Pre-Game Talk: Leafs @ Sens October 22

[Qward]

Who cares? Let them over pay and fill Melnyks coffers.

 

[BondraTime]

I don't see where there could be legal recourse if there were a disclaimer with the buying of the ticket. Like I said before it's no different than not allowing people to bring cameras or having a dress code/code of conduct at any event.

It is very, very different. They are taking away your freedom of speech. Not allowing a camera in, or dress code is company policy, 100% different from taking away a basic human right. You can't tell a person who to cheer for, support, or follow. You can't put on a ticket "Only fans of the Ottawa Senators may spectate, those who cheer for opposing teams will be denied entry". That would create a case of bigotry.

I'm not saying what you are suggesting is unfair, I would love if the Sens filled their barn with only Sens fans.

 

[Super Cake]

It is very, very different. They are taking away your freedom of speech. Not allowing a camera in, or dress code is company policy, 100% different from taking away a basic human right. You can't tell a person who to cheer for, support, or follow. You can't put on a ticket "Only fans of the Ottawa Senators may spectate, those who cheer for opposing teams will be denied entry". That would create a case of bigotry.

In the US, freedom of speech only applies to the governments actions. Private companies can do whatever they want in regards to prohibiting your freedom of speech. I don't know how it works in Canada though.

 

[Quo]

Nah. Not different up here re: freedom of speech. Leafs fans have a whole building in which to express themselves outside of one section. This is tedious.

 

[BondraTime]

Nah. Not different up here re: freedom of speech. Leafs fans have a whole building in which to express themselves outside of one section. This is tedious.

Yes, fans can be asked to leave for any reason once they are inside the stadium. They cannot be denied entry due to their team of choice. I've derailed this thread wayyyyy to much, so I will stop. My apologies fellas

 

[Hossa18]

That record is not because Wiercioch has been playing instead of Cowen

I would disagree because you can't have four guys in the lineup at the same time that can't handle the puck properly. You could only have so many of the same players and to me Cowen, Gryba, Boro and to a certain extent Phillips are all the same type of player.

 

[PlayItAgain]

The Sens would lose so much money on Lawsuits and PR alone it isn't worthy of discussion.

Sens would lose no money on lawsuits because what is going on here is against the terms and conditions of their ticket purchase policy. The Senators only legal requirment is fufill the contract with the person who actually bought the tickets with them. Tickets being sold off third party marketplaces like kijiji are not part of the contractual obligation. Under those circumstances the Sens could technically refuse admittance at their discretion. So any Leaf fans buying tickets from Kijiji in the supporter section, "legally" could be tossed from the game.

 

[YNWA14]

It is very, very different. They are taking away your freedom of speech. Not allowing a camera in, or dress code is company policy, 100% different from taking away a basic human right. You can't tell a person who to cheer for, support, or follow. You can't put on a ticket "Only fans of the Ottawa Senators may spectate, those who cheer for opposing teams will be denied entry". That would create a case of bigotry.

I'm not saying what you are suggesting is unfair, I would love if the Sens filled their barn with only Sens fans.

It's not taking away freedom of speech at all. You are more than welcome to cheer for the Toronto Maple Leafs you just can't come into a privately owned building dedicated to another hockey team to do it. It's not bigotry and it's not a human rights issue. There are plenty of places for you to go if you want to cheer for the Leafs -- this is the home of the Ottawa Senators.

It'll never happen anyway, but it would be awesome and Melnyk would be completely within his rights if he did.

 

[Ice-Tray]

As a private business I'm pretty sure EM can do what he wants so long as the reasoning doesn't contravene human rights. Also, he can have anyone removed from the building subject to conduct codes, with even more leeway if he is refunding their money.

This is one of those things where people who don't care for it, or are terribly embarrassed about "the main board" should really just **** and let those who do, do their thing. I likely wouldn't buy a ticket to that section rolling solo or with the fam, but I can appreciate that it's likely to be a rip-roaring time for those there. Not only that, but the I'm-whining-because-I-have-the-freedom-of-speech entitlement blab is as weak as 5 year old breast milk.

By all accounts they are very clear about being a Sens fans only section when buying tickets, so removal is warranted, and should be expected given the clear notification. Those who accidentally end up there will be grateful for the reseating, those who attempt to troll get less than what they deserve with a reseating... Simple.

Realistically, having a few leaf trolls is the Sens drunk-20-somethings-cheering-like-crazy section would inevitably lead to fisticuffs, which would be a bad idea all around. Having a bunch of drunk-20-somethings-cheering-like-crazy cheering in a section all to themselves sounds like a great idea.

Edit: before the backlash, I would like to give mad props for the fatty fatcakes Kessel/Andy post. It started off subtle and built up to a work of art. Had me in guffaws....

 

[Micklebot]

It is very, very different. They are taking away your freedom of speech. Not allowing a camera in, or dress code is company policy, 100% different from taking away a basic human right. You can't tell a person who to cheer for, support, or follow. You can't put on a ticket "Only fans of the Ottawa Senators may spectate, those who cheer for opposing teams will be denied entry". That would create a case of bigotry.

I'm not saying what you are suggesting is unfair, I would love if the Sens filled their barn with only Sens fans.

Well it's not taking away free speech, they are free to say what they like, just not in that section; they have full access to the rest of the stadium seating so they are not being told they can't spectate, or denied access to the game.

This really isn't a big deal, and I doubt any leafs fans would care, provided they knew in advance that the section was reserved for RSU members. They'd just buy a different ticked. They might think it's lame, but whatever, there are lots of seats to choose from.

 

[BondraTime]

It's not taking away freedom of speech at all. You are more than welcome to cheer for the Toronto Maple Leafs you just can't come into a privately owned building dedicated to another hockey team to do it. It's not bigotry and it's not a human rights issue. There are plenty of places for you to go if you want to cheer for the Leafs -- this is the home of the Ottawa Senators.

It'll never happen anyway, but it would be awesome and Melnyk would be completely within his rights if he did.

Ya the Sens could follow the Seahawks, who tried to do something like this but were not allowed to deny entry to Pats and 49er's fans, but instead only made tickets available for purchase inside the limits of Seattle. Without a billing address inside the boundries, you couldn't get a ticket.

Well it's not taking away free speech, they are free to say what they like, just not in that section; they have full access to the rest of the stadium seating so they are not being told they can't spectate, or denied access to the game.

This really isn't a big deal, and I doubt any leafs fans would care, provided they knew in advance that the section was reserved for RSU members. They'd just buy a different ticked. They might think it's lame, but whatever, there are lots of seats to choose from.

Again, I'm not talking about that. I understand why they have done that. Myself and Cujomi and a few others were talking about a hypothetical situation of denying entry to ALL fans of opposing teams, and only allowing Sens fans at games.

 

[Slow Hands]

This whole "soccer does it so we should too" mentality is misguided. Maybe you should also thrown balloons of urine on the ice and get tear gassed.

Lol way to take your argument to the extreme. There is in fact a large supporter culture in Europe based off of hockey, which does awesome things like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PwHqmQJZWeE

Hockey has its own traditions, and one of them is inclusiveness. You go to any rink in North America and you are entitled to wear the other guys colours wherever you want.

I'm not sure this is really specific to hockey, nor do I really think you can count inclusiveness as a hockey tradition.

On the first point: For a number of reasons, we just don't have that supporter culture in North America, which means that fan segregation isn't a part of our sports culture. This basically means that for any sport in North America, you can essentially sit where you'd like without raising too much ire.

While there are examples of rival fans fighting each other, they are mostly spurred on by young males who have been drinking (http://articles.philly.com/2012-01-19/sports/30643522_1_boston-fans-flyers-boston-nhl-winter-classic).

On the second point, the idea that inclusiveness is some sort of hockey tradition is laughable. The colour barrier in the NHL wasn't broken until the late 1950s, and even now, I don't count hockey as a particularly inclusive sport. You just have to look at the racism that occurs online directed towards Subban to see that there is still resistance to people of colour participating in the pro game.

I realize that you're speaking in more general terms about inclusiveness as a fan, but there we go.

With that said, I agree with you - if you buy tickets in the supporters section, hopefully next time they self select.

 

[Smash88]

Ya the Sens could follow the Seahawks, who tried to do something like this but were not allowed to deny entry to Pats and 49er's fans, but instead only made tickets available for purchase inside the limits of Seattle. Without a billing address inside the boundries, you couldn't get a ticket.

I'm almost positive the Sens did this during one of the Leafs playoffs series against us.

 

[Upgrayedd]

I lie awake at night because thinking the main board might be laughing at my team is too much of a burden to bear.

LOL, gave me a good laugh

 

[Benjamin]

As fans, all we can do is make Leaf fans regret going.

 

[Senscore]

Perhaps a synchronized beer dump.

Maybe at Alfie o'clock, just for old times sake.

 

[ChocolateLeclaire]

As fans, all we can do is make Leaf fans regret going.

And the best way to have Leaf fans regret going is to have a situation where the Leafs lose EVERY TIME they play in Ottawa.

I remember the hay day of the Labor Day games in Regina between the hated rivals the Blue Bombers and the Roughriders. When the Bombers were rolling, caravans full of Bomber fans would take over the stadium and make it a 50/50 or more game for the away Bombers.

Over the last 14 years, the Bombers have lost every game and the crowd has dwindled. Sure, Rider fans have grown too with their success, but what's happened is Bomber fans stopped buying tickets off the secondary market because there was no point in going because they were going to lose.

If Leaf fans were treated to nothing but losses for spending $100+ on their tickets, plus whatever hotel and gas fees if they drove in for the game, they'd stop coming.

Sure we can buy up all the tickets, but the easiest solution is to build a team that is better than TO's. Use home ice as an actual advantage.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Perhaps a synchronized beer dump.

Maybe at Alfie o'clock, just for old times sake.

Naughty boy!

 

[Ice-Tray]

And the best way to have Leaf fans regret going is to have a situation where the Leafs lose EVERY TIME they play in Ottawa.

I remember the hay day of the Labor Day games in Regina between the hated rivals the Blue Bombers and the Roughriders. When the Bombers were rolling, caravans full of Bomber fans would take over the stadium and make it a 50/50 or more game for the away Bombers.

Over the last 14 years, the Bombers have lost every game and the crowd has dwindled. Sure, Rider fans have grown too with their success, but what's happened is Bomber fans stopped buying tickets off the secondary market because there was no point in going because they were going to lose.

If Leaf fans were treated to nothing but losses for spending $100+ on their tickets, plus whatever hotel and gas fees if they drove in for the game, they'd stop coming.

Sure we can buy up all the tickets, but the easiest solution is to build a team that is better than TO's. Use home ice as an actual advantage.

I agree, but I also think that most leaf fans at the games live in Ottawa.

 

[Cosmix]

Thanks. Look forward to it.

yeah, sarcasm.

Me too.

So far I believe the Senators have alternated goalies for all games so I expect that to continue. Hopefully the two Gs will continue their stellar save percentage performances! Given the shots against they will need to do that for the Senators to win the game.

 

[YouGotAStuGoing]

Bernier getting the start tonight for Toronto. Likely means we see Reimer tomorrow.

 

[Cosmix]

And the best way to have Leaf fans regret going is to have a situation where the Leafs lose EVERY TIME they play in Ottawa.

I remember the hay day of the Labor Day games in Regina between the hated rivals the Blue Bombers and the Roughriders. When the Bombers were rolling, caravans full of Bomber fans would take over the stadium and make it a 50/50 or more game for the away Bombers.

Over the last 14 years, the Bombers have lost every game and the crowd has dwindled. Sure, Rider fans have grown too with their success, but what's happened is Bomber fans stopped buying tickets off the secondary market because there was no point in going because they were going to lose.

If Leaf fans were treated to nothing but losses for spending $100+ on their tickets, plus whatever hotel and gas fees if they drove in for the game, they'd stop coming.

Sure we can buy up all the tickets, but the easiest solution is to build a team that is better than TO's. Use home ice as an actual advantage.

Yes, I agree. That requires spending more and spending wisely!

 

[Inf4mous0ne]

On the second point, the idea that inclusiveness is some sort of hockey tradition is laughable. The colour barrier in the NHL wasn't broken until the late 1950s, and even now, I don't count hockey as a particularly inclusive sport. You just have to look at the racism that occurs online directed towards Subban to see that there is still resistance to people of colour participating in the pro game.

I realize that you're speaking in more general terms about inclusiveness as a fan, but there we go.

With that said, I agree with you - if you buy tickets in the supporters section, hopefully next time they self select.

Not to mention the economic barriers present in playing hockey/attending games when compared to some other sports. With theis and the other factor you mentioned, one could argue that hockey is one of the least inclusive sports (though not necessarily on purpose) out there.

Bernier getting the start tonight for Toronto. Likely means we see Reimer tomorrow.

Time to go for 5 in a row!

 

[Senscore]

Bernier getting the start tonight for Toronto. Likely means we see Reimer tomorrow.

This could work to our advantage.


We are after all, riding a two game goalie-breaking streak.

 

[Sensinitis]

As fans, all we can do is make Leaf fans regret going.

Don't see how that is possible without violence.