Prospect Info: Olli Juolevi, Pt. VII | "Not A Tkachuk Thread" Edition | WJC postmortem

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The Iron Goalie

Formally 'OEL for Norris'
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Looks good so far. Could have had a couple pts already.

*Edit - Probably could be our best PP d-man next year (If he makes the team). Slick passer.
 
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krutovsdonut

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Sep 25, 2016
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Bringing up factors related to a player doesn't prevent people from talking about current performance of the player. It's as relevant to the subject as who a player was traded for or what contract they signed.

It seems unreasonable to give the stupid Benning back-and-forth a monopoly on that type of discussion. If Juolevi looked more promising than Tkachuk, it would be fair discussion too.

bringing up controversial issues that have been discussed to death already without the benefit of any additional data points or ideas seems like a bad idea in any thread. the fact this particular draft decision is a bete noir for people with a preconceived negative agenda into which they want to fit all things canuck makes it an even worse idea to me. it's basically [MOD]. go start a larsson-hall debate in the oilers forum and see how far you get.
 
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Shareefruck

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bringing up controversial issues that have been discussed to death already without the benefit of any additional data points or ideas seems like a bad idea in any thread. the fact this particular draft decision is a bete noir for people with a preconceived negative agenda into which they want to fit all things canuck makes it an even worse idea to me. it's basically [MOD]. go start a larsson-hall debate in the oilers forum and see how far you get.
But you can't just take an entirely fair and relevant aspect of a subject out of allowed discussion simply because you associate negative agendas with it that may or may not be apparent on a case by case basis. It needs to be acceptable that Louie Eriksson's contract gets brought up in a thread about Louie Eriksson, even if it can easily be wrongfully politicized into a petty pro vs. anti Benning thing, and whether you're sick of hearing about it or not. We don't have ownership over what others should want to talk about. Criticize individual cases where people push the agenda and politicize it, and criticize the general need for people to want to do it, sure, but don't criticize all mention of the subject altogether.
 
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Dab

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Apr 17, 2017
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Man I just can’t watch that league... I try to watch the games to catch Juolevi but the hockey is so bad.
 

krutovsdonut

eeyore
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But you can't just take an entirely fair and relevant aspect of a subject out of allowed discussion simply because you associate negative agendas with it that may or may not be apparent on a case by case basis. It needs to be acceptable that Louie Eriksson's contract gets brought up in a thread about Louie Eriksson, even if it can easily be wrongfully politicized into a petty pro vs. anti Benning thing, and whether you're sick of hearing about it or not. We don't have ownership over what others should want to talk about. Criticize individual cases where people push the agenda and politicize it, and criticize the general need for people to want to do it, sure, but don't criticize all mention of the subject altogether.

louie eriksson's contract is perhaps the only issue on this board where there is unanimity.
 
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Shareefruck

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^ He's putting up top six numbers now.
louie eriksson's contract is perhaps the only issue on this board where there is unanimity.
We've already had a lengthy back and forth detailing all of this and then some and the posts were all deleted by mods for discussing what we think is/isn't acceptable discussion (frustrating, because I think I was making good points). So let's not go back to the beginning and start all over again.
 

krutovsdonut

eeyore
Sep 25, 2016
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^ He's putting up top six numbers now.

We've already had a lengthy back and forth detailing all of this and the posts were all deleted by mods. So let's not go back to the beginning and start all over again.

i don't think there's anything wrong with bringing up erikkson in a juolevi thread, personally.
 

Shareefruck

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i don't think there's anything wrong with bringing up erikkson in a juolevi thread, personally.
What the..... why are you being snarky and confrontational about that?

There isn't anything wrong with bringing up Eriksson in a thread about Juolevi, provided that the connection makes sense. It was used to illustrate that it doesn't make sense to dismiss or ban certain topics just because they can be politicized by people with agendas. Louie Eriksson's contract is relevant to discussion about him as a player. Just because we have discussed it in the past, and it can be used as a tool in regrettable pro/anti Benning rhetoric, doesn't mean it makes any sense to make it off limits to talk about. How unanimous our views are is irrelevant-- if it were less unanimous, there would be more reason to discuss something, not less.

It makes sense to allow people to talk about the circumstances of Juolevi's draft position (where Tkachuk would naturally come up), his current performance, and his future performance. None of that should be off limits, and neither one prevents people from talking about the other.
 
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Bleach Clean

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It makes sense to allow people to talk about the circumstances of Juolevi's draft position (where Tkachuk would naturally come up), his current performance, and his future performance. None of that should be off limits, and neither one prevents people from talking about the other.

But again, I had an entire discussion about this already and the dispute was deleted because it naturally gets into territory about what should/shouldn't be allowed in a thread, which mods don't like, so there's no point in restarting it just to end up with the same result.


To clarify, the result of said discussion is only 'out of bounds' in so far as it violates a site rule. If you can discuss it without breaking a site rule, feel free to continue.

Tkachuk has always been a point of comparison for Juolevi. This was true in previous Juolevi threads, so I'm not sure why it wouldn't be true now? The arguments that spring forth are the responsibilities of each individual poster. Tkachuk vs. Juolevi can be discussed without violation. Just as Keller/Juolevi or Sergachev/Juolevi can be discussed.

If you have further questions, feel free to PM me (goes for all posters).
 

Shareefruck

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To clarify, the result of said discussion is only 'out of bounds' in so far as it violates a site rule. If you can discuss it without breaking a site rule, feel free to continue.

Tkachuk has always been a point of comparison for Juolevi. This was true in previous Juolevi threads, so I'm not sure why it wouldn't be true now? The arguments that spring forth are the responsibilities of each individual poster. Tkachuk vs. Juolevi can be discussed without violation. Just as Keller/Juolevi or Sergachev/Juolevi can be discussed.

If you have further questions, feel free to PM me (goes for all posters).
Yeah, but the point of contention we had was about why it does or doesn't make sense to allow people to bring up Tkachuk in a Juolevi thread despite the toxicity that it gets associated with. Any continued reasoning about that is probably going to go down the path of "playing moderator."

Besides, after losing that whole discussion in the blink of an eye, it feels like too much wasted effort to tip-toe-around that and continue forward with it anyways.
 
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krutovsdonut

eeyore
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Besides, after losing that whole discussion in the blink of an eye, it feels like too much wasted effort to tip-toe-around that and continue forward with it anyways.

you may not be aware that a lot of that discussion got undeleted. read what ronning on empty said carefully and look at the edits.
 

Shareefruck

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Apr 2, 2005
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The bit w/ krutovsdonut was undeleted. I had a lengthier discussion w/ the other poster that more clearly illustrated my feelings on the matter.
In any case, it's fine, let's just move on.
 
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