Speculation: Mitch Marner Mega Thread 9 (and counting)

[Lshap]

Continued from here.

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[Martin Skoula]

I know what people used to think they showed and the argument of a failed eye test was also used.
Why Martin Marincin could be a top pair defenceman for the Leafs - Sportsnet.ca

That article uses "highlight reels per 60" as a metric. I don't need to keep going do I?

 

[Notsince67]

That article uses "highlight reels per 60" as a metric. I don't need to keep going do I?

This was an ongoing discussion awhile back with the analytics crowd saying that the eye test was misleading and that stats told the truth.
Yes this is like the movie groundhog day and the Matrix (where zion was destroyed 6 times)

 

[Smirnov2Chistov]

Guess there’s been little to no updates?

 

[zeke]

This was an ongoing discussion awhile back with the analytics crowd saying that the eye test was misleading and that stats told the truth.
Yes this is like the movie groundhog day and the Matrix (where zion was destroyed 6 times)

Marincin was a 2nd round pick.

Isn't he proof that the eye test sucks?

 

[Coachcorner]

Guess there’s been little to no updates?

Only lil homies holmes. But it ain't no thang. Dubas has done everythang almost exactly the correctamundo way during the hot summertime. He made the space and got the case. Marner finna sign soon and they've already talked it out. We don't hear almost anythang, they made up their minds and marner finna be a maple leaf legendary for life sire. We that bad and hard. It's bout respect. Some have, some don't.

 

[Martin Skoula]

This was an ongoing discussion awhile back with the analytics crowd saying that the eye test was misleading and that stats told the truth.
Yes this is like the movie groundhog day and the Matrix (where zion was destroyed 6 times)

Yeah he's not as bad as people complain about, he can be a competent 3rd pairing guy and secondary PK option. He can't deal with skilled/fast forwards but his zone coverage is ok. There's a reason he does well against scrubs and AHLers.

You're going to use a 3 year old article that doesn't look into any usage or context to try to make your point? Come on, you're better than this. At least give us something with basic QoC measures.

 

[zeke]

Yeah he's not as bad as people complain about, he can be a competent 3rd pairing guy and secondary PK option. He can't deal with skilled/fast forwards but his zone coverage is ok. There's a reason he does well against scrubs and AHLers.

You're going to use a 3 year old article that doesn't look into any usage or context to try to make your point? Come on, you're bettert than this. At least give us something with basic QoC measures.

Burtch did so much damage to the reputation of hockey analytics.

 

[Notsince67]

Marincin was a 2nd round pick.

Isn't he proof that the eye test sucks?

Almost zero difference between the success rate of a 2nd and 7th round pick statistically. This is well known in the analytics circle and is utilized by your hero Dubas on many occasions to trade down for value.

 

[Djp]

Does he die at the end of this chapter

 

[zeke]

Almost zero difference between the success rate of a 2nd and 7th round pick statistically. This is well known in the analytics circle and is utilized by your hero Dubas on many occasions to trade down for value.

the eye test crowd thought Marincin was 2nd round pick worthy. pretty damning, no?

 

[al secord]

Only lil homies holmes. But it ain't no thang. Dubas has done everythang almost exactly the correctamundo way during the hot summertime. He made the space and got the case. Marner finna sign soon and they've already talked it out. We don't hear almost anythang, they made up their minds and marner finna be a maple leaf legendary for life sire. We that bad and hard. It's bout respect. Some have, some don't.

Word B!

 

[Martin Skoula]

the eye test crowd thought Marincin was 2nd round pick worthy. pretty damning, no?

Babcock also talked about his great potential in the very same article he linked.

 

[Notsince67]

Yeah he's not as bad as people complain about, he can be a competent 3rd pairing guy and secondary PK option. He can't deal with skilled/fast forwards but his zone coverage is ok. There's a reason he does well against scrubs and AHLers.

You're going to use a 3 year old article that doesn't look into any usage or context to try to make your point? Come on, you're better than this. At least give us something with basic QoC measures.

It was one piece of evidence. I've listened to many analytic pundits in the past rave about Marincin.
Google "martin marincin analytic darling" and read away if you doubt it.

This is getting off topic and although my rebuttal was somewhat contextual, it is now becoming a long winded detour. I just assumed that the biggest fans of analytics would understand a reference regarding their own community of followers that was well publicized. My mistake.

 

[Kegsey]

Guess there’s been little to no updates?

Marner hanging out with the Marleau's and enjoying Cali.

 

[Martin Skoula]

It was one piece of evidence. I've listened to many analytic pundits in the past rave about Marincin.
Google "martin marincin analytic darling" and read away if you doubt it.

This is getting off topic and although my rebuttal was somewhat contextual, it is now becoming a long winded detour. I just assumed that the biggest fans of analytics would understand a reference regarding their own community of followers that was well publicized. My mistake.

Adding context to Marincin's stats would tell you exactly what he was though.

What community are you talking about? I don't see what someone else being bad at math 3 years ago has to do with the discussion at hand. Make an argument against the information being looked at instead of attacking 3 year old strawmen.

Does Clarkson/Lucic/Ladd's contract invalidate the eye test?

 

[Liferleafer]

Marner hanging out with the Marleau's and enjoying Cali.

Yup...he was touring Alcatraz the other day....

 

[Dekes For Days]

Why Martin Marincin could be a top pair defenceman for the Leafs - Sportsnet.ca

Lol. What the heck are highlight reel events? I've never heard of that in my life.
When did Marincin even play with Rielly for any significant amount of time? The sample size must be so tiny, I can't see it being significant.
He seems to be using his metrics about how he performs in a sheltered 3rd line role, and then assuming that he will perform the same in a top pairing role for some reason?
He posts a chart with a bunch of numbers based on his "highlight reel events", but doesn't explain what any of them mean.
He posts defensive metrics, but doesn't account for usage or QOT or QOC, which would make Polak the best defender on the team and Rielly the worst, yet the author didn't consider that this might indicate that his evaluation was flawed?
He even admits, even under his warped analysis, that Marincin is completely useless on offense.

This article is a mess. It also has nothing to do with what you replied to.

 

[SI90]

What will be higher, the number of the Marner thread or Marners AAV?

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Marincin was a 2nd round pick.

Isn't he proof that the eye test sucks?

If anything Marincin sucking lends credibilty to the eye test because there is literally no need for advanced stats to Know Marincin sucks.

All you have to do is watch the games you can see he sucks

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

What will be higher, the number of the Marner thread or Marners AAV?

Mariner threads there will be more threads than the maximum salary allowed

 

[MilesNewton]

Too lazy to scroll this entire post but if Vasilevskiy is getting 8 years and over 9M, MM has to want the largest payout of any player to date I would assume with lots of upfront cash each year. I would think he would want in the neighborhood of 11-12 or not? Also. how involved is his father in this or is he at all? Been out of the country for 3 months and not caught up on the MM situation.

 

[MagnumForce2]

9 Million per year now

 

[zeke]

Too lazy to scroll this entire post but if Vasilevskiy is getting 8 years and over 9M, MM has to want the largest payout of any player to date I would assume with lots of upfront cash each year. I would think he would want in the neighborhood of 11-12 or not? Also. how involved is his father in this or is he at all? Been out of the country for 3 months and not caught up on the MM situation.

why would Marner get more than the reigning Vezina winner and arguably best goalie in the league?

if Marner wants to sign for 9.5 x 8yrs like vasi just did, i'm sure dubas would be fine with it.

 

[zeke]

It was one piece of evidence. I've listened to many analytic pundits in the past rave about Marincin.
Google "martin marincin analytic darling" and read away if you doubt it.

This is getting off topic and although my rebuttal was somewhat contextual, it is now becoming a long winded detour. I just assumed that the biggest fans of analytics would understand a reference regarding their own community of followers that was well publicized. My mistake.

there are players that are overrated by analytics, especially in small samples in depth roles.

happy?

In this case, of course, marincin was also well loved by the eye test of hockey professionals, such as Mike Babcock.