Owen Sound Attack 2023-24 Off-Season Thread (Part 2)

[AttackBeacher]

Rangers fired McKee. Won a couple of championships after. I liked him. Many didn't. Guess there were differences of opinions in philosophy in Owen Sound. Not sure what that meant?
Hindsight is 20/20. Most fans are puzzled by the way this squad is playing. Lot of talent there. They are in the mix with the bottom four point wise.

Walters was fired for non hockey reasons

OHL suspends coach Greg Walters rest of season for inappropriate verbal altercation

The Ontario Hockey League has suspended former Owen Sound Attack head coach Greg Walters until June 30, 2024, for an inappropriate altercation he had with another Attack employee, OHL commissioner David Branch announced in a statement Tuesday.

www.sportsnet.ca

 

[bobber]

Walters was fired for non hockey reasons

OHL suspends coach Greg Walters rest of season for inappropriate verbal altercation

The Ontario Hockey League has suspended former Owen Sound Attack head coach Greg Walters until June 30, 2024, for an inappropriate altercation he had with another Attack employee, OHL commissioner David Branch announced in a statement Tuesday.

www.sportsnet.ca

That's too bad Forgot what the reason was. Guess they did what was proper in that case. Almost every hockey prognosticator anylizing the game on the tube all wonder what is going on with the squad up there. On paper they should be at or near the top. Fans watching every game know best. Watching on the tube isn't the same as seeing players at the rink.

 

[ktownfan]

That's too bad Forgot what the reason was. Guess they did what was proper in that case. Almost every hockey prognosticator anylizing the game on the tube all wonder what is going on with the squad up there. On paper they should be at or near the top. Fans watching every game know best. Watching on the tube isn't the same as seeing players at the rink.

Non hockey reasons were the way out for the Attack. On ice they were sub par

 

[Noofgoof]

Can still get to 30 wins.

Careful dont want to sound like a smart ars ... lol

 

[Stellar29]

Well, that didn't look like a team desperate to get a win to stay away from the possibility of facing London. Barlow got his goals, but the rest of the top 6 didn't have much life. I like Sedley, but he always seems to want to take a simple play and make it harder. I think it was the 4 on 4 goal he had a 15 foot pass to make and instead of flat on the ice, he sauces it in to Guindons' feet and 3 seconds later its in the net. Mccue looked dissinterested at times. How many times will tersigni fall or get pushed off the puck . Defensively the team was bad again, Not sure if they win tomorrow that it will keep them away from London. They would have pulled Votary after those 5 goals. I would say the team has quit on these coaches. A time out to calm them down and explain maybe the urgency of their situation, the result..... a goal against immediatley on the next shift. I'm not sure how the rest of the attack faithful is feeling, but it looks bleak for the playoff "run"
I feel that we here in Kingston will have an early exit, but might squeak out a game or two. You guys will have a tough one with either Sag or LDn

My biggest concern is the play of Carter George. He's such a huge piece for the Attack and he hasn't looked as sharp as we're used to seeing of late. He's now played 55 of 67 games for the Attack this season and seen more rubber than any other goalie in the league. Is he starting to wear down? Having the best version of Carter George going into the playoffs is so incredibly important if the Attack are going to have any hope of a chance. I'm sure he'll get the start on Saturday with the 30 win streak in jeopardy but I'd rather him not even dress. Let Votary or Koprowski have the net and George gets some much needed rest. I hope I'm wrong but it feels like we are seeing the consequences of his heavy workload this season.

 

[HockeyPops]

The unfortunate part is that they really don't have an alternative. Looking at the game logs, Votary has only had 3 good starts all year, and none since Jan 5.

It's always an interesting question, how much is too much for a goalie? George has had the most pucks this year, but Oster has played 4 more games worth. The interesting thing about that is that Oshawa does have a legitimate backup in Bender, and they shouldn't hesitate to go with Bender if Oster needed a rest.

I imagine the answer to the question of "how much is too much" varies from goalie to goalie.

 

[Stellar29]

The unfortunate part is that they really don't have an alternative. Looking at the game logs, Votary has only had 3 good starts all year, and none since Jan 5.

It's always an interesting question, how much is too much for a goalie? George has had the most pucks this year, but Oster has played 4 more games worth. The interesting thing about that is that Oshawa does have a legitimate backup in Bender, and they shouldn't hesitate to go with Bender if Oster needed a rest.

I imagine the answer to the question of "how much is too much" varies from goalie to goalie.

In the case of the Attack, is it all that important in the grand scheme of things to finish 7th instead of 8th? London and Saginaw are both unfavorable matchups. I'd value the rest of my #1 goalie over the drop off to my #2/3 goalies for one game but that's just me.

In terms of how much is too much? I think you have to look at the difficulty of schedule and the type of workload/saves being asked of the goalies. A team like Oshawa plays a much stronger game in front of Oster and while Oster has been very good this year, he hasn't had to work as hard. George faces a lot of rubber but they aren't a bunch of low danger shots from the perimeter, the Attack surrender a bunch of high danger chances almost every game. I'm not sure there's another team in the league that relies as heavily on their goalie as the Attack do. I'd feel better about his games played total if he wasn't seeing 35 plus shots every game and seeing so many odd man rushes. I think he leads the league in 40 plus save performances this season. I think the fact that George leads the league in save % with the rather porous defense the team in front of him plays is a real testament to just how special Carter George is.

 

[ktownfan]

I didn't dare say anything against George. I have thought he haas looked ordinary lately and thought his first half was much better than the 2nd. He is relied heavily on because of how poor the Dzone is and I believe this has taken its' toll on him. The 1st goal last night was not good and certainly not what you guys needed early in that game. I think Saginaw is the most favorable of the 2 match ups. London has beat you every game this year. Your team is outmatched physically by Boulton, Lawrence, Leonard, Edward, Mccue, and Sim.

 

[Stellar29]

I didn't dare say anything against George. I have thought he haas looked ordinary lately and thought his first half was much better than the 2nd. He is relied heavily on because of how poor the Dzone is and I believe this has taken its' toll on him. The 1st goal last night was not good and certainly not what you guys needed early in that game. I think Saginaw is the most favorable of the 2 match ups. London has beat you every game this year. Your team is outmatched physically by Boulton, Lawrence, Leonard, Edward, Mccue, and Sim.

I think it's splitting hairs a little bit between London and Saginaw and who's the better match up. I think I'd rather the reduced travel between Owen Sound and London personally. I think Owen Sound matches up better physically this year than they did a year ago.

 

[DCruickshank]

What is the penalty for biting another player????

 

[Stellar29]

What is the penalty for biting another player????

My understanding is it would fall under the unsportsmanlike conduct penalty but be considered an attempt to injure which would be classified as a 5 min major match penalty.

 

[OSattackfan]

I think it's splitting hairs a little bit between London and Saginaw and who's the better match up. I think I'd rather the reduced travel between Owen Sound and London personally. I think Owen Sound matches up better physically this year than they did a year ago.

Does it matter. This team will be out in 4 games regardless of who they play. Weather the coaches gave up on the team or visa versa, there seams to be no effort to try and win. As a long time season ticket holder, this has been a tough season to watch. I guess will be in another rebuild year nest season.

 

[ktownfan]

I think it's splitting hairs a little bit between London and Saginaw and who's the better match up. I think I'd rather the reduced travel between Owen Sound and London personally. I think Owen Sound matches up better physically this year than they did a year ago.

You do? How so?

 

[Stellar29]

Does it matter. This team will be out in 4 games regardless of who they play. Weather the coaches gave up on the team or visa versa, there seams to be no effort to try and win. As a long time season ticket holder, this has been a tough season to watch. I guess will be in another rebuild year nest season.

Does it matter? Probably not, no. I think the only caveat is the playoffs is a new season so to speak. The competitiveness of playing the same team in a best of 7 can at times draw the best out of a team. I'm not going to presume an outcome at this point even if it does seem bleak.

 

[Stellar29]

You do? How so?

Last year we basically had Hookey and Stewart plus Lawrence to an extent. I think the additions of Smith and McCue adds some edge. Burroughs can get fiery at times. Barlow has a bit of an edge at times. Still think London has an advantage but I don't think it's as extreme as it may have been last season. I would definitely expect a physical series with plenty of animosity but the Attack are much better equipped for that this season than last.

 

[Spills]

The season, in a word, disappointing .

I believe the Attack were in first place in the Western Conference when they parted company with Walters.

He must be guffawing today just a little bit .

Got paid to sit at-home and watch his team implode.

Team was 4-2-1 I believe when fired so I am not sure the first place at that time means to much, especially with teams having multiple kids still away at camp.

 

[Millpond]

View attachment 839956

My understanding is it would fall under the unsportsmanlike conduct penalty but be considered an attempt to injure which would be classified as a 5 min major match penalty.

He had a bandage on his hand at practice today.

 

[AttackBeacher]

Last year we basically had Hookey and Stewart plus Lawrence to an extent. I think the additions of Smith and McCue adds some edge. Burroughs can get fiery at times. Barlow has a bit of an edge at times. Still think London has an advantage but I don't think it's as extreme as it may have been last season. I would definitely expect a physical series with plenty of animosity but the Attack are much better equipped for that this season than last.

Anyone who suggests that a lack of physical play is the reason why we may not have playoff success is living in 1998, just not close to the issues that the team have. Physical play is the one thing that they have.

They are very confused and disorganized in their own zone, and as a result they give up way too many scoring chances. I believe that this new system was implemented to limit quality chances, but it's done the opposite and for whatever reason, the coaches have not or cannot change the system or find a system that will.

They relied way too heavily on a rookie goalie who now looks overworked. Votary plays a massive part in this, as he simply has not been good enough to be an OHL goalie, but that still doesn't mean that you play George as much as you do. Sometimes it feels like they are coaching for their contracts vs coaching for the best of the team. Thats why they seemed so worried about playing rookies like Smith and Either against teams like Niagara, Sarnia, etc. They treated every game like it was the superbowl.

Its been downhill all year and its all about defensive zone play and some player looking checked out and not progressing. Thats why they probably don't play well in the playoffs, not that they are not tough enough.

The big blow for this team was Hishon and Hill leaving (maybe moreso Hill as Im not sure Hishon wanted to coach long term) after LeTang left. Had they stayed, Hill would have transitioned to head coach and I have no doubt that the results would have been significantly different.

This is easily the most frustrating season in my 20 or so years following the team, they teams has been built well and the roster, while not perfect is just as good as 80 percent of the OHL, but the coaching staff has let them and us down.

 

[AttackBeacher]

Is there actually any real discussion from the team on future changes in management? Or is it just HF Board banter at this point in time? Sometimes things get leaked to the media on purpose. Really haven't seen anything to suggest changes in management except for speculations on here.

Not really, at least not where I sit and who I interact with. If someone from 4 hours away feels differently I cannot really comment on that.

The way that I look at it, the management build a team that everyone across the OHL felt was in the mix for an OHL Championship without bottoming out. They lost the head coach in waiting over the summer and had to pivot. The head coach coming into the year was not perfect, but capable of getting results, did something that caused him to be fired that and now, the two coaches just have not delivered results. Had the past coach not done that, Im not sure we would be 1st in the conference, but we would be much closer and it would have been a better year.

Picking the right coaches was a factor, but losing the head coach in waiting over the summer was a bigger hit then we all realized and as such, here we are.

I think it would be incredibly reactionary to let go of a staff that found Carter George in the 3rd round after being the 5/6th goalie taken, Sam Sedley in the 4th round, Taos Jordan in the 12th, Colby Barlow 8th overall, Deni Goure 10th, etc.

 

[Millpond]

!

 

[HLLYWD99]

NO 30 WINS FOR YOU!!!

​

 

[KFawcett]

What is the penalty for biting another player????

Don't you listen to the Storm people Budnick didn't bite him. Ethan punched him is such a way that he got the teeth marks and coresponding blood on the top of his hand. Thats a common occurence I've even heard that it's possible that Evander Holyfield stuck his ear in Tysons mouth. ROFLMAO!!!!!

 

[bobber]

Don't you listen to the Storm people Budnick didn't bite him. Ethan punched him is such a way that he got the teeth marks and coresponding blood on the top of his hand. Thats a common occurence I've even heard that it's possible that Evander Holyfield stuck his ear in Tysons mouth. ROFLMAO!!!!!

Holyfield wasn't that bright. After getting one ear chomped he turned his head and Mike feasted on the other. Never heard of a hockey player biting an opponent. Don't they wear mouth guard?

 

[ktownfan]

Not really, at least not where I sit and who I interact with. If someone from 4 hours away feels differently I cannot really comment on that.

The way that I look at it, the management build a team that everyone across the OHL felt was in the mix for an OHL Championship without bottoming out. They lost the head coach in waiting over the summer and had to pivot. The head coach coming into the year was not perfect, but capable of getting results, did something that caused him to be fired that and now, the two coaches just have not delivered results. Had the past coach not done that, Im not sure we would be 1st in the conference, but we would be much closer and it would have been a better year.

Picking the right coaches was a factor, but losing the head coach in waiting over the summer was a bigger hit then we all realized and as such, here we are.

I think it would be incredibly reactionary to let go of a staff that found Carter George in the 3rd round after being the 5/6th goalie taken, Sam Sedley in the 4th round, Taos Jordan in the 12th, Colby Barlow 8th overall, Deni Goure 10th, etc.

We interact with different people. It's out there. Another night of poor coaching and blown leads. Nice ceremony for your 3 OA's

 

[AttackBeacher]

We interact with different people. It's out there. Another night of poor coaching and blown leads. Nice ceremony for your 3 OA's

Wasn’t talking to you, don’t care. My hopes and thoughts are towards the entire organization, not just a single player. This is my last post in your direction, respectfully ask the same