Speculation: Nylander XVIII (all Nylander discussion here)

[4thline]

Wouldn't read too much into it.....remember Dubas himself said back in July that he'd sign everyone he needed to sign, without issue.

Life is such a fun game of telephone

 

[Dr Pepper]

Yeah Willy really showed him something, earning a reputation similar to his father, all the while sitting on his 60 points, while the teammate he was once compared to is on pace for a 100 point season. Great strategy Willy. You're a gentleman and a scholar.

Hey, no argument here, I've been saying all along that Nylander's botched this whole thing and torpedoed his own value by sitting on his hands for five months and refusing to play ball, as it were.

 

[DANTHEMAN1967]

"...we have significant pieces not here and they will be here." - Babcock

Everyone get ready to have your feather ruffled because someone in Leafs management said they will sign Nylander.

The Schrödinger's cat is out of the bag, welcome home Willie!

 

[Fogelhund]

Canes fans need to come back to reality, i understand loving your prospects, u guys have one of my top 3 prospects pool in the nhl, but while your team is far away from a title Nylander would be a huge uprade over all your forwards except Aho and would help your team reach the playoffs year after year.. If u really think Pesce + Necas or Gauthier or Kuokkanen is an overpayment wow u guys are crazy. And if your gm thinks the same well u can wait some more years for a playoff game.. He would have done this trade very very quick if Leafs would accept this..in the end I am confident Nylander will sign soon or will sit the season, he is not going to be traded unless a crazy offer

Adding Necas is an overpayment. Adding Kuokkanen is pretty close to value, maybe a small add from our side. Gauthier might need an add from their side.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

Canes fans need to come back to reality, i understand loving your prospects, u guys have one of my top 3 prospects pool in the nhl, but while your team is far away from a title Nylander would be a huge uprade over all your forwards except Aho and would help your team reach the playoffs year after year.. If u really think Pesce + Necas or Gauthier or Kuokkanen is an overpayment wow u guys are crazy. And if your gm thinks the same well u can wait some more years for a playoff game.. He would have done this trade very very quick if Leafs would accept this..in the end I am confident Nylander will sign soon or will sit the season, he is not going to be traded unless a crazy offer

Necas, Kuokkanen and Gauthier are not interchangeable adds. Necas came into the season as a fringe Top 10 prospect leaguewide. Kuokkanen is a step down. Gauthier is closer to two steps down. Pesce + Necas would be an awful trade. Pesce + Kuokkanen would be tough to stomach given the latter’s success in the AHL, but doable. Pesce + Gauthier is not objectionable.

 

[TML1967]

Necas, Kuokkanen and Gauthier are not interchangeable adds. Necas came into the season as a fringe Top 10 prospect leaguewide. Kuokkanen is a step down. Gauthier is closer to two steps down. Pesce + Necas would be an awful trade. Pesce + Kuokkanen would be tough to stomach given the latter’s success in the AHL, but doable. Pesce + Gauthier is not objectionable.

Yeah people needs to stop naming 3 prospects and pretending all have the same value.
I'd be down for a Necas+Pesce trade knowing we would need to add a good prospect going back the other way.

 

[powerstuck]

Canes fans need to come back to reality, i understand loving your prospects, u guys have one of my top 3 prospects pool in the nhl, but while your team is far away from a title Nylander would be a huge uprade over all your forwards except Aho and would help your team reach the playoffs year after year.. If u really think Pesce + Necas or Gauthier or Kuokkanen is an overpayment wow u guys are crazy. And if your gm thinks the same well u can wait some more years for a playoff game.. He would have done this trade very very quick if Leafs would accept this..in the end I am confident Nylander will sign soon or will sit the season, he is not going to be traded unless a crazy offer

You know same can be said about Leafs fans and the price you ask for Nylander. Also could be said about Pesce and your current defense squad.

 

[socko]

If we trade Willy for a prospect the guy I'd want is Cale Makar. I think this would be brilliant as it would open up all kinds of cap space for Dubas and maybe let us get someone like Mark Stone as a UFA with the same money we would have to overpay Willy with. Stone and Makar for Willy. Now that is value.

 

[Fogelhund]

You know same can be said about Leafs fans and the price you ask for Nylander. Also could be said about Pesce and your current defense squad.

Some Leafs fans have unrealistic expectations, some Hurricanes fans do too.... There seems to be quite a few of both that are quite rational though, which has created some decent conversations, (better than most HF boards trade threads) if we ignore the trolls, and those unrealistic people.

 

[Fogelhund]

If we trade Willy for a prospect the guy I'd want is Cale Makar. I think this would be brilliant as it would open up all kinds of cap space for Dubas and maybe let us get someone like Mark Stone as a UFA with the same money we would have to overpay Willy with. Stone and Makar for Willy. Now that is value.

I think Stone ends up getting North of $8 million... I don't think we could afford him at all. Kap is going to end up around $4+ now.... Marner $8-9, Matthews $10-11... Gardiner..... Nope, no money for a UFA like Stone.

 

[Kamiccolo]

Some Leafs fans have unrealistic expectations, some Hurricanes fans do too.... There seems to be quite a few of both that are quite rational though, which has created some decent conversations, (better than most HF boards trade threads) if we ignore the trolls, and those unrealistic people.

Most Leaf fans have such high demands because we don't want to trade him. He gets talked about as the 5th most important piece but that doesn't mean he is bad.. He is really really elite with a ton more potential. He just hasn't shown that potential to justify his contract demands which has been the point and why people think a bridge is coming.

You can have sky high potential while also not being worth 8M yet.

 

[BillNy]

We could make that decision easy...just win the cup this year.

If only the team wasn't giving ice time to Patrick Marleau, Connor Brown, Ron Hainsey, Nikita Zaitsev, and Igor Ozhiganov, that may even have been possible.

 

[Kamiccolo]

I think Stone ends up getting North of $8 million... I don't think we could afford him at all. Kap is going to end up around $4+ now.... Marner $8-9, Matthews $10-11... Gardiner..... Nope, no money for a UFA like Stone.

No chance they lock in Kap. One good season doesn't justify wasting the cap like that. He will get a bridge deal for like 2-3 years to prove he is legit and then either will be signed or will be dealt to recoup futures.

 

[BillNy]

I don't think Zaitsev is trash, though I do think we signed him to a long term deal, for too much, too soon. He's playing some pretty heavy minutes for against, plenty of Dzone starts, and not doing outright terribly. You get a guy like Pesce though, and he replaces what Zaitsev is doing now, and is much better at it... then the question is, is Zaitsev at second pairing D, for what he brings worth it? Well, you'd have the rest of the season to find out, wouldn't you? But if you get rid of him, is Hainsey the second pairing RD next year, OZ? Lilly? Still need someone there.

Hainsey is also trash. I'd take Holl over either. And like, Zaitsev may get rough minutes, but QoT matters way more to possession results than QoC, and his results are uh extremely bad. He's tanked both Rielly and Gardiner's possession numbers while playing with them. He's just not a real NHL player. There are a few guys on the Marlies better than him, and at this point, yes, I'm fine using a lefty on their off-side to dump him.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

Would you trade a new Ferarri for an older Civic because it's an ideal winter car? Just because something is a good positional fit doesn't mean it's a good value fit.

The difference in value between the two is not that significant.

Anyway, the point was not question why Leafs fans are balking at Pesce for Nylander. It’s was to question why Hamilton is so much more preferable than Pesce. To adapt your car analogy, it’s basically preferring to trade a new Mustang for a cheaper, gently used Mustang, when you’re likely better off with the more practical new Civic that frees up even more money in the budget to spend elsewhere.