Speculation: Off-Season Roster Building/Line Combos Thread

[Unsustainable]

One of the things I saw speculated earlier was Schmaltz + draft pick for Skinner + Faulk. Would fit our needs quite nicely and likely would Chicago's as well if they're really high on Saikura.

Schmaltz + Beaudin

I could see that. Even retain 50% on Skinner

 

[FreshSeabass]

I think Debrincat isn't even available unless an over payment. All things of interest from the hawks in a Skinner/Faulk trade is mainly whats been mentioned here Saad, Schmaltz, Nalimov, Beaudin.

 

[DaveG]

Schmaltz + Beaudin

I could see that. Even retain 50% on Skinner

Was thinking more
Skinner 50% + Faulk
for
Schmaltz, Nalimov, 1st

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I have a feeling we are going to be very disappointed in the return for Skinner and Faulk. Hope I'm wrong.

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

Lol if they do that...

Chicago’s gotta just blow it up at some point. Trading for Faulk and Skinner and giving up even more young players/futures would be like scooping the water out of the boat with a trash can. Yeah, better than a bucket and maybe it gets you to the playoffs next year, but it’s equally due to fail eventually and not nearly as good a solution as jumping ship.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I still think Chicago won't give up a roster player, at least a good one, as part of any deal. They are looking to add Skinner/Patches because they NEED more offensive talent. Moving Saad, Schmaltz, etc.. is 1 step forward, 1 step back. Gotta think they are looking at futures and futures only.

 

[A Star is Burns]

I have a feeling we are going to be very disappointed in the return for Skinner and Faulk. Hope I'm wrong.

Maybe. I don't think it'll be up to the level of Schmaltz and a 1st and possibly more, but it's good to hear that they have lofty values still on both guys. I think they'll end up going in separate deals, and we'll get one player that can make some sort of impact on our current roster, and probably 2-3 future pieces, whether draft picks or prospects. If we wanted to settle to the point of disappointment, I think they'd already be traded. Granted, they may end up getting solid value like I'm talking about, and depending on expectations around here, we get some disappointment.

For me, I'll be more disappointed if they aren't moved, but I'd rather go that route than get poor value. And that's only because of Skinner's contract situation, our RD situation, and the fact the I'm still on board with a bit more of a shake up. I still think both are good players, even if flawed.

 

[spockBokk]

Faulk pretty much must be moved at this point. His cap hit is dead money. I’m prepared to be underwhelmed too.

I personally think that time is not on our side. It could be argued that time is working for us if you think some GM will panic as September nears. The pessimist in me thinks that the longer we wait to deal Faulk the more desperate the braintrust will be to shed the contract for a lesser return.

I get the feeling too that Skinner must be moved too, but if we’re talking a futures only deal, I really worry about who will be regularly be putting pucks in the net, outside of Aho, on the team post-Skinner.

 

[GoldiFox]

Faulk pretty much must be moved at this point. His cap hit is dead money. I’m prepared to be underwhelmed too.

I personally think that time is not on our side. It could be argued that time is working for us if you think some GM will panic as September nears. The pessimist in me thinks that the longer we wait to deal Faulk the more desperate the braintrust will be to shed the contract for a lesser return.

I get the feeling too that Skinner must be moved too, but if we’re talking a futures only deal, I really worry about who will be regularly be putting pucks in the net, outside of Aho, on the team post-Skinner.

Trading Faulk before Karlsson is moved would cut out a whole section of the potential market. Not smart from an asset management standpoint.

Why does anyone think Skinner must be moved? If it makes sense, he will be moved. If it doesn’t, he will play out the year. Worst case he ends up walking for nothing like JVR. Based on Waddell’s comments at every mention of Skinner, I think they would prefer this outcome versus trading him for peanuts. Pushing for the Playoffs this year is more important than getting a late 1st for Skinner.

 

[The Faulker 27]

Losing Skinner for some meh-futures will make this team worse. That's no bueno. If they are planning on making the playoffs next season, they can't subtract a proven 30+ goal scorer and expect good results, unless someone with equal or similar impact comes back.

 

[A Star is Burns]

Trading Faulk before Karlsson is moved would cut out a whole section of the potential market. Not smart from an asset management standpoint.

Why does anyone think Skinner must be moved? If it makes sense, he will be moved. If it doesn’t, he will play out the year. Worst case he ends up walking for nothing like JVR. Based on Waddell’s comments at every mention of Skinner, I think they would prefer this outcome versus trading him for peanuts. Pushing for the Playoffs this year is more important than getting a late 1st for Skinner.

I don't think they must move him, but your worst case is pretty awful. I don't want to get peanuts for him either, and if he can get us to the playoffs and then walks for nothing, I'd take it at this point. But I do think the smart move is to try to move him. I think they are showing that they won't just trade guys for crap though, and I'm good with that. I've been on board with most of their moves so far, so I'll let it play out.

I will say though, as bad as your worst case is, the real worst case is he suffers an injury, doesn't help us to get to the playoffs, and we can't trade him for any value.

 

[Brock Anton]

Losing Skinner for some meh-futures will make this team worse. That's no bueno. If they are planning on making the playoffs next season, they can't subtract a proven 30+ goal scorer and expect good results, unless someone with equal or similar impact comes back.

Schmaltz isn’t “meh”. Dude is really good.

 

[tarheelhockey]

I don't think they must move him, but your worst case is pretty awful. I don't want to get peanuts for him either, and if he can get us to the playoffs and then walks for nothing, I'd take it at this point. But I do think the smart move is to try to move him. I think they are showing that they won't just trade guys for crap though, and I'm good with that. I've been on board with most of their moves so far, so I'll let it play out.

I will say though, as bad as your worst case is, the real worst case is he suffers an injury, doesn't help us to get to the playoffs, and we can't trade him for any value.

Worst case is a slight breeze gives him a Grade 3 concussion, ending his career.

 

[Unsustainable]

Schmaltz would make us way better.

Aho - Schmaltz - TT
Ferland - Necas - Svechnikov
McGinn - Staal - Williams
Foegele - Martinook - Rask

Slavin - Pesce
de Haan - Hamilton
Fluery - TVR

Damn. That would be nice.

Staal line takes the hardest assignment, Aho line 2nd hardest, Svechnikov line takes on weak lines, and a pretty good 4th line.

Every line has a physical presence.

 

[The Faulker 27]

Schmaltz isn’t “meh”. Dude is really good.

That'd be great if that was the "future" we get, but there's no way that's happening.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

I still think Chicago won't give up a roster player, at least a good one, as part of any deal. They are looking to add Skinner/Patches because they NEED more offensive talent. Moving Saad, Schmaltz, etc.. is 1 step forward, 1 step back. Gotta think they are looking at futures and futures only.

They also need a top 4 rhd.

Chicago fans on the trade board didn't flip out over Schmaltz for Faulk + Skinner, and were fine with Saad + protected 1st.

Regardless... at this point, you either package faulk, skinner and futures for a young center or keep skinner. no sense to not wait till the deadline if all you get are futures.

 

[Canes]

I have a feeling we are going to be very disappointed in the return for Skinner and Faulk. Hope I'm wrong.

I've thought this for awhile now given how much the organization is seemingly putting out there that these two are available. It's almost like we've said they're not going to be back no matter what, and now other GMs are probably lowballing us left and right trying to paint Waddell into a corner.

I hope we keep them if all we're getting is a mediocre futures package and/or spare parts. But I hope it doesn't turn into a Duchene like pouting situation given how much both guys' names have been out there yet they're still here waiting in limbo because I doubt Waddell will salvage the situation like Sakic did.

That said, I don't think we'll get Saad now and we definitely won't get a guy like Schmaltz unless we're adding quite a bit.

 

[Negan4Coach]

If Skinner and Faulk are moved for picks or spare parts- this team is doomed by Thanksgiving.

There is no reason to get rid of either of them- they actually score goals, I'm fine with shipping them off for a really solid C though. I dont get why they have to go.

I'd rather Skinner walks as a UFA at the end of next year and make the playoffs finally than get a late 1st rounder for him (that becomes nothing) and miss again.

 

[GoldiFox]

.. It's almost like we've said they're not going to be back no matter what, and now other GMs are probably lowballing us left and right trying to paint Waddell into a corner.

How so? Because what Waddell and co have actually said is that both could end up back with the Canes next year. They are already planning for that outcome.

The last article the N&O wrote on Skinner was literally:
What Brind'Amour plans to do if Jeff Skinner stays with the Hurricanes

"I've been around Jeff, I know him," Brind'Amour said. "Jeff's one of the smartest players we have. He knows how to play. I think he hasn't been held quite to the standard we need to hold him to. I think if he is, and realizes, 'Man, I've got to do it that way or I won't get out here,' I think you'll see a different Jeff Skinner.

Don Waddell on Faulk post-De Haan signing:

"I don't feel an urgency to do something," general manager Don Waddell said "Certainly we'll look at all our options."

Can't be much more black and white. There is no corner to be painted into. Everyone knows the situation in Carolina, nobody is putting Waddell over a barrel for a $4.8 million top-4 RHD signed for 2 more years. The constant reports of other teams calling Waddell and the Canes responding with big expectations on returns (Schmaltz + 1st) should assuage that fear.

 

[Bridgeburner96]

I'd be more interested in Debrincat than Schmaltz because I'm more interested in goal scoring than a center. I think if you look at their goals and take into account shooting percentage Debrincat would have had about 17 goals at 10% shooting percentage and Schmaltz would have only had about 12 goals at a 10% shooting percentage. Of course with 28 goals Debrincat will probably be much less available. Anyways something to consider.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Debrincat vs Schmaltz is an incredibly tough choice. Which name would you rather hear Forslund say on a regular basis? Glad I’m not the one who has to make that call.

 

[Highway29]

I still think we should not trade Skinner, not yet at least.. But now I think we should trade Faulk. 1for1 trade might be difficult to pull out tho

 

[emptyNedder]

This might all work out--IF the Canes (really just those of us who waste time on this board) are willing to really wheel and deal.

Chicago is interested in Skinner. If Skinner is interested in Chicago, then Carolina can sign and trade. Eight years at 6.8 per year. Then trade Skinner for Saad and Lankinen. Saad doesn't have Skinner's offensive upside, but can be counted on for around 20 goals. Lankinen is young but could be the third goalie in the competition this preseason. If Lankinen shows NHL ability, then the trade is a big win. Since Saad is at $6M, Chicago still has cap room to pursue Pacioretty or other options.

But the Canes still need insurance at C--most of us agree that counting on both Aho and Necas to be fully ready from day one is a gamble. Nugent-Hopkins would be good insurance at C. So trade Hamilton to Edmonton for RNH.

While the D takes a hit--I expect Faulk would be somewhat better paired with de Haan, so it shouldn't be a disaster--the forwards are now super solid and the lineup possibilities are extremely flexible.

Aho and Necas are ready to go: Zykov/Aho/TT; RNH/Necas/Svech; Saad/Staal/Williams; Ferland/Rask/McGinn. RHN provides security for the two rookies due to his defense and face-off ability--though I admit his % is poor.

Necas needs some time in Charlotte: TAZ; Saad/RNH/Svec; Ferland/Staal/Williams; McGinn/Rask/Martinook.

Neither Aho nor Necas works at C: Aho/RNH/TT; Saad/Staal/Svech; Ferland/Rask/Williams;
McGinn/Martinook/Di Giuseppe.

The power play units: 1=Aho/TT/Svech/RNH/Faulk; 2=Staal/Williams/Zykov/Necas/Slavin or TVR or Pesce, which are the same options if Faulk is traded.

The big gain is on PK because both RNH and Saad can slide in. For what it is worth, Hamilton really hasn't played on the PK in his career.

The truth is Hamilton for RNH even works if Skinner remains in Raleigh.

I realize the trade is extremely unlikely, but it works on HF Boards!

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Can't be much more black and white. There is no corner to be painted into. Everyone knows the situation in Carolina, nobody is putting Waddell over a barrel for a $4.8 million top-4 RHD signed for 2 more years. The constant reports of other teams calling Waddell and the Canes responding with big expectations on returns (Schmaltz + 1st) should assuage that fear.

They pretty much have to say that though. They've been pretty much saying since the end of last season that they are trading Skinner. They've been openly criticizing his play via Cole and Brindy (we haven't held him accountable). He doesn't play in a way they want the team to play. I will be very surprised if he is on the roster on opening night. Just don't see it.

RE: Faulk. I can see a more compelling case to keep him, particularly since he is signed for an extra year, but I still think they move him. Canes now have 7 NHL defensemen, 4 of them being RHD that are on the roster. Provided they are all healthy by opening night, can't see them sitting one of the 7 in the press box. I guess they could send Fleury down as he still doesn't require to pass through waivers, but then they are playing a RHD on the LHD side.

 

[GoldiFox]

They pretty much have to say that though. They've been pretty much saying since the end of last season that they are trading Skinner. They've been openly criticizing his play via Cole and Brindy (we haven't held him accountable). He doesn't play in a way they want the team to play. I will be very surprised if he is on the roster on opening night. Just don't see it.

RE: Faulk. I can see a more compelling case to keep him, particularly since he is signed for an extra year, but I still think they move him. Canes now have 7 NHL defensemen, 4 of them being RHD that are on the roster. Provided they are all healthy by opening night, can't see them sitting one of the 7 in the press box. I guess they could send Fleury down as he still doesn't require to pass through waivers, but then they are playing a RHD on the LHD side.

They don’t have much choice with Skinner. If I had to guess I’d agree that Brind’amour doesn’t want him on his team. Unfortunately JR gave him a NMC and that just is what it is.

I see the Cole and Brind’Amour comments as them griefing Skinner into opening up his NMC to a wider market. Seems like tactic that is fairly common but rarely works. I’d be surprised at this point if most of Skinner’s main options weren’t exhausted. Either by lack of agreement on extension (maybe Skinner is asking too much), lack of acceptable trade assets (other teams are offering too little or just futures), intra-division (Pittsburgh, NJ, NYR, etc. are not ideal landing spots). We saw a ton of pre-Draft buzz that Skinner was most likely to be traded. I don’t think the lack of a trade was for lack of trying.

So the Canes are left keeping Skinner and waiting for a team to get desperate, a team to clear Cap space (Chicago?), injuries, etc to open an opportunity. That is probably less than a 50/50 shot at this point. Which is why you start to see reports like the N&O article regarding the Canes gameplanning to keep Skinner. Half last-ditch effort to drive up demand in the market and half preparing Canes fans for life with Skinner next year despite every report this offseason saying the opposite.