Speculation: Offseason coaching thread: Should they stay or should they go?

[Empoleon8771]

He also said both the team and Sully could use a fresh start. I think there is a disagreement between FSG and Dubas on coaching. My guess is one isnt completely sold on Sully, probably Dubas.

I think everyone involved with the Penguins from ownership, Dubas and the players think very highly of Sullivan. I think Dubas may legitimately want a change, both for the team and Sullivan, but it's a tight line to tow with how the core seemingly loves Sullivan.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I think everyone involved with the Penguins from ownership, Dubas and the players think very highly of Sullivan. I think Dubas may legitimately want a change, both for the team and Sullivan, but it's a tight line to tow with how the core seemingly loves Sullivan.

Which would be fine if we weren't supposedly supposed to be competing. It's why I can't really take this team seriously when they claim they want to rebuild on the fly or make the postseason.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Which would be fine if we weren't supposedly supposed to be competing. It's why I can't really take this team seriously when they claim they want to rebuild on the fly or make the postseason.

I think everyone involved with this team knows that this team isn't an actual contender anymore and their upside is an early playoff loss.

Idk, maybe I've just come to terms with it, but this team is highly mid. I have a hard time getting huffy about them not firing Sullivan, even though I think it's overdue, because I just don't view this team as anything special with or without firing Sullivan.

If they fired Sullivan at some point this year, they probably make the playoffs with like 5 or 6 more points in the standings and then get absolutely smoked in round 1. It's just tough for me to get mad about them not doing that because the team just isn't very good anymore.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I think everyone involved with this team knows that this team isn't an actual contender anymore and their upside is an early playoff loss.

Idk, maybe I've just come to terms with it, but this team is highly mid. I have a hard time getting huffy about them not firing Sullivan, even though I think it's overdue, because I just don't view this team as anything special with or without firing Sullivan.

I on the other hand find Sullivan's brand of hockey extremely boring, so of course I don't care that Sid would cry if Sullivan left. I also think Mike Sullivan is a moron and the coaching equivalent of Craig Adams, but hey, I'm glad he has friends.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I on the other hand find Sullivan's brand of hockey extremely boring, so of course I don't care that Sid would cry if Sullivan left. I also think Mike Sullivan is a moron and the coaching equivalent of Craig Adams, but hey, I'm glad he has friends.

This is where I'm at. It's not even about the new guy coming in and making the team so much better. It's about being absolutely sick and tired of Sullivan hockey and having to watch what amounts to watching grass grow for 3 hours every game.

I'm sick of his cliches, I'm sick of his smug "it's never my fault it's the players not executing", I'm sick of this idea that he's a generational coach thing. The results could very well stay the same, but the ... ehem ... process wouldn't be nearly as infuriating.

 

[Pancakes]

Idk, maybe I've just come to terms with it, but this team is highly mid. I have a hard time getting huffy about them not firing Sullivan, even though I think it's overdue, because I just don't view this team as anything special with or without firing Sullivan.

How could you not be irritated with missing the playoffs two years in a row when this team should have made it both years?

I agree that Sullivan probably isn't costing us cups or anything. But then again you never know. Florida made a run to the finals last year. Montreal made one a few years ago. Whose to say this team couldn't have done the same with two shots at it?

But more than that I'm just tired of watching the same issues for years and years in a row. It kinda wears on me as a fan to watch the powerplay continue to stink, the team continue to blow third period leads, the goaltending continue to be suspect when it matters. The finishing continue to blow.

Idk give me some new problems lol. Maybe a new coach would have their own warts but they'd be different warts.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Yeah, and lest we forget, this isn't Dubas' first GM job. He knows how things go and should have the experience to do what needs to be done-- that's why he hired himself as GM in the first place, supposedly.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

This team is absolutely, without a doubt too arrogant to accept/admit they're extremely distant afterthoughts when it comes to competing anymore. They probably think this has been a crazy stretch of unfortunate events since 2018.

Also, I cannot f***ing believe Reirden still has a job. There's no need to even discuss anything with Golden Boy Sullivan.

But again, this organization's nothing if not inept, dysfunctional, and arrogant as shit.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

We should have NEVER trusted a guy named Kyle. This is kind of on us, really.

 

[66-30-33]

Yeah, and lest we forget, this isn't Dubas' first GM job. He knows how things go and should have the experience to do what needs to be done-- that's why he hired himself as GM in the first place, supposedly.

This is the first GM job he doesn't need to have Shanny approve him, or a board like in Toronto. He just says "What would Kyle do?" and do that.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think I'm going to be done talking about Sullivan on this site, because anything that isn't "fire him today in a humiliating fashion" gets everyone all riled up and just repeats the same arguments that have been said for 5 years in a row.

He should have been fired years ago and I want him fired, he's Mike Babcock if Mike Babcock wasn't an asshole.

 

[Pancakes]

This team is absolutely, without a doubt too arrogant to accept/admit they're extremely distant afterthoughts when it comes to competing anymore. They probably think this has been a crazy stretch of unfortunate events since 2018.

Also, I cannot f***ing believe Reirden still has a job. There's no need to even discuss anything with Golden Boy Sullivan.

But again, this organization's nothing if not inept, dysfunctional, and arrogant as shit.

Distant afterthoughts or not they should still have been playoff teams both this year and last.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I think I'm going to be done talking about Sullivan on this site, because anything that isn't "fire him today in a humiliating fashion" gets everyone all riled up and just repeats the same arguments that have been said for 5 years in a row.

He should have been fired years ago and I want him fired, he's Mike Babcock if Mike Babcock wasn't an asshole.

Calmer than you are, dude.

 

[Pancakes]

Calmer than you are, dude.

I HAD BUDDIES THAT DIED FACE DOWN IN THE MUCK SO YOU AND I CAN ENJOY THIS FAMILY HFBOARDS!

I'm stayin'. I'm finishin' my posting about Mike Sullivan. Enjoying my posting about Mike Sullivan

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

How could you not be irritated with missing the playoffs two years in a row when this team should have made it both years?

I agree that Sullivan probably isn't costing us cups or anything. But then again you never know. Florida made a run to the finals last year. Montreal made one a few years ago. Whose to say this team couldn't have done the same with two shots at it?

But more than that I'm just tired of watching the same issues for years and years in a row. It kinda wears on me as a fan to watch the powerplay continue to stink, the team continue to blow third period leads, the goaltending continue to be suspect when it matters. The finishing continue to blow.

Idk give me some new problems lol. Maybe a new coach would have their own warts but they'd be different warts.

Their final game was the first time I can remember in the past 20 years that I didn't at least have the game on in the background to see how they were doing. This team has very much turned me off. If Sid and Geno were skating around with their walkers and we had no chance of the playoffs, I'd still tune in. But the fact this iteration has become so arrogant and boring, I find myself less attached as the days go by.

As a poster who is from out of town and went to extremely great lengths in the past 20 years to watch the Pens online, this should be really concerning for the organization. But if they don't care, about how this is trending, I guess I shouldn't either.

 

[HandshakeLine]

This is the first GM job he doesn't need to have Shanny approve him, or a board like in Toronto. He just says "What would Kyle do?" and do that.

Which suggests to me that actually Shanny and the board didn't really hold back Dubas' genius like people think.

It's just kind of weird to me that he had been supposedly hindered in his previous job, got this job with a blank check to remake the team as he sees fit... and then he's basically continuing to do the same thing that Hextall did with a few slightly flashier moves but less success.

I was expecting him to come in and radically reshape the team to fit his "vision" like every other GM has done, and yet, we're still waiting.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Which suggests to me that actually Shanny and the board didn't really hold back Dubas' genius like people think.

It's just kind of weird to me that he had been supposedly hindered in his previous job, got this job with a blank check to remake the team as he sees fit... and then he's basically continuing to do the same thing that Hextall did with a few slightly flashier moves but less success.

I was expecting him to come in and radically reshape the team to fit his "vision" like every other GM has done, and yet, we're still waiting.

It's a process, buddy. It's gonna take a couple few hundred weeks, OK? You CAN'T just start like... doin' stuff all willy nilly without wasting at least an entire season to "evaluate." Especially when the only guys who can still do f***-all on your team are ancient. That's the PERFECT time to fart around!

 

[HandshakeLine]

Maybe we're all wrong and he has an extremely small amount of freedom, but then why give the guy two positions and no oversight besides ownership?

It's a process, buddy. It's gonna take a couple few hundred weeks, OK? You CAN'T just start like... doin' stuff all willy nilly without wasting at least an entire season to "evaluate." Especially when the only guys who can still do f***-all on your team are ancient. That's the PERFECT time to fart around!

It's amazing how much we have to be patient and trust the process, our game is truly gotten to.

 

[66-30-33]

Which suggests to me that actually Shanny and the board didn't really hold back Dubas' genius like people think.

It's just kind of weird to me that he had been supposedly hindered in his previous job, got this job with a blank check to remake the team as he sees fit... and then he's basically continuing to do the same thing that Hextall did with a few slightly flashier moves but less success.

I was expecting him to come in and radically reshape the team to fit his "vision" like every other GM has done, and yet, we're still waiting.

I'll give it another year but I am not that high on him anyway. We got our cups.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I'll give it another year but I am not that high on him anyway.

Yeah, I'm getting the feeling he has either no plan or he's a paper tiger who is out of his depth but had the excuses of Shanahan and the board in Toronto.

If we don't see some sort of decisions by the draft, it's going to be just pure madness watching people theorycast about what moves Dubas is gearing up to make, only to see them immediately piviot to the next theoretical moves when he does nothing of note.

 

[chethejet]

Sullivan will be back as the issues are more than him. Yes PP and OT record are on him as he is the head coach. But Dubas can make changes to the coaching and structure to ensure Sullivan only does what he does best. Player decisions are adding younger players and opening up competition for bottom 6. Obvious issues of Sid, moving Smith, Graves, Jarry and what another year of Malkin brings. Letang injured all year is something that has to be dealt with or retire/LTIR. But the team actually played well enough with modest changes of Ruhwedel traded and adding St Ivany and Bunting a nice fit on the second line.

 

[Andy99]

Dubas essentially said he's going to evaluate the staff with Sullivan tells me there will be a few changes.

According to DK's Insider piece, expect zero changes lol.

--He's heard nothing about any assistants being in jeopardy of losing their jobs. No chance Sullivan is. The assistants tend to happen quickly to let them catch on with another team.

--Jake Guentzel just sold his house to Bryan Rust. (I think that's enough info there to anyone who thinks Jake is coming back)

--Ned has not been approached about a contract extension. He'd love to stay as his family lives in the Cleveland suburbs.

--Pettersson has not been approached about a contract extension.

--Doesn't think Jarry will be traded because he doesn't think a team will take on that $/term combo, plus he has 12 team NTC

--Pretty much same thing for Graves.

 

[HandshakeLine]

grimly lmao

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Yeah, I'm getting the feeling he has either no plan or he's a paper tiger who is out of his depth but had the excuses of Shanahan and the board in Toronto.

If we don't see some sort of decisions by the draft, it's going to be just pure madness watching people theorycast about what moves Dubas is gearing up to make, only to see them immediately piviot to the next theoretical moves when he does nothing of note.

I'm in a holding pattern with Dubas. He hasn't been on the job for a year, so we'll see what tricks he's got up his sleeve between now and opening night puck drop.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

According to DK's Insider piece, expect zero changes lol.

--He's heard nothing about any assistants being in jeopardy of losing their jobs. No chance Sullivan is. The assistants tend to happen quickly to let them catch on with another team.

--Jake Guentzel just sold his house to Bryan Rust. (I think that's enough info there to anyone who thinks Jake is coming back)

--Ned has not been approached about a contract extension. He'd love to stay as his family lives in the Cleveland suburbs.

--Pettersson has not been approached about a contract extension.

--Doesn't think Jarry will be traded because he doesn't think a team will take on that $/term combo, plus he has 12 team NTC

--Pretty much same thing for Graves.

I'm not sure how much I'd rely on DK, but it's bonkers that NEd doesn't seem to be in their plans.