Player Discussion: Kristian Vesalainen [Update: Signed ELC]

[KingBogo]

Chevy seems to think the A is important from his interview. It's the best way to grow from a junior/college player to a pro. Of the guys we drafted only Scheif, Trouba, Ehlers and Laine didn't go that route. And I think it shows in the latter two's play, whereas Rantanen profitted from his year in the A.

The interesting thing will be to see how it affects Veselainen's development. He's no longer coached by our organization. If he comes into camp in a battle with Appleton for one spot, next year, and loses that battle, because Appleton has grown through the system, what happens?

I'm not worried about KV. He is a skilled prospect and will develop just fine in the KHL. While he might lose on some system experience and playing on a smaller ice surface the KHL will provide a stronger level of competition and likely allow for more individual skill enhancement. Jokerit will look out for his best interests as a home town prospect and I expect him to have a strong season with them. Being a dominant player at the WJHC will also be a good experience as well.

 

[surixon]

It doesn't particularly matter to me where he prefers to develop but if it were me I'd prefer to stay in the AHL from a pure development stand point. There are very few orgs in the league that have the developmental track record of grooming highly skilled forwards as the Jets. That would have weighed heavily on my decision. All the best if luck to you.

 

[traffic cone]

If it was just "some" KHL team I'd also rather have him in the AHL. But it's Jokerit.

He'll be in Finland, close to home, has great coaching, training possibilities and - most importantly - he'll likely have a good chance of cracking Team Finland's line-up in different tournaments.

KHL is a better league than AHL, though. He is nearly an NHL player already. But he needs to be playing top minutes. Hope he'll get those in Helsinki.

 

[Neuf]

KHL worked for Burmistrov, and even Yakupov is going there. Kovalchuk spent some development time there, and Shipachyov made the transition over to Vegas last year.

 

[KingBogo]

KHL worked for Burmistrov, and even Yakupov is going there. Kovalchuk spent some development time there, and Shipachyov made the transition over to Vegas last year.

Lots of top NHL players played in the KHL. Panarin spent 5 years in the KHL before coming to NA and he did alright.

 

[nobody imp0rtant]

Lots of top NHL players played in the KHL. Panarin spent 5 years in the KHL before coming to NA and he did alright.

Looking forward to KV joining the Jets in 2023-24.

 

[10Ducky10]

KHL worked for Burmistrov, and even Yakupov is going there. Kovalchuk spent some development time there, and Shipachyov made the transition over to Vegas last year.

That didn't go so well.

 

[Kaako Kappo]

That didn't go so well.

Dadonov worked out fine, though. I think comparions are useless. You will find failures and success stories, no matter the league

 

[10Ducky10]

Dadonov worked out fine, though. I think comparions are useless. You will find failures and success stories, no matter the league

I think he probably would have been called up in in jury situations and played his 10 games (if his play warranted it) so in the long run this will probably earn him less money...unless the KHL pays like the NHL.

 

[NotCommitted]

Chevy seems to think the A is important from his interview. It's the best way to grow from a junior/college player to a pro. Of the guys we drafted only Scheif, Trouba, Ehlers and Laine didn't go that route. And I think it shows in the latter two's play, whereas Rantanen profitted from his year in the A.

The interesting thing will be to see how it affects Veselainen's development. He's no longer coached by our organization. If he comes into camp in a battle with Appleton for one spot, next year, and loses that battle, because Appleton has grown through the system, what happens?

Obviously for Jets the AHL is a great place, they have the players close to them and in their full control, so it is indeed the best place for Jets to develop players for the Jets. From the players perspective it can be a bit different at times. On the other hand Jets has an excellent track record with their young prospects, so you know you are in a good hands so to speak, but the downside is currently the Jets have insane winger depth + are a team trying to contend, so getting into the line up and having any kind of bigger role will be insanely difficult. I think from Vesalainen's perspective, KHL might be more risky, but also perhaps with a bigger upside for his career.

Btw. Rantanen is a very poor comparison to Laine, they are completely different kind of players and physically Rantanen is in a different league. While he has good skills, he also has nothing that even remotely compares to a skill like the shot of Laine. It would've been a complete waste for the Jets to have Laine sniping a full season in the AHL. Who knows what would've happened with the 2016-2017 season, but depending on who replaces Laine in the line-up, it could've been a real disaster.

 

[heilongjetsfan]

Agreed, Petan and Roslovic have chemistry from the Moose and Perrault just does his thing. The line has been unlucky not to have found it's way into the score sheet. I think long term it's 2/3rds of a third scoring line. We just need Ves to develop into the trigger man on it.

Roslo's been creating/receiving some quality chances, but I think he's shooting from too far out to beat a lot of NHL goalies. That done and he could be nearly as dangerous as Connor. I think he's squeezing the stick as they say and I think he'll get over that sooner than later.

 

[Omark]

KHL teams have on average close to 20 million $ player budgets and it is obvious that the skill level is very high compared to beer league like AHL (even sm liiga is superior to AHL). Please don’t make European leagues look bad by using single datapoints as arguments. I think he will be power play player in Jokerit and gets the role where he can improve his game.

This was good decision from him and will be crushing the NHL after Jokerit’s season. WELCOME TO HELSINKI KRISTIAN!

 

[heilongjetsfan]

Part of me disagrees but then again gramps Hendricks managed to put up 5 goals and 8 assists on the 4th line last season in 60 games!

Sip are you really young enough to call Matt Hendricks "gramps?"

 

[Channelcat]

KHL vs AHL would be interesting. My money would be on AHL winning......but I'm not sure.

 

[heilongjetsfan]

Contract slides a year so Im cool with that deal.....He wasn't going to help the Jets this year so a little step back in his development is worth the extra season of cap savings IMO

Also, it's one less guy to protect from Seattle. We're going to have a painful decision to make:
Scheif, Wheeler, Connor, Laine, Ehlers, Roslo *have to* be protected for sure. Then pick two of Little, Perreault and Lowry to leave open. Buff, Morrissey and Troubs are our 3 protected Dmen, and Helle rounds it out. We're losing someone pretty good or paying out the nose not to.

I'm sure it's not the reason for us letting Vesa go home, but it's a definite plus.

 

[heilongjetsfan]

Chevy seems to think the A is important from his interview. It's the best way to grow from a junior/college player to a pro. Of the guys we drafted only Scheif, Trouba, Ehlers and Laine didn't go that route. And I think it shows in the latter two's play, whereas Rantanen profitted from his year in the A.

The interesting thing will be to see how it affects Veselainen's development. He's no longer coached by our organization. If he comes into camp in a battle with Appleton for one spot, next year, and loses that battle, because Appleton has grown through the system, what happens?

No, Scheif and Trouba played on an AHL squad

 

[NotCommitted]

KHL vs AHL would be interesting. My money would be on AHL winning......but I'm not sure.

I'm no fan of KHL, but this is crazy talk? I really think many seem to underestimate the quality of the European leagues in general.

 

[Omark]

KHL vs AHL would be interesting. My money would be on AHL winning......but I'm not sure.

Thank god there is this kind of people in sports betting market. Though not too much since Rochester Americans odds were over 7 against CSKA and over 3 against Geneve Servette (swiss) in Spengler cup. Rochester lost the games and got outscored 9—3. Rochester was average AHL team that year.

Edit: poor sample size but those are only ones i know from their games. I think the odds are pretty good measure since they are moved by the money people bet on it. Next time ahl vs khl game is on, lets bet on it on even odds, okay?

Edit2: apparently Rochester’s 60min win odds against CSKA were 9,5 (10%) and 3,75 against swiss club (30%). On 65min winner 2 way betting lines were 1,04 — 6,5 and 1,45 — 2,7

 

[Kaako Kappo]

Here Vesalainen says that the level of play in the AHL wasn't as good as he was hoping for. He also knows some people on the team (from his Frölunda times).

"gg ez, no re" -Kristian Vesalainen, probably

Honestly, the thing about AHL is that there are lots of people playing only for themselves. Even the worst garbage players dreams of making it into the NHL one day . I think that's what separates it from KHL. Not a bad place for developing, but probably not as good of a league as North-Americans think it is. Just my honest opinion.

 

[JetsUK]

How useful for Tolvanens delveopment has the KHL proven to be?

 

[Ippenator]

How useful for Tolvanens delveopment has the KHL proven to be?

Probably as useful as AHL has proven to be for Puljujärvi?

 

[Kaako Kappo]

How useful for Tolvanens delveopment has the KHL proven to be?

True. If he went to AHL he would be in the preds top 6 now. I just know it. No league other than AHL creates NHL players, that's the only REAL hockey there is.

If Kristian Vesalainen never becomes a good NHL player, i can promise you it's not because he didn't go to the AHL in his draft+2 year.

That being said, if i was to choose i'd want him in the AHL. But i don't think KHL is a bad choice.

 

[MardyBum]

So Monday is probably his first game?

 

[Ippenator]

Chevy seems to think the A is important from his interview. It's the best way to grow from a junior/college player to a pro. Of the guys we drafted only Scheif, Trouba, Ehlers and Laine didn't go that route. And I think it shows in the latter two's play, whereas Rantanen profitted from his year in the A.

The interesting thing will be to see how it affects Veselainen's development. He's no longer coached by our organization. If he comes into camp in a battle with Appleton for one spot, next year, and loses that battle, because Appleton has grown through the system, what happens?

Hello! Rantanen is TWO years older than Laine. If you want to compare Laine and Rantanen, you need to look at Rantanen two years ago. He was not even at Laine’s level then for sure. Had a 39 point rookie season then. And in general, even though he is right now a complete physical beast and a skilled bull with the puck, he was not physically even close to what he is now. He was by some margin ahead of Laine physically even then, but Laine will be still catching up during the next two or three years. Rantanen’s AHL season has almost nothing or at least very little to do with his physical development. The hard work was done in the off seasons with the same physical trainer (Hannu Rautala) that Laine is using, and that has been so loudly criticized by some posters here. Look what that training has made Rantanen become. But he was not even close to what he is nowadays still two years ago...

 

[paragon]

And I think it shows in the latter two's play, whereas Rantanen profitted from his year in the A.

I don't think it really made that much of a difference. It didn't hurt him, but a year in Liiga or KHL would have probably done the same. The thing that has helped Rantanen probably the most is his off-season training. His trainer said already two years ago that he will have a break out year because he's such a monster physically.

I have seen some people mention Koivu and Granlund as someone who benefited from AHL. That's not really true. They played there pretty much only because they happened to come over during the lockout seasons. Both were good enough to play in the NHL from the get go. Even if Granlund was pretty slow and overall raw physically and needed to work hard during the off-seasons to get to where he is now.

And for every Rantanen we have 4 guys like Pulkkinen, Rajala, Pesonen and Filppula who dominate in the AHL and yet never amount to anything in the NHL. Rantanen is the only Finnish forward to have a successful season in both AHL and NHL. Even Puljujärvi has played over 50 games in the AHL and still looks completely lost when he plays for the Oilers.