Player Discussion: Morrissey's quiet redemption

[garret9]

Samberg-Pionk
Ekholm-DeMelo
Heinola-Morrissey
Stanley

 

[Teemusalami204]

Samberg-Pionk
Ekholm-DeMelo
Heinola-Morrissey
Stanley

switch Stanley and morrisey

 

[Whileee]

Samberg-Pionk
Ekholm-DeMelo
Heinola-Morrissey
Stanley

Or... trade Morrissey for Ekholm.

Ekholm-Pionk
Heinola-Savard
Samberg-DeMelo

Stanley-Poolman

I'm 56.5% serious.

 

[DRW204]

Title needs to change lol

 

[JetsFan815]

Title needs to change lol

More like "Morrissey superstar turning quiet".

 

[Heldig]

Yeah, pretty awful turn of events with Morrissey. From looking like a perfect 2D with upside to being a 3/4D. This has badly hurt the Jets. That it is no longer shocking that Jets fans even consider trading him is all you need to know. His game has fallen hard and fast.

 

[KB1971]

He seems to have adopted the Scheifele approach of playing as slow as possible & basically never play the body. I don't get it at all. He used to make a bad error a few times a seasons, now it's every game. It's far bigger issue than just not playing with Trouba.

 

[DRW204]

He seems to have adopted the Scheifele approach of playing as slow as possible & basically never play the body. I don't get it at all. He used to make a bad error a few times a seasons, now it's every game. It's far bigger issue than just not playing with Trouba.

agreed. this isn't exclusively a partner thing. yes, playing with beaulieu probably sucks and bleeds into his overall stats. however, watching morrissey he makes so many individual errors that we were not accustomed too when it was 44-8

 

[Guerzy]

I always thought Morrissey was a smart high hockey IQ player, and now you wonder wtf is going on. This leads me to believe we've got a dman that is likely struggling mightily for confidence, which I think can be linked to playing with defensive partners in which he cannot (for whatever reason) form quality chemistry with. For the love of god Maurice pair him back with Demelo and give them some games to see if we can see what we did last season. Or, call up Heinola and pair the two of them together. Enough is enough here with pairing Morrissey with the Poolmans and Beaulieus of the world. Just stop it already.

I'm just not ready to give up on this guy. He's too smart and skilled to be going the way he's going.

 

[Jet]

Samberg-Pionk
Ekholm-DeMelo
Heinola-Morrissey
Stanley

I wish.

 

[Jet]

He needs to regain his confidence. He really does need an experienced top pair guy to help him. He looks scared to make a mistake and that's made him tentative all over the ice. Paralysis by analysis.

 

[Jet]

He seems to have adopted the Scheifele approach of playing as slow as possible & basically never play the body. I don't get it at all. He used to make a bad error a few times a seasons, now it's every game. It's far bigger issue than just not playing with Trouba.

Is there another Scheifele in the league I don't know about?

 

[Guerzy]

He needs to regain his confidence. He really does need an experienced top pair guy to help him. He looks scared to make a mistake and that's made him tentative all over the ice. Paralysis by analysis.

Exactly. Rarely do players go from smart, smooth decision makers to having lost their toolbox. Something isn't clicking here and I think it's mental/confidence. To look at the analytics and gaffes on the ice and demote and or trade the guy would be a mistake imo. I truly believe there is a "why" here in why this is/has happened.

Can we remember that this is the same rookie 21-22 year old "kid" that Dustin Byfuglien demanded to play with on his top pairing.

 

[Jet]

Exactly. Rarely do players go from smart, smooth decision makers to having lost their toolbox. Something isn't clicking here and I think it's mental/confidence.

Can we remember that this is the same rookie 21-22 year old "kid" Dustin Byfuglien demanded to play with on his top pairing.

Yup - you don't just lose talent and hockey sense. It's been said that outside of the bottom and top outliers, most players are very similarily gifted in the NHL. The main differentiator is mental management. Do you get inside your head too much, do you allow yourself to worry or overthink things? Do you have the supreme confidence in yourself to execute at a high level consistently? Josh is a top pair defenseman who's struggling with the mental aspect of the game right now.

 

[Huffer]

I always thought Morrissey was a smart high hockey IQ player, and now you wonder wtf is going on. This leads me to believe we've got a dman that is likely struggling mightily for confidence, which I think can be linked to playing with defensive partners in which he cannot (for whatever reason) form quality chemistry with. For the love of god Maurice pair him back with Demelo and give them some games to see if we can see what we did last season. Or, call up Heinola and pair the two of them together. Enough is enough here with pairing Morrissey with the Poolmans and Beaulieus of the world. Just stop it already.

I'm just not ready to give up on this guy. He's too smart and skilled to be going the way he's going.

Exactly. Rarely do players go from smart, smooth decision makers to having lost their toolbox. Something isn't clicking here and I think it's mental/confidence. To look at the analytics and gaffes on the ice and demote and or trade the guy would be a mistake imo. I truly believe there is a "why" here in why this is/has happened.

Can we remember that this is the same rookie 21-22 year old "kid" that Dustin Byfuglien demanded to play with on his top pairing.

Agreed. JoMo is struggling, but I'm not giving up on him yet either.

 

[Guerzy]

Yup - you don't just lose talent and hockey sense. It's been said that outside of the bottom and top outliers, most players are very similarily gifted in the NHL. The main differentiator is mental management. Do you get inside your head too much, do you allow yourself to worry or overthink things? Do you have the supreme confidence in yourself to execute at a high level consistently? Josh is a top pair defenseman who's struggling with the mental aspect of the game right now.

Surely we have an analytic chart that measures confidence?

 

[Guerzy]

Agreed. JoMo is struggling, but I'm not giving up on him yet either.

Agree.

It will be a different story for me if we pair JoMo with a quality dman and we still see what we're seeing. Then I will be concerned. But for right now, I am looking deeper into the "why" this could be happening. The sample size of his career has shown me a reliable, smart top pairing dman that did the job marvelously with Byfuglien and Trouba.

 

[DannyGallivan]

Samberg-Pionk
Ekholm-DeMelo
Heinola-Morrissey
Stanley

Why would you put someone who's never played an NHL game on the top pairing? I understand the optimism with Samberg, but he has done nothing in the NHL at this point. When he does get a look on the top squad, he will be put slowly.

Why is Demelo still on the team? Why is Stanley the extra? I don't mind Heinola-Morrissey, except that it pairs two non-physical defensemen on the ice at the same time.

I'm assuming the winky face is for Ekholm.

 

[WolfgangPuck]

Bring in Buff to coach Morrissey. I think this is mental rather than physical injury He lost the mental edge and making mistakes that never see him do.

 

[Teemusalami204]

Maurice put him with pionk for the end of the game I’m wondering if this sticks. It’s the only chance we have without getting a top 4 dman

We don’t want morrisey dragging down our best dman either though

 

[Adam da bomb]

Agree.

It will be a different story for me if we pair JoMo with a quality dman and we still see what we're seeing. Then I will be concerned. But for right now, I am looking deeper into the "why" this could be happening. The sample size of his career has shown me a reliable, smart top pairing dman that did the job marvelously with Byfuglien and Trouba.

We have paired him demelo Pionk. No change.

 

[Howard Chuck]

I always thought Morrissey was a smart high hockey IQ player, and now you wonder wtf is going on. This leads me to believe we've got a dman that is likely struggling mightily for confidence, which I think can be linked to playing with defensive partners in which he cannot (for whatever reason) form quality chemistry with. For the love of god Maurice pair him back with Demelo and give them some games to see if we can see what we did last season. Or, call up Heinola and pair the two of them together. Enough is enough here with pairing Morrissey with the Poolmans and Beaulieus of the world. Just stop it already.

I'm just not ready to give up on this guy. He's too smart and skilled to be going the way he's going.

Yes. I thought morrissey and Heinola looked great although a very small sample.

 

[garret9]

Why would you put someone who's never played an NHL game on the top pairing? I understand the optimism with Samberg, but he has done nothing in the NHL at this point. When he does get a look on the top squad, he will be put slowly.

Why is Demelo still on the team? Why is Stanley the extra? I don't mind Heinola-Morrissey, except that it pairs two non-physical defensemen on the ice at the same time.

I'm assuming the winky face is for Ekholm.

1) There's no true top pairing above, but I have also spoken time and time again that the NHL would do better bringing it's potential top young players alongside top players, not hide them with garbage to only slightly improve their sheltering of linematching. The NHL does things wrong here. If it's about minutes, you just double shift someone once in a while.

On the third pair you see top lines maybe 10% less for your TOI, but you also see your own team's top lines about equally or more less often, and your defensive partner is significantly worse and with you 100% of the time.

2) DeMelo statistically has been the Jets best defender since his arrival and the second best when look just at this season. That's why.

3) Stanley isn't as good as anyone listed above him.

4) I don't care about having two "non physical defenseman" at the same time because physical is about style and I care about substance.

5) The pairings more have to do with who would generate chemistry the best as it pertains to NHL performance, with prefering to split different roles. Typically defense has 4 types of clusters based on microstatistical performance: all around, volume shooters, puck movers, and defensive specialists, and even that is a bit of an oversimplification. Hockey is more complex than 1 physical and 1 not.

Note: there's some conflation of results here. For example All Around types tend to be elite anyways so it's not just a chemistry thing in the above results.

7) Winky face is because this would never happen in the real world.

 

[DannyGallivan]

1) There's no true top pairing above, but I have also spoken time and time again that the NHL would do better bringing it's potential top young players alongside top players, not hide them with garbage to only slightly improve their sheltering of linematching. The NHL does things wrong here. If it's about minutes, you just double shift someone once in a while.

On the third pair you see top lines maybe 10% less for your TOI, but you also see your own team's top lines about equally or more less often, and your defensive partner is significantly worse and with you 100% of the time.

2) DeMelo statistically has been the Jets best defender since his arrival and the second best when look just at this season. That's why.

3) Stanley isn't as good as anyone listed above him.

4) I don't care about having two "non physical defenseman" at the same time because physical is about style and I care about substance.

5) The pairings more have to do with who would generate chemistry the best as it pertains to NHL performance, with prefering to split different roles. Typically defense has 4 types of clusters based on microstatistical performance: all around, volume shooters, puck movers, and defensive specialists, and even that is a bit of an oversimplification. Hockey is more complex than 1 physical and 1 not.

Note: there's some conflation of results here. For example All Around types tend to be elite anyways so it's not just a chemistry thing in the above results.

7) Winky face is because this would never happen in the real world.

Thanks for the detailed explanation to back up your post.
1.Your first point has merit, as long as you're not tossing a green rookie in over his head.
2.The game is played on the ice and not on paper, and Demelo has been poor this season.
3. Stanley has been steadier, more responsible and has shown me more than anybody not named Morrissey or Pionk. Can't say either of the two Moose are better than Stanley at this juncture, although a case can be made for Heinola (who I agree, has earned a shot). I don't understand all the love given to Samberg, who has never played an NHL game and is steady but unspectacular in the AHL. I'm not saying there's no reason not to be optimistic, but there's no reason to suggest that he's better than Stanley at this point. Methinks there exists a remaining negative bias over Stanley, despite his plus 8, responsible and dare I say skilled play.
4. There's a difference between non-physical and push overs. I'm concerned that they may be the latter. Sorry, but the NHL has never changed so drastically that playing the body still isn't crucial. I'd be interested in giving them a shot, but I'd put Heinola with Pionk instead. Pionk, despite his size, has been a very (effective!) physical presence for us.
5. You may simply have to shift some players around to achieve this, but you already know that. Chemistry or not, if you have d-men who are able to play positionally sound, avoid gifting free pizzas, make sense of the Jets' defensive scheme, get the puck out of their end and occasionally pitch in with some offense, that's all the chemistry they need.

 

[garret9]

Thanks for the detailed explanation to back up your post.
1.Your first point has merit, as long as you're not tossing a green rookie in over his head.
2.The game is played on the ice and not on paper, and Demelo has been poor this season.
3. Stanley has been steadier, more responsible and has shown me more than anybody not named Morrissey or Pionk. Can't say either of the two Moose are better than Stanley at this juncture, although a case can be made for Heinola (who I agree, has earned a shot). I don't understand all the love given to Samberg, who has never played an NHL game and is steady but unspectacular in the AHL. I'm not saying there's no reason not to be optimistic, but there's no reason to suggest that he's better than Stanley at this point. Methinks there exists a remaining negative bias over Stanley, despite his plus 8, responsible and dare I say skilled play.
4. There's a difference between non-physical and push overs. I'm concerned that they may be the latter. Sorry, but the NHL has never changed so drastically that playing the body still isn't crucial. I'd be interested in giving them a shot, but I'd put Heinola with Pionk instead. Pionk, despite his size, has been a very (effective!) physical presence for us.
5. You may simply have to shift some players around to achieve this, but you already know that. Chemistry or not, if you have d-men who are able to play positionally sound, avoid gifting free pizzas, make sense of the Jets' defensive scheme, get the puck out of their end and occasionally pitch in with some offense, that's all the chemistry they need.

2) The results on paper are just a tally of good and bad things happening on the ice. The objectives of the game. Wins and losses are just on paper too. DeMelo is the Jets best positional defenseman. He's like Stastny but on defense. He's an eye test tester, IMO. It's harder to see what he does right than someone like Pionk. If a player plays so badly, why are the results good.

3) Morrissey hasn't been steady. Not by numbers or eye test. That makes me question a lot. If a player plays so steadily, why are the results so bad.

4) The game has mostly been changing as decision makers more and more realize what they once thought was true, needed, or important isn't necessarily actually what is. You only need to outscore the opponent. You don't need anything else, and there's more than one way to skin a cat.