DO NOT have integrated graphics. So if you were planning on using the built in graphics you'd need an intel.

 

[Mrb1p]

My brother in law has a CPU that has a fried video card slot ? Is this possible ? Hes ready to give the cpu to me, should I take it ? How much is it gonna cost ?

 

[Devourers]

My brother in law has a CPU that has a fried video card slot ? Is this possible ? Hes ready to give the cpu to me, should I take it ? How much is it gonna cost ?

Unless the CPU is like... fried or something he probably means his motherboard has a burnt PCI-E slot for the video card. But I have heard of people messing up their CPU in ways that would cause weird things to happen

Depending on what the CPU is and if it is actually the motherboard, it would require replacing the motherboard. I know for my old 3770k it was quite a bitch to find a new motherboard since z77 wasn't anywhere near current anymore. If it's like a 6th gen CPU or newer though, you should be in luck.

@Playerwinner 450$ CAD is doable but just barely. Their PC would have to be extremely bad for a 450$ CAD rig to be better. That having been said you can find something used that is probably much better but a used PC seems a bit tacky for an xmas gift. Maybe you can find a pre-build at bestbuy for 450$, I have seen some laptops in that price range that were passable.

 

[Kestrel]

Basically just browsing the web, and minor photo editing. They currently have a computer that is useless with an Intel Atom, 4gb of Ram the start time is horrendous and my father is obsessed with AVG which really eats at the very limited resources. The $450 would be for buying them a new power supply, motherboard, ram, ssd, and a cpu.

If the route I take is giving them my motherboard ram, and cpu I am not sure of the budget. I would need to get myself a i5 8600k or 1600 with a mb/ram, along with a psu and ssd for the parents system. It would only be a 128gb ssd.

Have you thought of getting them a refurb?

6th gen i3

https://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883286912

2nd gen i7

https://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883283961CVF

The i7 will have substantially more raw CPU grunt to it... I suspect the i3, being a lot more modern, will have substantially better onboard video.

I didn't look too closely at either system - if you are thinking of adding a video card, I'd be sure that they will take one - which also may require changing the power supply, which you would also have to be sure the system can handle. Otherwise, I'd probably be tempted to grab the i3, and call it a day.

 

[SniperHF]

Wait Nvidia forbade factory overclocking on the 1070 ti?

God this industry is getting dumber.

It does seem like you can actually get the card somewhat close so its MSRP for the moment so there's that.

 

[Kestrel]

AMD has info out on its mobile APU's... if they're anywhere close to what they're claiming, they sound fantastic. I'm hoping they will find their way into higher end Windows tablets... but we'll see.

 

[Cerebral]

Okay, here's a build - I went to pcpartpicker, and told it to only list ME available parts - on my end, it's showing ME prices, I'm assuming it will do so when you go to the URL as well. It's possible that the prices aren't completely current, but there's a lot of room left in your $2000 budget.

https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/s78thq

This doesn't include tax, or ME's price to build it for you, but it comes to $1460.90. If you felt like putting in the time, some of those parts are cheaper at other vendors (and you can click on each part in the list to see those prices/vendors), and you should be able to get ME to price match most of them.

I went with the unlocked i7, simply because even without overclocking, it is clocked higher than the unlocked version, and with a cheap CPU cooler (the unlocked comes without one), it still comes in at about the same price as the unlocked version, and you also come away with a much better, quieter cooler.

I went with a 450W power supply - if you ever think you WILL game and want a beefy video card, you can go with a more powerful one, but otherwise, that should be a good solid one, and it's completely modular.

Sniper will have a better idea than I will if an NVME drive will even make a noticable difference for you, but I put a 512 GB class one in the build. You could downgrade to a regular m.2 (non NVME) drive, and save some money if you wanted, and still be pretty damn fast compared to a regular hard drive.

I included a 2 TB drive, but opted for a 5400 RPM one - little slower, little less heat - the speed won't matter for media, and any software that needs speed, you just stick it on the SSD (m.2) drive. The m.2 drive is going to look kinda like a RAM stick, and just plugs directly into the motherboard, likely around where the pcie slots are. With that budget, you may want to consider adding a second 2 TB drive to use as a backup drive.

If you just want as beastly a computer as that budget can get, you may actually want to go back to the AMD route, and get the r7, and put in a cheap video card, as that can get you an 8 core, 16 thread processor. Otherwise, if you're happy with the i7 (a 4 core, 8 thread processor), it's no slouch either. The i7 is still quite powerful, the r7 would just be better at things like video encoding, or doing a lot of multitasking. By a lot of multitasking, I mean some serious multitasking - an i7 is still more beast than your average computer user needs.

I also went out of the way to pick an mATX case and motherboard, with the assumption that you want to keep it relatively small, but not necessarily tiny. ITX is harder to do, and not my forte, but it lets you go smaller - a regular ATX board and case will be bigger, but open up more flexibility for adding more parts - not likely necessary based on what you have described, but I hate boxing myself in if I don't have a good reason to.

Also, you asked about a sound card - not necessary if you are happy with onboard sound, but if you're more of an audiophile, you can definitely add a sound card.

This also does not include a wireless card - if you aren't going to connect it via an ethernet cable, you would want to add a wireless card.

I didn’t end up building as quickly as I would have liked. However, we finally have a place of our own again for the time being and I’m hoping to order a new computer this week.

Any new thoughts or does this build still look good? What processor would people recommend if I’m looking at a build between $1500-$2000?

I’m looking forward to posting on something besides my phone in the near future!

 

[Kestrel]

If I remember, I'll have a look this weekend. What are your criteria again? ie, what are your priorities with this computer? Ryzen is still a good option - I haven't kept track to see where they are in their releases, but Intel is working on a new generation that ups your core counts - ie, an i3 is now a 4 core processor. Sniper might be a lot more on top of that than I am.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

 

[Cerebral]

If I remember, I'll have a look this weekend. What are your criteria again? ie, what are your priorities with this computer? Ryzen is still a good option - I haven't kept track to see where they are in their releases, but Intel is working on a new generation that ups your core counts - ie, an i3 is now a 4 core processor. Sniper might be a lot more on top of that than I am.

Basically, I’m just looking for something super fast. I’ll be doing some streaming and listening to music. No need for a video card as I won’t be gaming on it. I’ll likely want a sound card though.

 

[Kestrel]

Basically, I’m just looking for something super fast. I’ll be doing some streaming and listening to music. No need for a video card as I won’t be gaming on it. I’ll likely want a sound card though.

Wanting to spend the whole budget, or is spending less to get something almost as fast something you want to accomplish where possible too? Sounds like significant gaming will not be a factor - remind me, what else are you planning to do with it? Is it just a streaming, browsing computer? Just gauging whether or not multi-threading is going to be a big deal for you.

 

[Cerebral]

Wanting to spend the whole budget, or is spending less to get something almost as fast something you want to accomplish where possible too? Sounds like significant gaming will not be a factor - remind me, what else are you planning to do with it? Is it just a streaming, browsing computer? Just gauging whether or not multi-threading is going to be a big deal for you.

I really want to future-proof this computer and have it be fast for the next three-ish+ years. I won't really be gaming much so I wouldn't want to purchase a separate video card. It'll mostly be for streaming and browsing - I'd rather spend the $1500-2000 and have an awesome computer than save some money.

Let me know your thoughts - thanks!

 

[Devourers]

I really want to future-proof this computer and have it be fast for the next three-ish+ years. I won't really be gaming much so I wouldn't want to purchase a separate video card. It'll mostly be for streaming and browsing - I'd rather spend the $1500-2000 and have an awesome computer than save some money.

Let me know your thoughts - thanks!

If that's the case:

i7-8700 (non-K or K if you really wanna future proof and overclock)
z370 Asus Strix (Mid level Z series motherboard, has a solid built in wifi)
16-32gb Corsair Vengeance 2400mhz ram (Find the one with the lowest CL timing)
Samsung 256-512gb m.2 SSD (Size dependent on needs)
WD 1-4TB HDD (Size dependent on needs)
EVGA Fully Modular 850W PSU (Way overshooting your needed W cause why not, future proofing)
Cooler Master 212+ EVO (Cheap but very effective CPU cooler)
Phanteks Enthoo Pro Case (Best case on the market for the price imo)
I know you say you don't need a GPU but if you wanted to add one since your budget is high:
EVGA GTX 1050Ti (2x fan model)
EVGA GTX 1060 (2x/3x fan model)

But like others have already pointed out, you don't really need it, unless by streaming you mean having your own plex and even then not sure how much it would help.

To be honest though it's like others said, you can save a ton of money and still be relatively future proof with something like:

i5-8600
Asus B series chipset motherboard
16gb 2133mhz corsair/gskill/mushkin/etc ram at a higher CL but lower price
Samsung 256gb SATA SSD
WD 1TB HDD
EVGA Fully Modular 550W PSU
Cooler Master 212+ EVO or even stock cooler instead
A cheap case (Probably something from Rosewill)
No GPU.

For your needs I bet you'd see zero difference, given that you won't overclock the B series motherboard will serve you fine as will a lower W PSU, given that you aren't a PC enthusiast the cheaper case will serve you fine, given that you don't game the on board video will also likely serve you fine. All of this is future proof anyways cause all you'd need to do if you ever needed more performance is add 16gb more of ram and a GPU. You don't need an i7 either, an i5 will do you wonders already.

But hey, if you wanna spend money just for the sake of it get the first one.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

It needs to be CES time so I can get my new Volta news .

 

[Bocephus86]

Random question: How hot is too hot for a GPU to run? I got my 2k monitor (going to a legit 27 inch 2k IPS from a decent generic 22 inch 1080 is a nice upgrade) and noticed i was running about 8 degrees hotter in some less demanding games (Xcom2 WOTC and Rome total war 2, 72-76c and 58-62 c respectively); extrapolating that out to the increase I saw with the Witcher 3 before, I think I'll be in the low 80s with highish resolutions (turning down a few things, per feedback from Sniper here, without taking it down to medium range settings).

Is that sustainable? I run speccy all the time on my second monitor so mid 70s was where I stopped pushing graphics on my old monitor since it shows in orange (lazy mans approach) but now that I have a monitor that is "too much" for my 1060 6 gig, I figured I'd ask where I should stop pushing the limits.

 

[SniperHF]

Random question: How hot is too hot for a GPU to run? I got my 2k monitor (going to a legit 27 inch 2k IPS from a decent generic 22 inch 1080 is a nice upgrade) and noticed i was running about 8 degrees hotter in some less demanding games (Xcom2 WOTC and Rome total war 2, 72-76c and 58-62 c respectively); extrapolating that out to the increase I saw with the Witcher 3 before, I think I'll be in the low 80s with highish resolutions (turning down a few things, per feedback from Sniper here, without taking it down to medium range settings).

Is that sustainable? I run speccy all the time on my second monitor so mid 70s was where I stopped pushing graphics on my old monitor since it shows in orange (lazy mans approach) but now that I have a monitor that is "too much" for my 1060 6 gig, I figured I'd ask where I should stop pushing the limits.

It depends on the particular video card and cooler it has, but generally video cards are good up to 85C. Some even a bit higher.

I'm not happy if my card is over 80C generally and would even prefer under 75C but that's harder to pull off these days. Partially because I don't want all that heat in my area and partially because I don't want the ambient temps to keep going up for the health of the board/cpu/etc.

Also your card has an algorithm that will throttle it down if it gets hot to the point of being unsafe.