WJC: Open Letter To Canadian Hockey Fans

AvatarAang

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Jan 21, 2018
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That's the senior writer of The Hockey News and two prominent regional journalists, voicing widely held sentiments.

I am well aware of who they are, and their opinions do not reflect Canada whatsoever. You took the displeasure from a few disgruntled individuals to create some fake vendetta that Canadians are displeased with the talent level in the tournament.

A lot of people were displeased having whole days of blowouts, myself included. That's why I worked on the solution I posted above. We have a legitimate issue here.

No, we do not have a legitimate issue here. You are just trying to create one to generate more clicks. I’m sure you had a lot of great content in your article, but you felt that trying to get an entire nation’s sympathy was more important.

The only issue here is that you seem to be part of the problem. Why are you displeased about the blowouts? Forget about the score and enjoy the game and how important it is to every kid on the ice.
 
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End on a Hinote

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Aug 22, 2011
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I do apologize for not making it clear enough that it wasn't all Canadians that this apply to. Most are absolutely awesome. I spend a semester in Vancouver and I can't praise Canada and its people enough.
However, there is a very small minority who are using platforms to bash the smaller nation and wishing for an elitist hockey spectrum. This is what I'm trying to show a different perspective towards. It's not hate towards Canadians.
It's to show why I think we need the World Junior to stay in its current format to further the growth of hockey.

That's fair and thank you for further explaining. My response was more meant to show that we don't have it as easy as some other fans tend to think and that being a hockey fan from Canada does have its frustrations in regards to opposing fans just like all other fan bases.

An example that stands out to me is when Don Cherry infamously refered to the Hurricanes as a "bunch of jerks" For the Strom Surge. Despite the fact that American personalities such as Brian Burke and Mike Milbury were equally as critical towards the antics, only Cherry and, by proxy, the Canadian fanbase as a whole were critisced for it.

Even the Canes twitter account mockingly tweeted "Wait until Canada sees this". Then proceeded to display more Storm Surge antics.

That's right, it wasn't "Wait until Don Cherry sees this", or "Wait until the haters see this".

It was "Wait until Canada". That's right, they mocked the entire goddamn nation because if what ONE person believed.

If it was a Canadian team who responded to Milbury/Burke's with "Wait until America sees this." I can promise you it would have been met with much criticism and controversy and even the possibility of a mandated apology and/or somebody losing their jobs for making such a tweet.
 
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Fatass

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I wrote an open letter to all Canadian hockey fans. Just like you, Europeans from smaller hockey nations love the World Juniors. It's an amazing tournament to watch and in its current structure, it helps the entire hockey world. Even if it comes at the price of a blowout from time to time. So to those wanting to stop the blowouts by removing teams from the juniors or recreate Team Europe. Please take a second to read the perspective of someone from a nation that isn't fighting for gold, but something completely different and let me know what you think of it. Dear Canadian Hockey Fans
What if we combined some countries? Denmark and Norway, for example would make for a stronger team. And put the Czechs and Slovaks back together. Maybe Switzerland and Austria would be a good pairing. I think Germany could go with France. Trouble is what happens to Holland? Some countries get left out. Maybe some groupings of three?
I know in soccer we are horrifyingly awful, and never qualify for anything.
 

sandysan

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Dec 7, 2011
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I wrote an open letter to all Canadian hockey fans. Just like you, Europeans from smaller hockey nations love the World Juniors. It's an amazing tournament to watch and in its current structure, it helps the entire hockey world. Even if it comes at the price of a blowout from time to time. So to those wanting to stop the blowouts by removing teams from the juniors or recreate Team Europe. Please take a second to read the perspective of someone from a nation that isn't fighting for gold, but something completely different and let me know what you think of it. Dear Canadian Hockey Fans
the linked article has a section labelled " winning isnt everything"
What's the purpose, the raison detre, of sporting competitions ?

if the idea is that the more people who play the better, then let's go with that. let's get israel and botswana and new zeland in there against traditional hockey powers, because nothing grows the game like getting repeatedly and assuredly plastered where losing 16-1 would look like an accomplishment.

The IIHF ALREADY excludes nations from competing, nations that have no reasonable chance of winning. Arguing where that line should be isnt arrogance. Hey if we got some of those countries into to the tournament, the current weak sisters could beat up on THEM as well to help grow the game!

" hey we don't stand a chance against canada but we sure put the boots to el salvador!"
 

Czechboy

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I'd be so sad I'd they had a team europe here... I'd have to skip my second favorite tournament.

I was honestly hoping the Slovaks and Swiss would've boycotted that last World Cup by the NHL. Such a slap in the face.

Even at best on best there have been many upsets.

Yesterday's quarters were supposed to be 3 blowouts and a close game. We got 4 close games. No team was down by more than 2 going into third period.
 

Habs Icing

Formerly Onice
Jan 17, 2004
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Blowouts?

I'm old enough to remember a time when there were really only two hockey nations: Canada & USSR. Yes we had Sweden, Finland, USA and Czechoslovakia but they were not really in the same league. Today those nations are all in the same league and I can see in a decade or two Switzerland and Germany there.

So I'm fine with an occasional blowout if it means that in 10-20 years they will have to increase the number of teams to 12 or 14 because hockey has become a truly international sport. And I believe these tournaments will help greatly in making hockey an international sport.
 

Inf4mous0ne

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I am well aware of who they are, and their opinions do not reflect Canada whatsoever. You took the displeasure from a few disgruntled individuals to create some fake vendetta that Canadians are displeased with the talent level in the tournament.



No, we do not have a legitimate issue here. You are just trying to create one to generate more clicks. I’m sure you had a lot of great content in your article, but you felt that trying to get an entire nation’s sympathy was more important.

The only issue here is that you seem to be part of the problem. Why are you displeased about the blowouts? Forget about the score and enjoy the game and how important it is to every kid on the ice.
Wow, get off your high horse.

1) You do realize the person you are responding to here isn't the author of the article, right?? You are so upset about the topic you don't even know who you are arguing with anymore.

2) Are you disputing that this sentiment isn't online? Even if it's not the majority of fans, there are still 100's of people who have posted something to this effect online. Did you want him to individually name the 100's of people who have said something to this effect instead? It's an article, you make broad statements for headlines.

3) He already apologized for any offense that it caused, which I already thought was unnecessary for any reasonable person, but you are persistently responding with indignance. Not sure why this your hill to die on, it seems most people understand what the author is talking about, and are generally having a rational conversation about it.
 

gwh

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Mar 4, 2013
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I wrote an open letter to all Canadian hockey fans. Just like you, Europeans from smaller hockey nations love the World Juniors. It's an amazing tournament to watch and in its current structure, it helps the entire hockey world. Even if it comes at the price of a blowout from time to time. So to those wanting to stop the blowouts by removing teams from the juniors or recreate Team Europe. Please take a second to read the perspective of someone from a nation that isn't fighting for gold, but something completely different and let me know what you think of it. Dear Canadian Hockey Fans

Yea... not many people in North Europe watch the kid hockey. Not sure which countries are you referring to?
 

Czechboy

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I do wonder about a tier system... I haven't pulled out the abacus but something like this...

Top 5 in one pool
Bottom 5 in other pool
2 exhibition matches each... Must be big 5 vs bottom 5 for exposure.
Top 2 teams in big 5 pool go to semis
Next 3 teams go to a mini quarter against top team from other pool
Bottom 2 teams in other pool fight out in a 3 game relegation

Something like that....

This would have almost zero blowouts and nothing but close games with lots on the line.
 

GermanNuck

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Jun 15, 2011
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I do wonder about a tier system... I haven't pulled out the abacus but something like this...

Top 5 in one pool
Bottom 5 in other pool
2 exhibition matches each... Must be big 5 vs bottom 5 for exposure.
Top 2 teams in big 5 pool go to semis
Next 3 teams go to a mini quarter against top team from other pool
Bottom 2 teams in other pool fight out in a 3 game relegation

Something like that....

This would have almost zero blowouts and nothing but close games with lots on the line.

Sounds too complicated. I’m always having a hard time with formats like this. There is no other sport that I’m aware of that tries to complicate things like this.
 
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kevsh

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Nothing to do with how many teams make the cut, but having the WJC in Europe more often would likely mean European countries doing better overall.

I don't know the politics or rationale of why it is in Canada so often, but at the very least countries like Slovakia, Sweden and Germany deserve to be the home team a few times every century.
 

Rabid Ranger

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Feb 27, 2002
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Nothing to do with how many teams make the cut, but having the WJC in Europe more often would likely mean European countries doing better overall.

I don't know the politics or rationale of why it is in Canada so often, but at the very least countries like Slovakia, Sweden and Germany deserve to be the home team a few times every century.

It's in Canada so often because it's a money making machine.
 
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Czechboy

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Sounds too complicated. I’m always having a hard time with formats like this. There is no other sport that I’m aware of that tries to complicate things like this.
Women's hockey has a similar format.. I just made that up quickly but I know they do this because my Czech ladies went undefeated at the last worlds and then ended up in an elimination match with someone like Finland and lost. I really liked it to be honest. It wasn't really complicated at all. I just couldn't figure out how much Czech ladies kept winning.lol
 

Chairman Maouth

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Apr 29, 2009
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Okay just as I thought, a bunch of clowns and no one reputable. You found a few bad apples and decided all of Canada needed to be addressed.

To put it in perspective, it would be no different than me reading your article and then addressing all of HFboards to stop generalizing Canadians.
You asked him for evidence. He provided it. Now you're getting all pissy because he did what you asked of him. Those people are not clowns. They are mainstream sports journalists and announcers. Ferraro is, in my opinion, the best of the best.

He has every right to write an article and to link to it here. Just because you disagree with his premise doesn't change that.
 
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Riggins

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If you could somehow do a top 6 (CAN-SWE-RUS-USA-FIN plus one) in a championship pool and a bottom 4-6 in a qualifying pool that would benefit the tournament. The qualifying winner moves up to the championship pool the following year.

A top 6 championship pool would make this tournament far more watchable. Every team plays each other and almost every game is competitive. The top 4 make the playoff round.

This is obviously a Canada-centric view but it also benefits the other top nations. I've found this year's tournament to be a complete bore with the pool Canada was in. The tournament basically doesn't start until the semi-final.
 

AvatarAang

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Jan 21, 2018
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You asked him for evidence. He provided it. Now you're getting all pissy because he did what you asked of him. Those people are not clowns. They are mainstream sports journalists and announcers. Ferraro is, in my opinion, the best of the best.

He has every right to write an article and to link to it here. Just because you disagree with his premise doesn't change that.

Actually, Ferraro also thinks Cox has no credibility. If you took the time to read Ferraro’s tweet, you will see that he is actually disagreeing with Cox.

I do not understand what the intent of your post is. I agree that Ferraro is one of the best, and I am in 100% agreement with Ferraro.

If the author wrote this article in response to one of Ferraro’s tweets, then I do humbly apologize. If not, then I really see how this is no different than asking all of Canada to apologize for something irrelevant that Don Cherry said.
 

Talus

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It's certainly unlikely for Norway, unless they have a very good year.

Denmark and Latvia would have a chance. As opposed to being relegated to the second tier, as they are this year, those clubs just have to win one or two key matchups and they would make the quarterfinals of the medal round, where they'll play Canada or whoever else is on top in the 8. In my simulation Latvia actually knocked off the Swiss. If they had beaten the Slovaks or the Czechs they would have made the quarters.



I think they'd be better than 1/20 chance of making the semis. One of the best lines of the tournament was Stutzle - Elias - Peterka, you put solid depth around them and they can beat top teams often.

But I agree that there is more honor with national teams, I wouldn't change it.
that's the problem.DEPTH.
 

Drivesaitl

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Interesting thread.

On the Edmonton board there was some talk that there were too many teams in the tournament and this was my response to a series of posts suggesting that there should only be a superpowers tournament, say 5 teams, this being my reply on that board that fits here as well;


This kind of makes me sad. Because I grew up with the the Czechs as a world hockey power, and among one of the top clubs every year. They have fallen off but wonderful memories and teams they have had at World Juniors through the decades. Been a long time though since they won 3 in a row at the advent of this Millennium, Slovakia and Germany also competitive on good days.

Like I said earlier the rules for this tournament that no players can be substituted, during a pandemic, that is really unfortunate, and the goal should be each team being able to bring their best possible team and effort. Not having to play B2B with 14 players. Think about that. 2 of those are goalies. 5 D, 7 forwards. Playing dead on yourskates the last half of any period.

You need as many clubs as they have to grow the sport and keep giving other nations chances to come, develop. I mean what would the Soccer World Cup be if they only invited 10 top nations?

Part of the spectacle of sport is upsets, heroic performances from underdogs. But a tourney should be devised in such a away that the lesser clubs even have a chance. Making a club play with 14 players is not even giving that chance.

Now one problem I would agree with is the scheduling. Boxing Day, Xmas Day, NYE, NY day need to be figured as absolute must watches and the games should be congruent. There should be at least 1,2 games that are big matchups. You can't have a complete day of games where none of them are legitimate match ups. I know they do this so that all the good teams can feel their way into a tourney, and never more important than this one where teams didn't get much chance to play leading up to tournament.

Now that said, I think things are framed inaccurately in the OP. From speaking with people on our board, and Canadians in general it can be somewhat hard to do Winter in NA, in Canada. We're used to our distraction of hockey to get us through Canadian typical winters and worse now during pandemic times as much entertainment and hockey has been stripped from us. So fairly hockey starved here. So that the frustration was not just that certain teams were in the tournament, its that the games were not being competitive at all. People just wanted to see some actual contests and the Juniors started out with mostly blowouts.

I will say this part, some of the teams approach is a bit wanting. Germany has the excuse of only having 14 players in the Canada game. So understandable that they got blown out. Austria was just bad period. But I called it from the start of the tournament, and its always predictable. Czechs were going to have a big day against the Russians and they mailed it in for several other games. Thats a problem.

Similarly Swiss viewed their matchup against Germany as the only game that mattered, strategically, to forward chances of advancing. Swiss played like that as well basically resting (or so it seemed) for the Germany game. Predictably there was no resemblance, the Swiss played the Germany contest hard, but didn't bring that same effort in the other games.
Not blaming the teams either, just using examples of not all the games being properly contested. Where teams strategically or passionately pick the games they show up in. Its unfortunate. But I'm not sure if its the compressed schedule that kind of effects this and has teams saying to themselves "this is the game". But if teams don't contest the same in other games it detracts from the tournament.

But I still want this to be a large number of teams tournament, again thats how you continue to grow the game.
 
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AvatarAang

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Jan 21, 2018
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Wow, get off your high horse.

1) You do realize the person you are responding to here isn't the author of the article, right?? You are so upset about the topic you don't even know who you are arguing with anymore.

2) Are you disputing that this sentiment isn't online? Even if it's not the majority of fans, there are still 100's of people who have posted something to this effect online. Did you want him to individually name the 100's of people who have said something to this effect instead? It's an article, you make broad statements for headlines.

3) He already apologized for any offense that it caused, which I already thought was unnecessary for any reasonable person, but you are persistently responding with indignance. Not sure why this your hill to die on, it seems most people understand what the author is talking about, and are generally having a rational conversation about it.

1) I am addressing the original author and anyone else that believes the entire nation of Canada needed an open letter because of something Cox said

2) There are 100s of people who post irrelevant comments about a wide range of topics online, why did this require an open letter to Canadian hockey fans?

3) I’m only responding to people who are replying to my comments, but I am more than happy to stop commenting on this thread.


This will be my last post in this thread because I can see that no meaningful discussion will come out of it. Had I not commented on this post, people would naturally assume that a majority of Canadians are dissatisfied with the tournament and want the weaker countries out. That is the potential damage of having click bait articles like this, so of course I am going to get “pissy” when I see someone trying to take advantage of casual hockey fans that don’t know better.

I love chatting with fans of the weaker teams to learn about their unique/different style of play and upcoming prospects I should look out for. This tournament is about bringing people together, yet this article is only furthering that separation. Imagine a random Slovakian fan reading this article, their first impression will be that a large majority of Canadian fans are just a bunch of bullies that want Slovakia out of the tournament.

But again, this is my last post in this thread because my only intention was to determine whether this article had any merit. That question has been answered with the Cox tweet, so I will respectfully back out of this discussion now.
 
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Drivesaitl

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Oct 8, 2017
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Another look.

A lot of comparisons here between Soccer World Cup and Hockey. Again I love that the WC features a lot of teams, albeit I was fine sticking with around 24, I think the addition of more has subtracted from the tournament. 32 teams seemed like a lot and impacted the quality of matches, qualifying matches, and further influences how lucky teams could be in the draw. Expanding it to 48 teams I think we're bound to hear a lot of "too many teams" argument.

But the sports and scorelines are innately different. You rarely see a team scoring 16 or 18 goals in a game in Soccer, or in the World Cup. Because of the amount of goals scored and that Scoring 7 or more (blowouts) are so much more common in hockey, and the scorelines so blown up, its natural to get disengaged from some games.

I mean as a Canadian fan I love to See Canada in the World Cup, and have Cherished those games. But there is a profound difference between losing a match 2-0, where hypothetically a game could still be thought to be in contention, vs losing a game 12-0 in hockey. just saying.
 

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