Blue Jays Discussion: Off-season Edition II - Winter Meeting Madness

[BertCorbeau]

Need a new thread to get some Jays news going

Click to read more...

 

[kb]

That almost seems like a bad deal for the Sox.

Kopech put up 2.2 WAR last year in 25 starts with relatively good peripherals with the added bonus of being under team control until 2025. Hendriks has been one of the better relievers in baseball over the last 4 or so seasons and last year was no different with a FIP just barely above 1 and a 142 ERA+ (1.7 WAR)

The only issue with this is Hendriks makes a pretty hefty chunk of change for a reliever.

Another thing i think that will hurt is the fact the league knows the Jays basically have to move a catcher and Sean Murphy is still floating out there.

That's a deal i would consider for Jansen but under no circumstances would i for Kirk.

Agree with the entire sentiment here. I would do it for Jansen (not a chance in heck for Kirk), but it seems on the surface to be an overpay by the Sox.
Having said that, I don't think Murphy really factors into Jansen's market all that much - as he is seen to have more than twice the surplus value as opposed to Jansen, (51.3 vs 24.9), and plus the A's routinely prioritize maximizing the years of control on MLB ready players above all else. That makes the White Sox a poor trading partner for the A's, IMO.

The White Sox do have decent SP with Cease and Giolito (who had a Berrios type season), along with Lance Lynn and Mike Clevinger for their top-4 in the rotation.

Perhaps send back a BP arm with Jansen? Their BP does look suspect even before removing Hendricks, so there is that.

 

[Blitzkrug]

Miami is thankfully not stupid enough to even consider listening on Alcantara, as they shouldn't. As someone pointed out on reddit, the Jays have kinda made the Marlins look dumb in previous transactions;

2021: they donate Adam Cimber, a controllable and very good reliever, to the Blue Jays in exchange for half a season of washed up Joe Panik and a random minor league pitcher because the Jays were willing to eat like $4M of Corey Dickerson's salary

2022: they donate Anthony Bass, in the midst of an elite season and with a dirt cheap team option, and another good controllable reliever in Zach Pop for Jordan Groshans

 

[Blitzkrug]

The first domino on the trade market might be falling shortly;

 

[Woodman19]

That ought to get the catcher market going.

Had the thought today while out on a walk. Would anyone do Kirk/Moreno for both Nootbaar and Carlson?

 

[Ale Brew]

That ought to get the catcher market going.

Had the thought today while out on a walk. Would anyone do Kirk/Moreno for both Nootbaar and Carlson?

Would think we’d strongly consider it, but would the Cards?

Also read a report that the Cards are talking to Contreras. Would likely eliminate them from being a C trade partner for us. But if Murphy and Contreras are off the market then a Jays trade is likely the next dominos in the C market to fall.

 

[Cor]

The first domino on the trade market might be falling shortly;

This is good for the Jays I think.

Braves and Jays not exactly a good match trade wise, and it gets the other big catcher off the board.

 

[Blitzkrug]

This is good for the Jays I think.

Braves and Jays not exactly a good match trade wise, and it gets the other big catcher off the board.

It's definitely good. Murphy is the only other notable name on the market for catchers.

If someone else wants one, they need to come to the Jays now.

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[Blitzkrug]

Cleveland and St. Louis both make sense of the names listed. St. Louis needs their Yadi replacement and Cleveland needs something that will replace probably the worst hitter in baseball in Austin Hedges.

Another name out there that might complicate things for the Jays is Wilson Contreras. Nobody can seem to figure out what the Cubs are doing though, themselves included.

Edit: Holy shit i didn't realize Mike Zunino was that bad last season too. Woof.

 

[phillipmike]

With higher aims (and stakes), Winter Meetings are full of intrigue for Blue Jays

Back in 2019, the Blue Jays were trying to entice reluctant free agents. Now, they’re a wild-card club seeking to refine a strong group. But though they’re a more attractive venture, the work is more complicated — and has higher stakes.

www.sportsnet.ca

[Davidi] Jays “are believed to have discussed Pablo Lopez at the trade deadline,” “remain engaged with” Verlander, and “have long liked Kodai Senga.”

 

[Blitzkrug]

Another interesting thing to watch; the contemporary era committee is expected to vote today on their nominations for the Hall of Fame with these names on the ballot with the results expected after 8 ET.

-Albert Belle

-Barry Bonds

-Roger Clemens

-Don Mattingly

-Fred McGriff

-Dale Murphy

-Rafael Palmeiro

-Curt Schilling

Obviously the steroid thing will reign but i think it's horeshit Crime Dog isn't in the hall already. Dude would have had 500 HRs easily if not for the 94 lockout. Really all those names sans probably Murphy and depending where you stand on Donnie Baseball should be in there.

I might not like Schilling's leanings but i have a hard time agreeing with keeping it out giving some of the other malcontents you have in the hall already.

 

[Suntouchable13]

I'll be ecstatic if Jays land Verlander.

 

[Discoverer]

Another interesting thing to watch; the contemporary era committee is expected to vote today on their nominations for the Hall of Fame with these names on the ballot with the results expected after 8 ET.

-Albert Belle

-Barry Bonds

-Roger Clemens

-Don Mattingly

-Fred McGriff

-Dale Murphy

-Rafael Palmeiro

-Curt Schilling

Obviously the steroid thing will reign but i think it's horeshit Crime Dog isn't in the hall already. Dude would have had 500 HRs easily if not for the 94 lockout. Really all those names sans probably Murphy and depending where you stand on Donnie Baseball should be in there.

I might not like Schilling's leanings but i have a hard time agreeing with keeping it out giving some of the other malcontents you have in the hall already.

I feel pretty confident it'll be McGriff, Mattingly, and Murphy. Belle falls short, the steroid guys won't get enough support (even though I think they should be in), and everyone continues to hate Schilling because he's a piece of shit (which I fully support).

 

[Blitzkrug]

I feel pretty confident it'll be McGriff, Mattingly, and Murphy. Belle falls short, the steroid guys won't get enough support (even though I think they should be in), and everyone continues to hate Schilling because he's a piece of shit (which I fully support).

I wish i could speak on Murphy but he was way before my time. Looking at his stats he doesn't seem like a top flight HOF candidate, but nothing that screams "he's not good enough either." 2 MVPs has to be worth something right?

Mattingly was as well to be fair since his prime largely came before i was born but i at least know more about him.

 

[phillipmike]

 

[Blitzkrug]

Crime Dog the only one to clear the threshold. Unanimously too.

At some point you're going to have to let the steroid era guys in.

 

[Bjindaho]

Boston is expected to bid hard on Murphy

 

[dredeye]

Crime Dog the only one to clear the threshold. Unanimously too.

At some point you're going to have to let the steroid era guys in.

I was adamantly against Bonds ever getting in but have changed my thinking on it. The league turned a blind eye to it forever and then decided it had to be dealt with when they got exposed. It’s a bad look on the players and league for the era but it was what it was.

 

[Blitzkrug]

I was adamantly against Bonds ever getting in but have changed my thinking on it. The league turned a blind eye to it forever and then decided it had to be dealt with when they got exposed. It’s a bad look on the players and league for the era but it was what it was.

Pretty much where I stand. Bothers me selig is in when he turned a blind eye to it/willingly used it to boost the game's standing in the late 90s and then shamed everyone else.

He's just as guilty as your Bonds, Sosa's, etc.

 

[habamillions]

Someone last week said verlander to the dodgers for 2 years,90 mil.

 

[Discoverer]

I wish i could speak on Murphy but he was way before my time. Looking at his stats he doesn't seem like a top flight HOF candidate, but nothing that screams "he's not good enough either." 2 MVPs has to be worth something right?

Mattingly was as well to be fair since his prime largely came before i was born but i at least know more about him.

Interesting that it's just McGriff. He definitely deserves it.

I don't think Mattingly or Murphy's numbers are quite there... both had awesome peaks, but your peak needs to be unheard of if you lack the longevity. I just thought they would both get elected because they're the type of player I expect these committees to love (see Harold Baines, who was nowhere near as good as anyone on the ballot today and doesn't belong anywhere near the Hall of Fame).

 

[hockeywiz542]

Blue Jays ready to swap and shop as baseball Winter Meetings get under way

As Ross Atkins and the Blue Jays get set to ramp up their off season business, they do so with what they hope will be seen as ample currency

torontosun.com

The needs are clear for a team aiming to maximize the value of having stars such as Vlad Guerrero Jr., Bo Bichette, George Springer, Alek Manoah, Kevin Gausman and others in the fold. Time is also ticking for a Jays team that two months ago was flatly swept away by the Seattle Mariners in two demoralizing wildcard round games.

The needs are certainly clear for the Jays. As Atkins acknowledged at the Toronto chapter of the Baseball Writers Association of America luncheon this past week, starting pitching tops the to-do list. The team simply can’t afford to head to spring training with a rotation of Manoah, Gausman, Jose Berrios (ideally an improved version) and question mark, question mark.

With the hole in right following the Hernandez trade, there will be a re-order of the Jays outfield and ideally a left-handed bat will be brought in to the righty heavy order.

Not all of it needs to get accomplished this week, of course, and likely won’t. But the sense from Atkins is that things could move quickly at the first Winter Meetings session since 2019.

“When you come together, there’s power to that because everyone is maximizing those windows with other teams,” Atkins said. “We spend the bulk of our time with representatives of other players and with other teams, that does push things to the forefront.”

The Jays have certainly been a team able to make a splash in recent off-seasons, a process the front office hopes to continue from its base here on the San Diego waterfront.

“We are in a great position,” said Atkins, who suggested improvements are likely to come more through free agency than via trade. “We understand from a business and practical standpoint what we think is ideal for the Toronto Blue Jays organization and (Rogers) is 100 per cent on board with that.”

“We have a mutual understanding of where that range is and if we need to go past that, I’m sure they’ll answer the phone when (team president Mark Shapiro) phones.”

How that money could be spent should start to unfold over the next three days.

“We don’t have the full picture painted on exactly how to do A, B and C to make our team better,” Atkins said. “But we do have a very clear understanding of where we could take our next strategic step.”

 

[Amadeus]

Blue Jays ready to swap and shop as baseball Winter Meetings get under way

As Ross Atkins and the Blue Jays get set to ramp up their off season business, they do so with what they hope will be seen as ample currency

torontosun.com

The needs are clear for a team aiming to maximize the value of having stars such as Vlad Guerrero Jr., Bo Bichette, George Springer, Alek Manoah, Kevin Gausman and others in the fold. Time is also ticking for a Jays team that two months ago was flatly swept away by the Seattle Mariners in two demoralizing wildcard round games.

The needs are certainly clear for the Jays. As Atkins acknowledged at the Toronto chapter of the Baseball Writers Association of America luncheon this past week, starting pitching tops the to-do list. The team simply can’t afford to head to spring training with a rotation of Manoah, Gausman, Jose Berrios (ideally an improved version) and question mark, question mark.

With the hole in right following the Hernandez trade, there will be a re-order of the Jays outfield and ideally a left-handed bat will be brought in to the righty heavy order.

Not all of it needs to get accomplished this week, of course, and likely won’t. But the sense from Atkins is that things could move quickly at the first Winter Meetings session since 2019.

“When you come together, there’s power to that because everyone is maximizing those windows with other teams,” Atkins said. “We spend the bulk of our time with representatives of other players and with other teams, that does push things to the forefront.”

The Jays have certainly been a team able to make a splash in recent off-seasons, a process the front office hopes to continue from its base here on the San Diego waterfront.

“We are in a great position,” said Atkins, who suggested improvements are likely to come more through free agency than via trade. “We understand from a business and practical standpoint what we think is ideal for the Toronto Blue Jays organization and (Rogers) is 100 per cent on board with that.”

“We have a mutual understanding of where that range is and if we need to go past that, I’m sure they’ll answer the phone when (team president Mark Shapiro) phones.”

How that money could be spent should start to unfold over the next three days.

“We don’t have the full picture painted on exactly how to do A, B and C to make our team better,” Atkins said. “But we do have a very clear understanding of where we could take our next strategic step.”

This man should be in politics.

 

[phillipmike]

Max Scherzer’s potential Mets opt-out may bring deGrom déjà vu, shape pitching plan

Let’s flash forward 11 months when the Mets probably will be facing an opt-out situation with Max Scherzer.

nypost.com

[Sherman] Would a reclamation project with strikeout stuff such as Toronto’s Yusei Kikuchi be intriguing to the Mets — with his downside perhaps as a swing-and-miss lefty reliever?