Last Chance for Sweden?

Discussion in 'International Tournaments' started by arrbez, Dec 23, 2005.

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  1. arrbez

    arrbez bad chi

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    Is this the last chance at glory Sweden is gonna have for a long time?

    Lidstrom - 35 (39 by next Olympics)

    Sundin - 34 (38 by next Olympics)

    Alfredsson - 33 (37 by next Olympics)

    Forsberg - 32 (will be 36 and have probably contracted a disease so rare they name it after him)

    Naslund - 32 (36 by next Olympics)


    They certainly have some good younger players, but Zetterberg and maybe Kronwall seem like the only ones who could be on the elite level that these guys are.

    What does the pipeline look like for Sweden right now? Because almost all of their top-end offensive talent is ageing...
     
  2. Crosbyfan

    Crosbyfan Registered User

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    Sidnus Crosbessen seems to be coming along nicely.
     
  3. Leo Naphta

    Leo Naphta Registered User

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    There is a thread over at the Swedish board concerning the sudden re-emergence of bona fide offensive talent in the age group 15-19 years. They won't be ready in Vancouver, but it is far too early to write them off for 2014.
     
  4. B Boarding

    B Boarding Registered User

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    No I don't think it's the last chance. All the guys above except Näslund and Lidström will play 2008 WC and they will make a competative team together with the Sedins, Zetterberg, Kronwall, Lundqvist and Steen on the rise. But the OG 2010 will be weaker, since all of our golden generation probably has retired by then(possibly not Alfie). And I think the Swedish rebuilding wont be complete until a few years after that...

    My OG 2010 team:

    H. Sedin (29)
    D. Sedin (29)
    H. Zetterberg (29)
    A. Steen (25)
    N. Bäckström (22)
    N. Bergfors (22)
    K. Huselius (31)
    F. Pettersson (22)
    S. PÃ¥hlsson (32)
    F. Sjöström (26)
    C. Söderberg (24)
    M. Nilson (31)
    J. Franzen (30)

    N. Kronwall (28)
    C. Bäckman (29)
    M. Öhlund (33)
    K. Johnsson (33)
    L. Jonsson (27)
    H. Tallinder (30)
    N. Grossman (24)

    H. Lundqvist (27)
    M. Tellqvist (30)
    S. Liv (29)

    M. Nilson - Zetterberg - Huselius

    Sedin - Sedin - Bergfors

    Steen - Bäckström - Söderberg

    F. Pettersson - Påhlsson - Sjöström


    Kronwall - Öhlund

    K. Johnsson - Tallinder

    Bäckman - Grossman


    Lundqvist


    Cut but close would be:

    Goalies:
    C. Heino-Lindberg (24)
    M. Ã…kerlund (23)
    S. Ridderwall (21)
    J. Enroth (21)

    D:
    J. Fransson (24)
    L. Jonsson (27)
    A. Holmqvist (28)
    D. Murray (29)
    N. Andersén (21)
    A. Edler (23)
    P. Hersley (23)
    J. Boumedienne (31)
    D. Fernholm (26)
    N. Hjalmarsson (22)
    A. Ribbenstrand (22)
    J. Oduya (28)
    D. Tärnström (34)
    D. Tjärnqvist (33)
    N. Wallin (34)
    A. Lilja (34)

    F:
    N. Ekman (33)
    M. Tjärnqvist (30)
    L. Eriksson (24)
    Y. Hagos (26)
    R. Nilsson (24)
    M. Weinhandl (29)
    D. Umicevic (25)
    T. Wandell (22)
    T. Lagerström (21)
    O. Johansson (21)
    M. Backlund (20)
    M. Pääjärvi (18)
    C. Berglund (29)
    R. Wallin (29)
    J. Salmonsson (23)
    A. Sundström (22)
    J. Hedström (32)
    M. Holmqvist (30)
    P. Berglund (21)
    M. Kahnberg (29)
    N. Nordgren (30)
    J. Lindström (26)
    A. Jämtin (26)
    A. Hedman (23)
     
  5. Riddarn

    Riddarn 1980-2011

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    Finland played the World Cup finals pretty well so I'm quite sure that even if Sundin, Lidström, Alfie and Forsberg are getting old, whoever that takes their place will do a pretty decent job and have a shot at winning even though they will be an underdog. Their hockey might not look as pretty, but who knows.. a team built around the Sedins, Zetterberg, Niklas Kronwall and Alex Steen might be more effective in the long run. I'm not worried. As Leo Naphta mentions, there some positive signs with the years 86 to 91. After that, it's harder to tell, but the Swedish hockey federation is at least working on the issues now, they didn't do that 5 years ago.
     
  6. C-J...*

    C-J...* Guest

    Nah, we´ll be back in 40 years or so.



    No worries.

    :D
     
  7. arrbez

    arrbez bad chi

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    What were the issues? It seems like there was a huge drought of new talent in the late '90s...although it seems to have picked up again lately
     
  8. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    yes there has been a huge drought. It's manily because Soccer is the most popular sport in sweden right now.
     
  9. Form and Substance

    Form and Substance Registered User

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    The kids wimped out after Nagano and Salt lake. :D
     
  10. God Bless Canada

    God Bless Canada Registered User

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    Sweden is about to go through what the U.S. is starting to go through now: a gap in the generational development pipeline. Sweden had a wonderful collection of talent come up in the late 1980s and into the 1990s, but the program has fallen on hard times the last few years. That's reflected in several poor showings at the WJC. (They haven't won a medal since 1996).

    The Swedish team at this Olympics is fairly old. How they hold up in a short tournament (with even more games than in the past) has yet to be seen. Lundquist gives them credible goaltending that they have lacked in recent years, but goaltending is not the reason they lost to the Czechs at the World Cup. The entire team stunk in that game.

    They might still have a competitive team at the 2008 World Cup, but by 2010, they're going to be in big trouble. Unlike the U.S., who are in the midst of the best five-year development stretch in nearly 20 years, the Swedes don't have that optimism for the future. They haven't had a top-10 pick since 2000.
     
  11. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    as I said, soccer is partly to blame for it.

    After this olympics, sweden will look to rebuild. Maybe we can field a greta team in 2014 again.
     
  12. B Boarding

    B Boarding Registered User

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    Arond 2014 we would probably have great depth but might not have the same kind of superstars as today, unless some prospects really develops good, like Pääjärvi.

    Goalies:
    Jhonas Enroth (25)
    Henrik Lundqvist (31)
    Stefan Ridderwall (25)
    Chris Heino-Lindberg (28)
    Mikael Tellqvist (34)

    Defensemen:
    Niclas Andersén (25)
    Niklas Kronwall (32)
    Henrik Tallinder (34)
    Nicklas Grossman (28)
    Victor Hedman (23)
    Christian Bäckman (33)
    Alexander Edler (27)
    Lars Jonsson (31)

    Forwards:
    Magnus Pääjärvi (22)
    Nicklas Bäckström (26)
    Nicklas Bergfors (26)
    Fredrik Pettersson (26)
    Anton Hedman (27)
    Alexander Sundström (26)
    Tony Lagerström (25)
    Oskar Möller (24)
    Mikael Backlund (24)
    Robert Nilsson (28)
    Loui Eriksson (28)
    Carl Söderberg (28)
    Johannes Salmonsson (27)
    Henrik Zetterberg (33)
    Fredrik Sjöström (30)
    Daniel Sedin (33)
    Henrik Sedin (33)
    Yared Hagos (30)
    Dragan Umicevic (29)
    Alex Steen (29)
    Tom Wandell (26)
    Anton Lander (22)
     
  13. TK79

    TK79 Registered User

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    Actually Lundqvist has already been the undisputed number 1 for national team for at least two years. He was in net for the world cup as well as the last two world championships and has played at pretty much the same level as now.
     
  14. teme

    teme Registered User

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    Looking at Swedish roster: they are big, talented, experienced and lack speed. It is not that some inviduals stick out as particullary slow, it is just that almost the entire group is average by Olympic standards.

    You can play hockey and win with a big, somewhat slow team, but it requires a strong game plan, because it is harder to recover from being out of position. I am just not quite sure the Swedes have one. They play a North American style hard forecheck at times, stifling neutral zone defence at others, but often the players look simply lost.

    Instable coaching may be part of the reason, and I also think Swedes are prone to overcoaching. One symptom of the problem is that Tre Kronor actually tends to play better when behind, switching back to basics. What I am saying is that Tre Kronor lack identity, and as such are less than the sum of parts. When things aren't going their way in general, Czechs switch back to positional defence, Finns crank up speed, Canadians simplify their game to the extreme... Swedes?
     
  15. psycho_dad*

    psycho_dad* Registered User

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    Alexander Ovechberg is far superior to Crosbessen! :D
     
  16. interminded

    interminded Registered User

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    So you already have predicitons about (now) 14 / 15 year olds ?
    That's pretty impressive dude.
     
  17. Flash Walken

    Flash Walken Registered User

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    This thread has been unbelievably informative.

    I wonder if anyone has this kind of knowledge of the finnish system, I'd really like to see projectinos of where they could be in 10 years. I'm already amazed at the goalie factory they've become, so if they could get any sort of program going like that for say, defensemen, they could be very impressive.
     
  18. B Boarding

    B Boarding Registered User

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    Of course! :) But that's what all this forum is about. predicting (or just guessing) what players will turn out good. And I thought those were the safest bets...
     
  19. psycho_dad*

    psycho_dad* Registered User

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    Finland seems quite set for the next 10 years or so, but can't really say about the ones coming after that, I'd rather not speculate on 14 year old kids yet.

    Pitkänen, Ruutu, Lehtonen, Toivonen, Rask, Rinne, J.Jokinen, Miettinen, Filppula, Laakso, Nokelainen, Korpikoski, Tukonen, Joensuu....those guys will probably be the core for the next 10, and of course there will be new guys joining them. I'd also like to know more about finnish defensive prospects. Are there any remarkable ones coming up etc.
     
  20. RorschachWJK

    RorschachWJK Registered User

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    The goalie situation is certainly very good, but otherwise things look pretty grim, especially at forward. Finland seems to develop armies of dependable 2-way forwards and grinders, but creative and talented game breakers are few and far between. There is something wrong with our development system IMO...maybe the emphasis is too much on brainwashing the kids to comply to game plans and systems and their skills don't get to develop properly?
     
  21. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    wrong. Lundqvist wasn't the 1st keeper in the world cup. Tellqvist was, and he stunk against the czech...

    and played at the same level as now? dude, Lundqvist is top3 in GAA and save %. He has improved his game in NHL.
     
  22. Big Phil

    Big Phil Registered User

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    Personally I thought that '04 might be their last chance to win. They have a shot this year but outside of Naslund, Forsberg and Alfie no one is really a superstar. Sundin didnt do himself any favour with the lockout and he is definetly on the decline now. I'd say rapidly. For the next few years Sweden will have solid teams but not spectacular. You'd better hope Forsberg plays out of his mind in Turin.
     
  23. teme

    teme Registered User

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    Defenceman take long time to develop. Well in to his 20's only thing Kimmo Timonen had going for him was his skating, he couldn't play physically at all and had an awful shot that seriously limited his offencive game. When Sami Salo left to Ottawa, he was famous for his opening passes (shoulder high off the glass) and legs of stone, I remember swearing that there is no way he is going to be an NHL dman. So I am cautiously optimistic some of the current bunch will eventually turn out fine.

    Lepistö is an obvious candidate for a top three dman, I'd worry about his skill level a bit, his puckhandling while very good is not elite level. Then again his offensive insticts are top notch and you can't teach that. Laakso looks good too, but there is a risk of him becoming another Seikola: well rounded junior who peaked early. Would be great to have more promising young dman, but some of them will turn out fine given time.
     
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