OHL Trades 2016-17 Season Thread

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youngblood10

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Jan 26, 2010
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Player movement does make for a good discussion but the driving force behind the way it has evolved is that the league is watered down. Because of this there is only so many elite players to go around and they have all the leverage as to where to play. (not that i'm against that) But because of that leverage an unproportionate amount of that talent ends up on only a small number of teams. If the league had 10-12 teams I believe the trading dynamic would be drastically different and deals would be much more balanced in the traditional sense. Player for Player, teams strength/weakness addressing other teams strength/weakness etc..

But as long as money is being made and fans are forking over the cash this is the way it will continue be, a three tier league. The Knights, the rest and the NTC, collect your picks for your star player every deadline under .500 teams.
 

RayzorIsDull

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Player movement does make for a good discussion but the driving force behind the way it has evolved is that the league is watered down. Because of this there is only so many elite players to go around and they have all the leverage as to where to play. (not that i'm against that) But because of that leverage an unproportionate amount of that talent ends up on only a small number of teams. If the league had 10-12 teams I believe the trading dynamic would be drastically different and deals would be much more balanced in the traditional sense. Player for Player, teams strength/weakness addressing other teams strength/weakness etc..

But as long as money is being made and fans are forking over the cash this is the way it will continue be, a three tier league. The Knights, the rest and the NTC, collect your picks for your star player every deadline under .500 teams.

Terrific post and I mentioned a long time earlier there's no reason why a team like London should have the same amount of gold education packages available as one of the poorer teams. Just as the 1st overall pick in the OHL shouldn't be getting the same education package as the #17 or #18 pick. This is how you create competitive imbalance in the league structure.

How can the league be happy that Saginaw the past 2 years have forked over Sadowy and Stephens for a boatload of draft picks and I believe not one roster player in return?
 

Buttsy

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Jul 28, 2015
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The one thing that I've seen suggested on Twitter, that makes a lot of sense IMO, is moving the trade deadline to coincide with the end of the first semester for high school kids to limit the educational disruption.

I suppose having the way it is now works out well for the University aged players but a lot of those players tend to be... less than full time.

I can see merit in this one and could enhance the opportunities for the vast majority of OHL players to complete their education. The vast majority being the kids that don't play pro hockey after they "age" out.
 

Fastpace

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Jul 25, 2015
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They may need to start looking at allowing trading first round picks, I know I'll get chewed up for bringing this up but how else are they going to control all this rediculous trading madness. Beside, that first drafted player will likely be traded in year or so later anyway (ex. see McShane Erie to Oshawa).

They will need to do something or pretty soon will see 20 picks for one player trade and some trading future players may not even be part of this world yet at the time of completion of the trade !!!
 

The Howler

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Dec 9, 2015
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They may need to start looking at allowing trading first round picks, I know I'll get chewed up for bringing this up but how else are they going to control all this rediculous trading madness. Beside, that first drafted player will likely be traded in year or so later anyway (ex. see McShane Erie to Oshawa).

They will need to do something or pretty soon will see 20 picks for one player trade and some trading future players may not even be part of this world yet at the time of completion of the trade !!!
Whats the big deal, we are only talking about 3 or 4 teams. Its only the large center teams that compete year after year. Small centers are only practice for the play offs.
 

Nabru

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Aug 29, 2009
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Player movement does make for a good discussion but the driving force behind the way it has evolved is that the league is watered down. Because of this there is only so many elite players to go around and they have all the leverage as to where to play. (not that i'm against that) But because of that leverage an unproportionate amount of that talent ends up on only a small number of teams. If the league had 10-12 teams I believe the trading dynamic would be drastically different and deals would be much more balanced in the traditional sense. Player for Player, teams strength/weakness addressing other teams strength/weakness etc..

But as long as money is being made and fans are forking over the cash this is the way it will continue be, a three tier league. The Knights, the rest and the NTC, collect your picks for your star player every deadline under .500 teams.

Just because London is better at what they do compared to other big market teams, doesn't make them their own tier. Obviously ther are advantages London has over OS, Soo, Saginaw but teams like Kitchener and Windsor can use those same advantages London has. Just sayin...
 

Firebrd828

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Oct 21, 2015
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...The draft could not be shortened until a point where no round 11 - 15 choices have been traded...

This is actually a change that could be implemented immediately...all the OHL would have to do is allow teams that have 10th-15th round picks that were acquired via trade go ahead and make those picks in order after the initial 10 rounds are completed.

I've often thought that the OHL drafts FAR too many rounds, especially when you can only add 4 of those drafted players to your roster in that particular season. I see 10 rounds as a much more practical number.
 

aresknights

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Dec 27, 2009
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Just because London is better at what they do compared to other big market teams, doesn't make them their own tier. Obviously ther are advantages London has over OS, Soo, Saginaw but teams like Kitchener and Windsor can use those same advantages London has. Just sayin...

If Hamilton is run correctly they should be a "have" as well.
Bigger city,university town with great resources, lots of seats, central location.....
 

EvenSteven

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Sep 3, 2009
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If Hamilton is run correctly they should be a "have" as well.
Bigger city,university town with great resources, lots of seats, central location.....

100% agree. I said exactly that back when Erie was rumored to be moved there. That Hamilton would work as an OHL city and should be right up there with the "haves" in this league. Many said they failed there three times already (Fincups, Steelhawks, Dukes) and proved they weren't an OHL town. The last time they had an OHL team was in the very early 90's. That was 25 years ago. This league is a way different league than it was back in those days.
 

youngblood10

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Jan 26, 2010
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Just because London is better at what they do compared to other big market teams, doesn't make them their own tier. Obviously ther are advantages London has over OS, Soo, Saginaw but teams like Kitchener and Windsor can use those same advantages London has. Just sayin...

I guess they could but I'm being realistic, nobody can match the Hunters work ethic, their eye for talent, their ability to develop talent, the commitment and work ethic on and off the ice of every kid they bring in. Add in all the other advantages with the best fan base in all of junior hockey filling the rink every Friday night. London is on another level than any team in the country not just the OHL. The numbers and results don't lie. Don't take me putting the Knights on their own tier as a knock. It's ok to be head and shoulders better than the rest in every category.
 

Nabru

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Aug 29, 2009
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I guess they could but I'm being realistic, nobody can match the Hunters work ethic, their eye for talent, their ability to develop talent, the commitment and work ethic on and off the ice of every kid they bring in. Add in all the other advantages with the best fan base in all of junior hockey filling the rink every Friday night. London is on another level than any team in the country not just the OHL. The numbers and results don't lie. Don't take me putting the Knights on their own tier as a knock. It's ok to be head and shoulders better than the rest in every category.

Fair enough. I've watched the Knights before the Hunters and even I get tired of hearing the over the top praise. They're good hockey people but probably overrated and I can admit that. Once the mdia gets a story they run with it.

This topic comes up every year about parity and yes there is a parity problem but I think it has more to do with the East/West than London/everyone else. Erie has remained around the top of the West for 4 straight years despite losing McDavid in 2015. A better example the Soo - won over 50 games in 2015 and 2 years later are back at the top of the West. OS is always competitive and wins games against 'have teams'. Those teams clearly don't have the competitive advantages London has but still know how to win.

If I'm a team like Saginaw, I look at what Soo or Erie are doing to put good products on the ice every year, not London. They can't operate like London but they can make do with what they have like oher teams in their tier have done.
 

The Prophet

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Apr 6, 2016
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They may need to start looking at allowing trading first round picks, I know I'll get chewed up for bringing this up but how else are they going to control all this rediculous trading madness. Beside, that first drafted player will likely be traded in year or so later anyway (ex. see McShane Erie to Oshawa).

They will need to do something or pretty soon will see 20 picks for one player trade and some trading future players may not even be part of this world yet at the time of completion of the trade !!!

The QMJHL can trade 1st round picks before the draft happens.
 

dirty12

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Mar 6, 2015
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Fair enough. I've watched the Knights before the Hunters and even I get tired of hearing the over the top praise. They're good hockey people but probably overrated and I can admit that. Once the mdia gets a story they run with it.

This topic comes up every year about parity and yes there is a parity problem but I think it has more to do with the East/West than London/everyone else. Erie has remained around the top of the West for 4 straight years despite losing McDavid in 2015. A better example the Soo - won over 50 games in 2015 and 2 years later are back at the top of the West. OS is always competitive and wins games against 'have teams'. Those teams clearly don't have the competitive advantages London has but still know how to win.

If I'm a team like Saginaw, I look at what Soo or Erie are doing to put good products on the ice every year, not London. They can't operate like London but they can make do with what they have like oher teams in their tier have done.

They have been watching. Trade the best players for loads of picks, finish near the bottom for a few years; then, in a few years they are good teams for a few years.
 

Firebrd828

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Oct 21, 2015
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They have been watching. Trade the best players for loads of picks, finish near the bottom for a few years; then, in a few years they are good teams for a few years.

The OHL's new slogan..."We're the two worst parts of both college and professional athletics all wrapped up in one little package!":laugh:
 

h10*

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Jan 12, 2011
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Fair enough. I've watched the Knights before the Hunters and even I get tired of hearing the over the top praise. They're good hockey people but probably overrated and I can admit that. Once the mdia gets a story they run with it.

This topic comes up every year about parity and yes there is a parity problem but I think it has more to do with the East/West than London/everyone else. Erie has remained around the top of the West for 4 straight years despite losing McDavid in 2015. A better example the Soo - won over 50 games in 2015 and 2 years later are back at the top of the West. OS is always competitive and wins games against 'have teams'. Those teams clearly don't have the competitive advantages London has but still know how to win.

If I'm a team like Saginaw, I look at what Soo or Erie are doing to put good products on the ice every year, not London. They can't operate like London but they can make do with what they have like oher teams in their tier have done.

And in the midst of all the success for Erie they go bankrupt and sell the team..
Well I mean the bankruptcy was a result of 10 years of crap but still..

It's tough sledding for about 12 teams in the league. Erie to me is still one of them. They will be rebuilding the next 2-3 years and they will go back to "normalcy"
They still don't have any advantages at all. And the advantages they appear to have had over the last few years - McDavid, new arena, good fans, solid city, great coach blah blah blah... all it led to was no championships so far.

I'm always going to believe if our advantages went a bit further and our organizations pockets ran a bit deeper.. Erie would have one at least 1 championship with McDavid because guys like Dylan Larkin, Drake Caggiula, Anton Karlsson, Riley Sheahan would have reported to Erie.
So though Erie did what they did recently, it was mostly because McDavid and then as a result Knoblauch were willing to give this city a chance and show that "hey guess what other teams in the ohl can have success and can be a fun place to play"
McDavid the only kid mature enough to see that. Wish more would follow.
But still Erie then grew there team through HARD WORK and getting late round steals NOT college commits in the late rounds. But getting guys that needed to develop a lot before ever playing in the league. Connor Brown, Travis Dermott, Darren Raddysh, Jordan Sambrook, TJ Fergus.

Erie worked hard for that. But their advantages, or lack of advantages I should say, didn't allow them to get the college commit guys- Colton Point, Owen Headrick, Tyler Gratton- and not for a lack of effort- don't give me the lack of effort crap. Erie just pursued heavily for Headrick in the last week. But their organization isn't as enticing as some even with success. It's remarkable we still can't get "steals" like that

I don't know, give us Point, Headrick, Gratton for this team and Erie would be the unquestionable favorite.


Point is that Erie worked very hard where they are but they won't be able to broke through the ceiling to get to Windsor or London or Kitcheners spot. They must draft very well and trade very well to ever win. Can't rely on college kids or free agents .. even with recent success
 

EON

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While this has been some very interesting discussion, it has strayed far off the topic of "OHL Trades".

If someone would like to start a thread to further discuss different OHL franchises and how they are run, competitive advantages, rule changes, etc, so be it.
 

ScoresFromCentre

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Jan 29, 2016
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Well, to be fair, EON, there won't be any more trades in 2016-2017 OHL season!

I actually wanted to make a topic about this but didn't want to step on h10's toes, but as he seems fine with that I likely will go ahead and do so, with the caveat that it not turn into a referendum on whether the London Knights are good for the OHL. (Goodness knows that's been done before.)
 

h10*

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Jan 12, 2011
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Well, to be fair, EON, there won't be any more trades in 2016-2017 OHL season!

I actually wanted to make a topic about this but didn't want to step on h10's toes, but as he seems fine with that I likely will go ahead and do so, with the caveat that it not turn into a referendum on whether the London Knights are good for the OHL. (Goodness knows that's been done before.)

Go right ahead! Always a good discussion
 

rolf smitty

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May 20, 2013
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The OHL's new slogan..."We're the two worst parts of both college and professional athletics all wrapped up in one little package!":laugh:
Good fortune shines on the Knights again, as one of their owners sent a player back from Columbus' organization to be traded to his Jr. A team in London. Quite a coincidence; surprising Salituro didn't end up in Windsor, Erie, or the Soo, they would all have had an opportunity(not).
 

TheCoach

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Sep 17, 2014
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Good fortune shines on the Knights again, as one of their owners sent a player back from Columbus' organization to be traded to his Jr. A team in London. Quite a coincidence; surprising Salituro didn't end up in Windsor, Erie, or the Soo, they would all have had an opportunity(not).

give it a break already stop whining:handclap:
 
Good fortune shines on the Knights again, as one of their owners sent a player back from Columbus' organization to be traded to his Jr. A team in London. Quite a coincidence; surprising Salituro didn't end up in Windsor, Erie, or the Soo, they would all have had an opportunity(not).

If they really played the system as you've hinted at..they wouldn't have needed to acquire Salituro...Marner would be back in London.:D

It's called knowing the right people and asking the right questions.
 

Diaero

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Nov 29, 2016
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If they really played the system as you've hinted at..they wouldn't have needed to acquire Salituro...Marner would be back in London.:D

It's called knowing the right people and asking the right questions.

or it's called having a systemic advantage that the league is completely on board with as it helps the CHL outshine the NCAA.

I'll never throw it in a Knights fans face or hold it against the players for choosing to play there but man, it's hard reading that the Knights are just really good at running an organization and other teams could do it too if they "knew the right people or asked the right questions". Total bollocks.
 

Millpond

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Dec 5, 2015
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I think teams with good, stable management teams tend to perform the best .

Does this lead them to participate in the trade frenzy every year ?
Some do some don't.

The Rangers under Hiebert seem to be a little rudderless just now.

The Attack on the other hand, under DeGray approach the trade deadline with caution. DeGray prefers to make his deals before the prices escalate. This year he's made four deals for, you guessed it , picks, not players. For his haul, four fairly decent pieces cost him exactly four picks.

The Attack may not earn a spot to Windsor in May, but they're in the mix, and have not sold the farm. How has DeGray done this with a small bank account?
Prefers to develop from within. The Attack have had great success with home grown goalies.

Took a chance on Mete, and was rewarded with two nice building blocks in Suzuki and Phillips the following year. Targets players he wants, and is willing to wait, sometimes years to aquire.

Quickly adapted his team from a dump and chase, chippy grinding team to a fast puck possession team.
I used to believe the Attack would be better served by pushing to play in the weaker east. DeGray has always insisted he wants the team right where they are . Better competition, better gates, better team. It can be done in smaller markets, just requires more creativity, patience and sticking to the plan.

Bringing in McGill was a very astute move. More about timing really, but here's a guy with two Memorial Cup rings to his name coaching junior hockey in small markets. His formula works .

Branch eluded the other day that the league was ok with trading picks into the next decade, rather than move young players enrolled in school. So I don't see anything changing in that regard any time soon.
Those who drive the bus ( and own most of it) always get to steer.
The rest are passengers merely along for the ride.
 
or it's called having a systemic advantage that the league is completely on board with as it helps the CHL outshine the NCAA.

I'll never throw it in a Knights fans face or hold it against the players for choosing to play there but man, it's hard reading that the Knights are just really good at running an organization and other teams could do it too if they "knew the right people or asked the right questions". Total bollocks.

Yep...you're right. They circumvent every rule and actually have their own set of rules..in fact...it's free reign..they can do whatever they want. Actually..players call them and ask if they can play there..they don't even have a scouting staff. Player's families actually PAY the Knights to play in London.
 
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