Player Discussion Matt Grzelcyk

[Yeti34]

Absolutely untrue. Jack and Brick gave him his props for making that play, when no one else seemed capable. We kept icing the puck in fact for a lot of this game.

I don’t take my cues from Jack and Brick. I watched the play then watched the replay several times if an NHL defenseman let alone the two guys you mentioned couldn’t make that play 9/10 times I would be shocked.

 

[BruinDust]

Are we riding our 1-2 centers too hard defensively to the point where they have been useless on offense?

2 assists each.

Pasta looks pissed that his teammates can't keep up. One or two nice passes from Zacha here and there don't make up for the rest of the night where Pasta is playing 1 vs 5 it seems.

Coyle, not sure why he hasn't produced next to our leading scorer and our 2nd leading scorer.

I think there is an argument for this. Zacha has not been good at all. Looks a half-step behind. There is only so much gas in the tank.

I don't think we (myself included) realized how much of an advantage offensively having a 4th line that the coach could roll out in almost all defensive situations. It spelled the true offensive talents like a Bergeron or Krejci and no doubt it helped their own production.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

He also accomplished 2-3 bad turnovers because of a forecheck that caused significant zone time for the Leafs in each of his first two shifts of the game.

He also let arguably the worst Leaf skater outside of Reaves outmuscle him on the play in OT. While it wasn't completely his fault, he still didn't do a good job.

And he was fine after that.

Saved a goal in the first period, setup Colye for what may have been the winning goal when Charlie hit the post in 3rd.

Actually thought Grizz had a good game. Great game compared to most of his teammates.

 

[False Start]

And he was fine after that.

Saved a goal in the first period, setup Colye for what may have been the winning goal when Charlie hit the post in 3rd.

Actually thought Grizz had a good game. Great game compared to most of his teammates.

He's generally fine most of the time.

Fans just don't like seeing a player take a hit to make a play. He and Carlo do this all of the time and get unnecessary hate for it because it doesn't look good optically.

I've enjoyed his career here and while I acknowledge his flaws, I'm also excited for all of the people in this thread to move onto the next guy who doesn't fit their ideal profile.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

I don’t take my cues from Jack and Brick. I watched the play then watched the replay several times if an NHL defenseman let alone the two guys you mentioned couldn’t make that play 9/10 times I would be shocked.

How about Jaffe and Pederson?

They said the same.

He's generally fine most of the time.

Fans just don't like seeing a player take a hit to make a play. He and Carlo do this all of the time and get unnecessary hate for it because it doesn't look good optically.

I've enjoyed his career here and while I acknowledge his flaws, I'm also excited for all of the people in this thread to move onto the next guy who doesn't fit their ideal profile.

They should be made to watch today's episode of Dangle.

 

[Yeti34]

I think there is an argument for this. Zacha has not been good at all. Looks a half-step behind. There is only so much gas in the tank.

I don't think we (myself included) realized how much of an advantage offensively having a 4th line that the coach could roll out in almost all defensive situations. It spelled the true offensive talents like a Bergeron or Krejci and no doubt it helped their own production.

I’d agree with that. I thought Coyle has been surprisingly good but Zacha either needs to work on his faceoff game

How about Jaffe and Pederson?

They said the same.



They should be made to watch today's episode of Dangle.

I listen to them but generally like to form my own opinion based on what I see on the ice.

Jaffe in particular is great probably my favorite on the NESN crew. I certainly don’t agree with him on this though.

He's generally fine most of the time.

Fans just don't like seeing a player take a hit to make a play. He and Carlo do this all of the time and get unnecessary hate for it because it doesn't look good optically.

I've enjoyed his career here and while I acknowledge his flaws, I'm also excited for all of the people in this thread to move onto the next guy who doesn't fit their ideal profile.

Every player should be willing to take a hit to make a play especially in playoffs. I still have had a probably unwarranted dislike of Heinen because 5 years ago or so he curled off a hit.

That’s why Marner gets so much flak is he can’t take a hit and curls off.

 

[Sheppy]

And he was fine after that.

Saved a goal in the first period, setup Colye for what may have been the winning goal when Charlie hit the post in 3rd.

Actually thought Grizz had a good game. Great game compared to most of his teammates.

Overall yeah, he was fine after completely blundering 2 plays that lead to significant zone time for Toronto.

He's struggled in this series and I truly, truly have no idea why they put him back in. Whatever, though.

 

[Sheppy]

Absolutely untrue. Jack and Brick gave him his props for making that play, when no one else seemed capable. We kept icing the puck in fact for a lot of this game.

Jack would give props to a baked potato if it was wearing a spoked B

 

[Nothingbutglass]

Overall yeah, he was fine after completely blundering 2 plays that lead to significant zone time for Toronto.

He's struggled in this series and I truly, truly have no idea why they put him back in. Whatever, though.

He's struggled all year. I get needing puck movers but he brings nothing that Lohrei or Shattenkirk cant provide and that has worked this series. If he is in next game, I will start picketing the Bruins office demanding the firing of Montgomery.

 

[Comedy of Errors]

It's probably his last year in a Bruins sweater.

 

[Number8]

It was the winger (Knies) who scored. Coyle as the C should have the 3rd man high he looks back briefly before becoming focused on the puck. McAvoy looks to be the man who lost his check on Knies as the D should of had the first man to the net. That play by Tavares is a complete hope-and-pray type of play. Once Gryz takes away the inside, it's a one-handed backhand shovel pass to no one in particular hoping it gets through. Unfortunately it does.

Not trying to make excuses for McAvoy but he was almost at 30 mins last night and when Carlo didn't come out for the OT, their down to 1 right-shot D-man. He didn't play the entire OT but played a lot of it. A large part of mistakes made by puck watching has fatigue as the root cause. Once again, see Marchand, Brad, Game 7 2023.

I don’t want to be too hard on Gryz because he’s been a good soldier and effort is not the issue. However, I think it’s fair to say that many people think he gets overmatched in the playoffs. And I think there is good evidence of that. Last year, Games 1 and 2 this year, and certainly in the first two shifts of G5 last night in which he failed to clear/turned over the puck and we were hemmed in. Maybe that OT goal wasn’t all on him, but his angle on Tavares was awful. If he’d played it right, that puck goes into the corner. Skating is supposed to be his forte.

Regardless, the question I have is what was Montgomery’s thinking in putting him in for Game 5?

As you point out, we had issues with having the proper mix of RD and LD — which I think one could argue might explain the fact that our play in the D zone was simply nothing like what it was in G3 and G4.

Coaches job is to put your players in the best situation to excel. I don’t think he did that last night. Doesn’t excuse players not showing up - that’s on them. But Montgomery couldn’t resist making changes and those changes played a significant part in our two key woes: losing endless faceoffs, lack of pace, and getting pinned in our D zone.

Players and Coach were not prepared and after last year, that is inexcusable.

 

[SwayHeyKid]

rewatching the ot goal, I was dead wrong. Gryz is 1000% at fault for not taking the body at the blueline. WTF was that? seal him off on the wall, slow him down, go for a poke check, do something. That was as bad as it gets. Gross. Makes the whole Coyle/McAvoy thing irrelevent. Funny, but you can see 3 bruins in the screen and Tavares off to the side of of Swayman and Knies comes out of nowhere. Nice hustle.

 

[Number8]

Like it or not, he absolutely contributed to our only goal of the game.

I actually did a double take. One of our defenseman took a breakout pass and got the puck deep after skating with the puck. Which actually led to the goal.

Crazy right? In a game we were completely out chanced in the first period, our puck moving defenseman moved the puck which led to a goal.

No, Forbort and Wotherspoon probably don't make that play.

Pure luck. He was just as much short of the red line when he put that puck in as Carlo was in the icing that led to the first goal. Also, in defense of Carlo, Toronto spent as much time in our zone over the first 10 minutes as they have for pretty much the total 240 minutes of the first four games. I’d be panicking to get it out as well. And why? Because Gryz had bad turnovers in our zone on his very first two shifts. That’s on Montgomery, because that is the book on Gryz in the playoffs. Toronto knows it, the hockey “pundits” know it (certainly morning brew guys), and Montgomery should have known it.

 

[BruinDust]

If he’d played it right, that puck goes into the corner. Skating is supposed to be his forte.

When Tavares crosses the blue line he accelerates and Gryz is a half-second late responding to it. I have more of an issue with his approach at the blueline than I do the angle he takes afterward. He could of been more aggressive there when Tavares crossed with the puck.

I think we overrate his skating personally. He's not the skater he was say in 2018 or 2019 when he was 24-25 years old. A fair bit of milage since, lots of hard smacks, he's never been durable. His ability to evade the forecheck with the puck and cover ground without isn't as good. Once he could make up more for lack of length/reach with footspeed but his footspeed has decreased. He gets hit more, hemmed in more, and it snowballs. He's 30 now and reality is his overall prime was probably 3-4 years ago.

What is mystifying to me is how he was used last night. He replaces Shattenkirk who was the clear 6th D in Game 3 and 4 with around 10 mins. in each.

In Game 3 and 4 Lohrei is the clear number 5 averaging about 15:30-16 mins. Wotherspoon, who defensively is your 4th best D-man dressed, is the clear number 4 with around 18:30 average. Then you have the big 3 with McAvoy clear No.1 and Lindholm and Carlo flip-flopping for 2nd in minutes.

So after two wins on the road, you come home and take out your No.6 (Shattenkirk) for Gryz, and then utilize Gryz as your No.4 in Game 5 with nearly 19 mins compared to Wotherspoon now down to 14:47 and he's now 6th in minutes. Even if they wanted Shattenkirk out due to his play or rest or an injury, why isn't Gryz simply getting his minutes and spot. How does last night turn out if Gryz is down to 10-12 minutes instead of almost 20.

 

[Number8]

When Tavares crosses the blue line he accelerates and Gryz is a half-second late responding to it. I have more of an issue with his approach at the blueline than I do the angle he takes afterward. He could of been more aggressive there when Tavares crossed with the puck.

I think we overrate his skating personally. He's not the skater he was say in 2018 or 2019 when he was 24-25 years old. A fair bit of milage since, lots of hard smacks, he's never been durable. His ability to evade the forecheck with the puck and cover ground without isn't as good. Once he could make up more for lack of length/reach with footspeed but his footspeed has decreased. He gets hit more, hemmed in more, and it snowballs. He's 30 now and reality is his overall prime was probably 3-4 years ago.

What is mystifying to me is how he was used last night. He replaces Shattenkirk who was the clear 6th D in Game 3 and 4 with around 10 mins. in each.

In Game 3 and 4 Lohrei is the clear number 5 averaging about 15:30-16 mins. Wotherspoon, who defensively is your 4th best D-man dressed, is the clear number 4 with around 18:30 average. Then you have the big 3 with McAvoy clear No.1 and Lindholm and Carlo flip-flopping for 2nd in minutes.

So after two wins on the road, you come home and take out your No.6 (Shattenkirk) for Gryz, and then utilize Gryz as your No.4 in Game 5 with nearly 19 mins compared to Wotherspoon now down to 14:47 and he's now 6th in minutes. Even if they wanted Shattenkirk out due to his play or rest or an injury, why isn't Gryz simply getting his minutes and spot. How does last night turn out if Gryz is down to 10-12 minutes instead of almost 20.

I agree with everything you lay out here. I like Gryz, he’s been nothing but a good soldier in Boston. I’m just frustrated because, as I think you lay out accurately, the coaching staff seemed to completely overhaul the D in a way that was hard to understand and, unfortunately, ended up not going well. Why Montgomery has to change things so radically when he had the upper hand mystifies me as well.

I think the coaching staff has to put players in a position to succeed. And in that regard, I don’t think B’s did Gryz any favors whatsoever.

As for the players not showing more urgency? I’m doubly mystified.

Hopefully they all (players and coaches) learn and close this out tomorrow. Sadly, it’s a lesson I assumed we’d learned already after the bitter pill of last season.

 

[Son of Donegal]

When Tavares crosses the blue line he accelerates and Gryz is a half-second late responding to it. I have more of an issue with his approach at the blueline than I do the angle he takes afterward. He could of been more aggressive there when Tavares crossed with the puck.

I think we overrate his skating personally. He's not the skater he was say in 2018 or 2019 when he was 24-25 years old. A fair bit of milage since, lots of hard smacks, he's never been durable. His ability to evade the forecheck with the puck and cover ground without isn't as good. Once he could make up more for lack of length/reach with footspeed but his footspeed has decreased. He gets hit more, hemmed in more, and it snowballs. He's 30 now and reality is his overall prime was probably 3-4 years ago.

What is mystifying to me is how he was used last night. He replaces Shattenkirk who was the clear 6th D in Game 3 and 4 with around 10 mins. in each.

In Game 3 and 4 Lohrei is the clear number 5 averaging about 15:30-16 mins. Wotherspoon, who defensively is your 4th best D-man dressed, is the clear number 4 with around 18:30 average. Then you have the big 3 with McAvoy clear No.1 and Lindholm and Carlo flip-flopping for 2nd in minutes.

So after two wins on the road, you come home and take out your No.6 (Shattenkirk) for Gryz, and then utilize Gryz as your No.4 in Game 5 with nearly 19 mins compared to Wotherspoon now down to 14:47 and he's now 6th in minutes. Even if they wanted Shattenkirk out due to his play or rest or an injury, why isn't Gryz simply getting his minutes and spot. How does last night turn out if Gryz is down to 10-12 minutes instead of almost 20.

This.

 

[Lord Ahriman]

When Tavares crosses the blue line he accelerates and Gryz is a half-second late responding to it. I have more of an issue with his approach at the blueline than I do the angle he takes afterward. He could of been more aggressive there when Tavares crossed with the puck.

I think we overrate his skating personally. He's not the skater he was say in 2018 or 2019 when he was 24-25 years old. A fair bit of milage since, lots of hard smacks, he's never been durable. His ability to evade the forecheck with the puck and cover ground without isn't as good. Once he could make up more for lack of length/reach with footspeed but his footspeed has decreased. He gets hit more, hemmed in more, and it snowballs. He's 30 now and reality is his overall prime was probably 3-4 years ago.

What is mystifying to me is how he was used last night. He replaces Shattenkirk who was the clear 6th D in Game 3 and 4 with around 10 mins. in each.

In Game 3 and 4 Lohrei is the clear number 5 averaging about 15:30-16 mins. Wotherspoon, who defensively is your 4th best D-man dressed, is the clear number 4 with around 18:30 average. Then you have the big 3 with McAvoy clear No.1 and Lindholm and Carlo flip-flopping for 2nd in minutes.

So after two wins on the road, you come home and take out your No.6 (Shattenkirk) for Gryz, and then utilize Gryz as your No.4 in Game 5 with nearly 19 mins compared to Wotherspoon now down to 14:47 and he's now 6th in minutes. Even if they wanted Shattenkirk out due to his play or rest or an injury, why isn't Gryz simply getting his minutes and spot. How does last night turn out if Gryz is down to 10-12 minutes instead of almost 20.

Couldn't agree more. #48 got burned in overtime (not a brutal/horrendous play though), entire team was awful, but for me Monty is the main culprit (sitting #19 was another big mistake and we all saw the disaster in the making talking about FO).

 

[Aussie Bruin]

Did Tavares cut out in front?

No.

So he was kept entirely to the outside. If I'm Gryz I'm not holding myself accountable for that goal and the blame is on the two guys who got caught focused on the puck and not the opposing skaters.

Not entirely. Because Tavares gets a step on Gryz he's able to curve in towards the net and that gives him a lane to tumble a soft puck on Sway from close range. But we're pretty much on the same page here. As I said in my previous post, I don't think Gryz bears main responsibility for the goal. He didn't play that situation perfectly, but he didn't completely screw it up either. He did what should have been enough. Due to the errors of others and some sheer luck, it wasn't.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Overall yeah, he was fine after completely blundering 2 plays that lead to significant zone time for Toronto.

He's struggled in this series and I truly, truly have no idea why they put him back in. Whatever, though.

Was there anyone but Swayman that didn't have at least two blunders in that game?

 

[elMatador]

Gryz is not a fast skater at all.

Game 5 GWG against the Panthers he had a clear distance advantage on Verhaeghe when the puck crossed the blue line. That distance was gone when he reached the hashmark in the Dzone.

The problem with him in the line up is that in case of an injury, you are effectively down to 4 Dmen. You cannot use him on PK or PP, his reach is short, his stride is awkward with short legs, his decision-making is slow. You cannot double shift him at all. In fact, during the playoffs, his ice time has to be sheltered that you would need to fully evacuate Saint Francis House to make room if you wanted to shelter him properly.

 

[Babajingo]

When Tavares crosses the blue line he accelerates and Gryz is a half-second late responding to it. I have more of an issue with his approach at the blueline than I do the angle he takes afterward. He could of been more aggressive there when Tavares crossed with the puck.

I think we overrate his skating personally. He's not the skater he was say in 2018 or 2019 when he was 24-25 years old. A fair bit of milage since, lots of hard smacks, he's never been durable. His ability to evade the forecheck with the puck and cover ground without isn't as good. Once he could make up more for lack of length/reach with footspeed but his footspeed has decreased. He gets hit more, hemmed in more, and it snowballs. He's 30 now and reality is his overall prime was probably 3-4 years ago.

What is mystifying to me is how he was used last night. He replaces Shattenkirk who was the clear 6th D in Game 3 and 4 with around 10 mins. in each.

In Game 3 and 4 Lohrei is the clear number 5 averaging about 15:30-16 mins. Wotherspoon, who defensively is your 4th best D-man dressed, is the clear number 4 with around 18:30 average. Then you have the big 3 with McAvoy clear No.1 and Lindholm and Carlo flip-flopping for 2nd in minutes.

So after two wins on the road, you come home and take out your No.6 (Shattenkirk) for Gryz, and then utilize Gryz as your No.4 in Game 5 with nearly 19 mins compared to Wotherspoon now down to 14:47 and he's now 6th in minutes. Even if they wanted Shattenkirk out due to his play or rest or an injury, why isn't Gryz simply getting his minutes and spot. How does last night turn out if Gryz is down to 10-12 minutes instead of almost 20.

He's an average skater. Only thing above average is his passing. Definitely not enough for top 6 playoff D. It's ok for a weekday game in January against Minn.

 

[24giovanni]

Not all of Gryz's fault as Coyle coasted back and did nothing.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Pure luck. He was just as much short of the red line when he put that puck in as Carlo was in the icing that led to the first goal. Also, in defense of Carlo, Toronto spent as much time in our zone over the first 10 minutes as they have for pretty much the total 240 minutes of the first four games. I’d be panicking to get it out as well. And why? Because Gryz had bad turnovers in our zone on his very first two shifts. That’s on Montgomery, because that is the book on Gryz in the playoffs. Toronto knows it, the hockey “pundits” know it (certainly morning brew guys), and Montgomery should have known it.

McCabe scored at 5:33 of the first period.

So Carlo's play comes 5 minutes into the game, not 10.

And blaming even that amount of time simply on Grzelcyk's play is ridiculous.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Not entirely. Because Tavares gets a step on Gryz he's able to curve in towards the net and that gives him a lane to tumble a soft puck on Sway from close range. But we're pretty much on the same page here. As I said in my previous post, I don't think Gryz bears main responsibility for the goal. He didn't play that situation perfectly, but he didn't completely screw it up either. He did what should have been enough. Due to the errors of others and some sheer luck, it wasn't.

Agreed, but the puck never got to Swayman. It hit the side of the net, went off a skate back out front. You see that situation multiple times in every game. The defender's job is to keep that player from cutting in front.

 

[Aussie Bruin]

Agreed, but the puck never got to Swayman. It hit the side of the net, went off a skate back out front. You see that situation multiple times in every game. The defender's job is to keep that player from cutting in front.

Oh yeah. I think I assumed it came off Swayman's pad because of the angle the puck took into the slot, but it's side of the net for sure. Really fortunate bounce for the Leafs in that case. Still should have been cleaned up, but tough to handle and really reinforces that Gryz didn't do too much wrong.