Value of: Mitch Marner this offseason (2.5 mil retained)

[derkejohnlee]

I'll play:

Toronto:
Hronek
Mikheyev
Raty

Vancouver:
Marner
Timmins

 

[DesertPenguin]

Im not going to speculate on return, but the Pens have cap space, have need of an impact forward, and Dubas is Dubas. If the TOR brass is willing to deal with him, I could see Marner to PIT happening.

 

[Avilaj07]

Really hope the Blues jump in the discussion.....
Will never forget being laughed at by a TML fan when the Blues traded Lee Stempniak for Steen and Colavacivo.

To Toronto-
Parayko
Buchnevich

To St.Louis-
Marner
Liljegren

 

[HockeyVirus]

Meh someone who is a self proclaimed god is a little off putting he is a great hockey player who competes hard but that attitude will hold him back in order to be a hockey god you gotta have the desire to be the best player, teammate and leader. You at least need a cup he doesn't have that yet so he might be a great regular season player but he has to produce come playoff time irregardless of circumstance if he wants to think that highly of himself, mitch needs to chase those w's and force them and not sit back and be like oh well whatever I'm still a beast. I'll give him the benefit of doubt because Toronto media is annoying as hell. I can see him going to Vegas via cap circumvention he'll be the regular season hero while stone and eich recover from "injuries"

He never called himself a god. Anyone that uses this logic is basically saying I hate Marner and I will knowingly be wrong out of spite

 

[Faceboner]

He never called himself a god. Anyone that uses this logic is basically saying I hate Marner and I will knowingly be wrong out of spite

Oops I did the thing I don't like. I fell for a rumor my bad

 

[Legion34]

Oops I did the thing I don't like. I fell for a rumor my bad

He was saying how amazing he was treated by the fans and the organization.

Basically. “I was treated like a king when I flew first class”

The context was being appreciative of being a leaf

Im not going to speculate on return, but the Pens have cap space, have need of an impact forward, and Dubas is Dubas. If the TOR brass is willing to deal with him, I could see Marner to PIT happening.

I just don’t see what they have. Retained karlson?

Peterson 1st and a prospect?

No idea

 

[Faceboner]

He was saying how amazing he was treated by the fans and the organization.

Basically. “I was treated like a king when I flew first class”

The context was being appreciative of being a leaf



I just don’t see what they have. Retained karlson?

Peterson 1st and a prospect?

No idea

Thank you so much, guess I read the quote as a paraphrase in a miscontexual way.

 

[Fatass]

Marner controls everything here. If the Leafs ask him to waive he will likely say for only one team and that he wants to negotiate his next contract with them before he’s traded. The acquiring team knows they’re the only club evolved. They will give Toronto the shaft. Leafs should keep Marner. Better that than making a bad trade.

 

[Legion34]

Thank you so much, guess I read the quote as a paraphrase in a miscontexual way.

Yes right now Marner could say or do anything and it would be interpreted poorly and spouted by the media.

There were click bait articles

 

[Faceboner]

Yes right now Marner could say or do anything and it would be interpreted poorly and spouted by the media.

There were click bait articles

Yep now everything I thought about him was wrong due to that.... would definitely take him on the Sabres at 2.5 retained as a base how about savoie, 11, and 25' 1st

 

[KingDeathMetal]

Here's a win now deal that works for both sides:

Marner to Vegas at 50% retained for Mark Stone, 1st rd pick, and a Top 5 system prospect. Conditioned upon a Marner extension.

Benefit for Toronto: you get an elite defensive/offensive wing to replace most of Marner's production, with more physicality, locker room presence, and proven track record of producing in the playoffs (with a Cup on his resume). Under contract for three more seasons, and you're paying him less than what you'd be paying Marner after next season. It's a win now move, but also gives Toronto a couple of decent assets to compensate for Marner's age/production/availability.

Benefit for Vegas: change of scenery for Marner, where he can quietly fit into a team that has already established a winning culture, could potentially unlock a super elite forward who is much younger and better offensively than Stone. 50% retention frees up around $3m for Vegas to weaponize next season as they gear up for another big run. Losing Stone hurts, but they also get a replacement for him with better health/availability for years to come, and far higher upside if the change of scenery factor works as expected. 100% guaranteed to a better fit for the regular season at least.

I think this works for both sides quite well. In some ways this wouldn't be good for Toronto, but it's absolutely the move they need to make in the interest of winning over the next three seasons.

 

[seanlinden]

Marner controls everything here. If the Leafs ask him to waive he will likely say for only one team and that he wants to negotiate his next contract with them before he’s traded. The acquiring team knows they’re the only club evolved. They will give Toronto the shaft. Leafs should keep Marner. Better that than making a bad trade.

Not neccessarily. Ultimately, a Marner deal requires 3 parties to work together to make it happen. The Leafs, Marner, and whomever he's traded to. Let's say that team, for examples sake, is Vegas.

Marner benefits from being traded, perhaps even moreso than the Leafs do. If he completely handcuffs the Leafs to one team; there is a chance that the Leafs do not trade him.

If that happens, the opportunity for Vegas to get him at 50% while they "work him into the salary structure" is gone. The opportunity to sign an 8-year deal is gone. Over the next year, Vegas may decide that it has a better way to spend the $10m+ that Marner wants, or that it cannot wait until Marner becomes a UFA to see if they can win his services.

Nobody's saying that Marner is going to be pressured into going to Utah (unless he likes the idea); but there are lots of desirable places to play in this league, and it would be in Marner's best interest to work with the team who's going to facilitate the move for him.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

How many teams would he even be willing to waive for? I don’t see him returning anything close to his actual value.

 

[Frank Drebin]

Phil "Hot dog boy/ Winger you can't win with" Kessel was traded coming a 61 point season where he completely quit, with a lot of years left on a big contract, fitness based questions of his longevity, trade protection that he leveraged to take the market down to 1-2 teams, by a rookie GM and along with a 2nd returned
-A playoff protected 1st
-3rd
-Top ~30-40 prospect league wide a year away from being picked 1st round
-a thought to be near NHL ready defense prospect
-25point defensive depth forward

Marner is an objectively better player and more attractive asset than Kessel was at that time

Salary cap was 70m at the time of the trade, kessels hit after retention was just under 10% of that (6.8m) for 7 years.

Would be like marner at 8.8 for the next 7 years

 

[GoldenSeal]

To Toronto-
Parayko
Buchnevich

To St.Louis-
Marner
Liljegren

Nope.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

Here's a win now deal that works for both sides:

Marner to Vegas at 50% retained for Mark Stone, 1st rd pick, and a Top 5 system prospect. Conditioned upon a Marner extension.

Benefit for Toronto: you get an elite defensive/offensive wing to replace most of Marner's production, with more physicality, locker room presence, and proven track record of producing in the playoffs (with a Cup on his resume). Under contract for three more seasons, and you're paying him less than what you'd be paying Marner after next season. It's a win now move, but also gives Toronto a couple of decent assets to compensate for Marner's age/production/availability.

Benefit for Vegas: change of scenery for Marner, where he can quietly fit into a team that has already established a winning culture, could potentially unlock a super elite forward who is much younger and better offensively than Stone. 50% retention frees up around $3m for Vegas to weaponize next season as they gear up for another big run. Losing Stone hurts, but they also get a replacement for him with better health/availability for years to come, and far higher upside if the change of scenery factor works as expected. 100% guaranteed to a better fit for the regular season at least.

I think this works for both sides quite well. In some ways this wouldn't be good for Toronto, but it's absolutely the move they need to make in the interest of winning over the next three seasons.

But you forgot to ask Mark Stone if it works for him.

 

[Nogatco Rd]

Fans always say this and it never happens. Teams get the guy they want every single year.

Orlov? Tarasenko? Kane? Plenty of recent counter examples

 

[Ovechkins Wodka]

The Caps we could be a decent match. Marner knows our coach Carbery well and maybe will waive his NTC to join him.
We can offer Tom Wilson, Jensen, and Dowd depending on what the leafs needs are.

 

[Fatass]

Not neccessarily. Ultimately, a Marner deal requires 3 parties to work together to make it happen. The Leafs, Marner, and whomever he's traded to. Let's say that team, for examples sake, is Vegas.

Marner benefits from being traded, perhaps even moreso than the Leafs do. If he completely handcuffs the Leafs to one team; there is a chance that the Leafs do not trade him.

If that happens, the opportunity for Vegas to get him at 50% while they "work him into the salary structure" is gone. The opportunity to sign an 8-year deal is gone. Over the next year, Vegas may decide that it has a better way to spend the $10m+ that Marner wants, or that it cannot wait until Marner becomes a UFA to see if they can win his services.

Nobody's saying that Marner is going to be pressured into going to Utah (unless he likes the idea); but there are lots of desirable places to play in this league, and it would be in Marner's best interest to work with the team who's going to facilitate the move for him.

Imo it’s in Marner’s best interest to have a contract with his new club ready to sign soon after any trade. So that would mean he picks where he’s will to go. The Leafs can come to him with several options but ultimately it’s up to Marner which he chooses. Once he’s chosen then the clubs negotiate. I see Treliving, who made that terrible Tkatchuk trade for the Flames, making a similarly poor deal for the Leafs. So keep Marner. Don’t make a bad trade just to make one.

 

[Izzy Goodenough]

The Canucks are sending 2.5M to the Leafs for them to keep Marner.

 

[conFABulator]

I had a variation of this one a few pages ago and the Sportsnet did a pared down version. Let's try again with some tweaks..

On July 2, the Leafs trade Marner to Seattle and on that day the Kraken sign him to 8 years and $90M. The Leafs will have paid Marner ~$7M as a bonus on July 1. So, Seattle is getting Mitch for nine years at $93M ($10.66 per) although the cap hit is $12.5 for the final eight years.

The trade goes...

Marner
Liljegren (RFA)
Kampf (2.4m)

- for -

Larsson
Oleksiak
Wright

There could be picks back and forth, possibly conditional on the Leafs performance this year.

Why Seattle does this? For Marner, they do it to get a top winger in the game that scores at a 100-point pace consistently, PK, PP and is perennial Selke level defender. He is young, entering his prime and would come off the books before it gets ugly. Liljegren helps soften the blow or giving up two dmen and has a future as a top 4. Kampf is a good, responsible bottom six that the Leafs will miss but is probably overpaid by $750K per year. He doesn't have to be in this deal and the Leafs could keep him or move him elsewhere but I think he adds value for Seattle.

Why the Leafs do this? This is how they turn forward cap into defense cap. Trading Marner and Kampf gives the Leafs two top for defensemen and cap space another $5M dman. Tanev? Liljegren can be top four but the Leafs window is now and this gives them a stronger D, a much stronger D.

Rielly Tanev
Oleksiak Larsson
Benoit McCabe

Wright is a wildcard and without him in here this might be a terrible deal for the Leafs. They are giving away the best player in the deal, maybe even the best two (Liljegren when you consider age and contract) for two older D's one of whom is in his final year of a deal. Wright balances this. The Leafs also have Cowan coming up and he may replace some of what Marner brings some day and this another reason Mitch is the odd man out.

Please don't just say "nope", let me know why "nope".

 

[Scintillating10]

Sabre's offer Skinner, Jokiharju, Krebs, and our 2024 1st for Marner.

Or...

Swap out Krebs and swap with Ostlund/Kulich/Rosen for an extended Marner.

Big offer

 

[Strangle]

Oops I did the thing I don't like. I fell for a rumor my bad

It wasn’t a rumour, it’s a purposely misleading take to confuse readers

Like “Trump wants you to inject bleach!”

 

[I am Canadian]

Marner to Nashville for Carrier and Scissons.

Forsberg - O'Reilly - Marner would be an awesome top line.

A (good) 3rd liner and a bottom pairing defender for a 1st line winger, how ever could the Leafs say no

 

[Junohockeyfan]

A (good) 3rd liner and a bottom pairing defender for a 1st line winger, how ever could the Leafs say no

A 1st line winger with a 10.5M caphit and a rental to boot as well as a NMC. Leafs probably say yes.