TheStatican
Registered User
- Mar 14, 2012
- 1,673
- 1,419
What does scoring at the end of October have anything to do with anything??? Do you know who was tied for 37th in scoring in scoring by the end of October of this year? Connor McDavid. And do you know who still wasn't anywhere near the leaders at the end of November and at the end of December? Connor McDavid. But ya, McDavid was playing 'hurt' to start the year while Lemieux was just 'slumping'.As I already showed, in 1989-90 Gretzky led the NHL in scoring at the end of October, at the end of November, and at the end of December. After 51 games played apiece, he and Lemieux were tied for 1st in scoring. So, yeah, not exactly like Huberdeau and McDavid -- a ridiculous assertion which you should be ashamed of yourself for making.
Not like there's any corroborate evidence that Lemieux was playing hurt during that time...
Penguins 4, Rangers 3 - UPI Archives
Paul Coffey scored twice and set up two other goals, including the game-winner by Troy Loney at 3:33 of overtime, Wednesday night to lead Pittsburgh to a 4-3...
www.upi.com
‘He had tears in his eyes’: On the night Mario Lemieux’s back stopped him from catching Wayne Gretzky
On the night Mario Lemieux couldn't play through the pain any longer.
theathletic.com
"He had played sparingly in some games leading up to that night in New York, the pain limiting him to power play work and occasional shifts. By February, he was noticeably limited on the ice."
"His only shifts that period were a 54-second shift to start the period and then two power plays. During a break in action midway through the second period, he skated to the Penguins’ locker room and never returned."
Injury Ends Lemieux's Streak - UPI Archives
Pittsburgh Penguins center Mario Lemieux, succumbing to the pain of his herniated back, failed to collect a point for the first time in 3 months and was...
www.upi.com
Btw that Huberdeau fellow you'd like to so easily dismiss was actually ahead of McDavid in scoring after game 75 with less than 2-weeks to go in the season nevermind tied at game 51 and he was the one who actually caught up to McDavid, before Connor finally pulled ahead again at the very end. Very different from Lemieux catching up to and blowing past Gretzky in '90 before being shut down
NHL Stats
In 1989 Lemieux had a horrible start to the season thanks to a nagging injury and also playing under a completely incompetent coach, Gene Ubriaco. Sound familiar? I would think anyone who's an Oilers fan would know a thing or two about having a poor start because a similar scenario just played itself out right before our very eyes this year. Not being an Oilers fan I don't know what the problem with Woodcroft was but I can tell you about Ubriaco. This joke of a coach was - "constantly shuffling his lines and no apparent system for playing positions". How many times have we ever heard players offering that level of damning of criticism of a coach?? It's a complete embarrassment to be described as such and it's little wonder that ol' Genie would never coach again in the NHL after being fired by the Pens.
Lemieux was so far behind the 8-ball at the start of that season compared to his normal pace that the only year in which he had a worse pace was his rookie campaign:
This is NOT like Lemieux. If there's one thing did better than literally anyone in NHL history, including Gretzky, it's starting off a season hot. It's thanks to that start that Lemieux sat in 8th place, 7 behind the leader(in less games through) by the end of October;
Which is actually a lot better than it looked for McDavid this year who found himself tied for 37th, 9 points behind the leader. After October until the end of his season, Lemieux completely dominated over all players, Gretzky included;
Wow... that's one heck of a false equivalency. So let me get this straight, when Lemieux scores at a pace faster than his season average before his season concludes, it's dismissed as an unsustainable hot streak, but when Gretzky does the same... it's considered business as usual?After his late winter mini-slump that lasted 9 games or so, Wayne had 34 points in 15 games into the latter part of March when he got injured with a pretty severe back injury. If he had maintained that scoring level for the final 8 complete games (which is extremely likely, as it was below his career average), he'd have finished the season with 159 points. Lemieux paced for 167 overall, and he only reaches that 'pace' after a 23 points-in-9 games push before his back seized up, which means his per-game average is likely overstated by projecting him to 167 points. But even so, we're looking at, if both players were healthy, Lemieux scoring around 165-170 points (minus player) and Gretzky 160 (plus player).
I have nothing more to say about that analysis.
Furthermore their respective injuries are hardly comparable. Was Gretzky's back injury so severe that it retroactively affected his performance leading up to it? Unlike Gretzky, Lemieux battled a chronic condition all season long that consistently hindered his performance, and yet he still managed to well outpace Gretzky once he hit his stride.
Also using plus minus is a near meaningless metric as a determining factor for anything. We've been through this before Panther;
Was there a time in their careers when Mario was better than Wayne?
Nearly ALL of Lemieux's minus that season was from short-handed goals scored against while he was on the powerplay. Maybe Lemieux's defense while on the man advantage was indeed poor that year, not like it's a team-wide metric or anything, but go ahead and make that argument. It still has little to do with how well he did or didn't tilt the ice at even strength which is what you're implying.
Last edited: