Kingston Frontenacs 2018-19 Season Thread

[beastintheeast]

I apologize brain overheated temp here in Thailand 34 degrees. Springer has no record of developing first round picks on his teams and although he is not the manager as owner he has a lot of input. Whether he has to start with the team or not again parents can have a great impact on what happens.

A kid can show up at camp go through all the moves but still not show much. He has met the requirements of the contract with the OHL if it is there. He can sign with the team but have an open trade contract. In actuality him not showing might help the fronts. Yes they would be pathetic again next year but they get the extra draft picks and can trade him to London or anywhere he wants for players and picks.

 

[barclayplager]

Question
Shane Wright has been given exceptional status and is therefore eligible for the draft. I know he cannot refuse to be drafted but I am pretty sure he can refuse to report or demand a trade.

Do you think considering the fact that you guys are in a huge rebuild and the track record of lack of development of players drafted in the first round that he will willingly report to the Fronts.

Let's face it AGNEW does not have a great track record as an owner and the team has a bad habit of not playing rookies and trading them after a year of sitting.

My gut tells me that there may be a trade or he may get passed over in the draft by Kingston and or Flint.

 

[barclayplager]

...replace Agnew with Butler and Fronts with Battalion and this piece could be on North Bay message board..Butler and his drafting and age is really taking a beating on NB board

 

[Truthking]

I apologize brain overheated temp here in Thailand 34 degrees. Springer has no record of developing first round picks on his teams and although he is not the manager as owner he has a lot of input. Whether he has to start with the team or not again parents can have a great impact on what happens.

A kid can show up at camp go through all the moves but still not show much. He has met the requirements of the contract with the OHL if it is there. He can sign with the team but have an open trade contract. In actuality him not showing might help the fronts. Yes they would be pathetic again next year but they get the extra draft picks and can trade him to London or anywhere he wants for players and picks.

What does the owner have to do with developing draft picks? You’re giving him a little too much credit there bud

 

[three dog night]

No he can’t

 

[ktownhockey]

I apologize brain overheated temp here in Thailand 34 degrees. Springer has no record of developing first round picks on his teams and although he is not the manager as owner he has a lot of input. Whether he has to start with the team or not again parents can have a great impact on what happens.

A kid can show up at camp go through all the moves but still not show much. He has met the requirements of the contract with the OHL if it is there. He can sign with the team but have an open trade contract. In actuality him not showing might help the fronts. Yes they would be pathetic again next year but they get the extra draft picks and can trade him to London or anywhere he wants for players and picks.

I know Springer well. He lets the people he hires do the hiring of the positions. He trusts in a few and they roll with it for better or worse.

 

[BadgerBruce]

No, he can’t. It’s part of the process to be granted exceptional status. Otherwise he would be denied. Probably why Savoie was denied status out west.

This isn’t quite right.

The Western Hockey League conducts a Bantam draft (2004 birth years). They already drafted the 2003 birth year players one year ago.

The OHL conducts a minor midget draft (2003 birth years).

Two completely different scenarios.

In other words, Matt Savoie does not need exceptional player status to become eligible for the upcoming 2019 WHL draft. He’s going to be the #1 pick and this has been known for a very long time.

So why did Savoie even apply for exceptional player status out west? If he’s already WHL draft eligible, why bother?

Simple: the WHL only allows just-drafted players to suit up for 5 WHL games in their first season. Savoie wanted that WHL regulation waived for him.

That was a very big long shot from the start. Hockey Canada handles exceptional player status applications on behalf of all 3 CHL leagues. In every other case since Tavares, the applications have been from players who wish to be drafted one year early. This is something Hockey Canada can rule on by following set procedures and player evaluation methods.

But none of those procedures applied to Savoie. He wanted Hockey Canada to waive an internal WHL Regulation, and Hockey Canada has no authority to do that.

The WHL just will not allow a kid that young to undertake the kind of lengthy bus trips (Manitoba to BC to Oregon and then back again, often for 10+ consecutive days) that are part of the typical WHL experience. They never have and I can’t see them ever bending on this.

Wright's application in Ontario was much more basic and traditional. All Hockey Canada had to ultimately determine is if he could be drafted.

Is Wright obliged to report to whatever OHL team selects him? Of course not. No drafted player is required to do so. There’s already a system in place to deal with what the OHL calls “defective” picks.

Having said this, you’d be hard pressed to find an OHL team that does not routinely reach out to a prospective draft picks, usually through their agents, well in advance of the draft. Kingston already knows where Wright stands and the reverse is also true. Wright has more leverage right now than most people realize: a supposedly generational player who could completely change a franchise’s financial outlook. I hate to be crude here, but he’s a licence to print money, just as McDavid was in Erie. The only question is whether the Mint ends up located in Kingston or somewhere else.

 

[dirty12]

If the OHL states that a 15 yr old given exceptional status cannot be traded until January of the year he will turn 17 like it is for the other draft eligibles, Wright does not have any leverage in choosing his OHL destination this year. He reports; or, goes back into the 2004 draft pool; or, goes to another league that can/will accept him.
If Wright chooses to exercise the defect option, Kingston or Flint should have the option of trading him September 2020 or January 2021; or, put him back into the 2021 draft pool. That does not seem a good option for Wright.
If Wright wants to play in the OHL this season, it will be for the team that drafted him.

 

[OSA]

Good grief everyone, the kid is a slam dunk to report to Kingston. It’s a safe, clean, prosperous city with educated inhabitants. Its not at all isolated, and it has a great hockey heritage. As a city, there were far more red flags for McDavid to consider when it came to Erie than there will be for Wright to consider when it comes to Kingston. On the hockey side, in spite of themselves, the Fronts have still sent a good number of quality hockey players to the pro ranks, including several very high NHL picks. There are some things to consider (maybe a new coach is needed, maybe some new scouts), but all in all the Fronts will be a fine organization for Wright to play for.

 

[BadgerBruce]

If the OHL states that a 15 yr old given exceptional status cannot be traded until January of the year he will turn 17 like it is for the other draft eligibles, Wright does not have any leverage in choosing his OHL destination this year. He reports; or, goes back into the 2004 draft pool; or, goes to another league that can/will accept him.
If Wright chooses to exercise the defect option, Kingston or Flint should have the option of trading him September 2020 or January 2021; or, put him back into the 2021 draft pool. That does not seem a good option for Wright.
If Wright wants to play in the OHL this season, it will be for the team that drafted him.

First, the odds of Wright reporting to Kingston are probably around 100:1, so expect him to show if the Fronts choose him.

But to suggest that he somehow MUST report or give up his OHL opportunity, is simply not supported by any history.

Even last year, the Petes chose Will Cuylle 3rd overall. He told them (prior to the draft) that he would not report to Peterborough.

End result? He’s deemed a defective pick and the Petes receive the #5 and #40 overall picks in 2019. Peterborough Petes’ top draft pick Will Cuylle indicates he will not report to the OHL team

As well, they traded his rights to Windsor for SEVEN picks (3 2nds, 3 3rds, 1 5th). Holy smokes!

Peterborough Petes deal Will Cuylle to Windsor Spitfires

So yes, Wright has leverage, just as Cuylle did after the Petes chose him.

 

[dirty12]

First, the odds of Wright reporting to Kingston are probably around 100:1, so expect him to show if the Fronts choose him.

But to suggest that he somehow MUST report or give up his OHL opportunity, is simply not supported by any history.

Even last year, the Petes chose Will Cuylle 3rd overall. He told them (prior to the draft) that he would not report to Peterborough.

End result? He’s deemed a defective pick and the Petes receive the #5 and #40 overall picks in 2019. Peterborough Petes’ top draft pick Will Cuylle indicates he will not report to the OHL team

As well, they traded his rights to Windsor for SEVEN picks (3 2nds, 3 3rds, 1 5th). Holy smokes!

Peterborough Petes deal Will Cuylle to Windsor Spitfires

So yes, Wright has leverage, just as Cuylle did after the Petes chose him.

More teams should take advantage of the defect rule, imo. The defect rule gives the drafting team leverage. The drafting team can choose the best offer from suitors that the players are willing to report; and, obtain comp pick.
I did not suggest Wright would not report to Kingston. In fact, I stated Wright might be salivating at the opportunity to land in Kingston in an earlier post.. My point was Wright has no leverage if the rule is only 1st round picks can traded in January of the year they turn 17 and ineligible to be traded as a 15 year old in September. Moreover, Kingston could just keep Wright until he truly wants to play in the OHL; or, declare him a defect and put him back into next year’s draft while taking the comp picks.

 

[Truthking]

More teams should take advantage of the defect rule, imo. The defect rule gives the drafting team leverage. The drafting team can choose the best offer from suitors that the players are willing to report; and, obtain comp pick.
I did not suggest Wright would not report to Kingston. In fact, I stated Wright might be salivating at the opportunity to land in Kingston in an earlier post.. My point was Wright has no leverage if the rule is only 1st round picks can traded in January of the year they turn 17 and ineligible to be traded as a 15 year old in September. Moreover, Kingston could just keep Wright until he truly wants to play in the OHL; or, declare him a defect and put him back into next year’s draft while taking the comp picks.

Is the rule they can’t be traded because of their age or is it just based on being a rookie. I find other people talking about the rules of exceptional player status but where did they see these rules?

 

[dirty12]

Is the rule they can’t be traded because of their age or is it just based on being a rookie. I find other people talking about the rules of exceptional player status but where did they see these rules?

I have not seen rules that apply to or force anything on a 15 or 16 yr old reporting. I (figure) that the OHL uses the 17th year beginning January to protect themselves while making it more likely the kid reports

 

[BadgerBruce]

The “defective pick” rule has pros and cons when we’re dealing with first rounders.

On the plus side, a team gets a compensatory pick just one spot lower the following season.

Further, they have until September 15th to trade the player. My recollection is that there is approximately 2 weeks from the date the pick can be declared defective and a trade can occur. Plenty of time to get a bidding war up and running. See the Cuylle haul or just look back to previous years with Logan Brown, Victor Mete, or Max Domi.

Surely some Kingston fans remember Gilmour selecting his former teammate’s son #8 overall in 2011.

Domi wouldn’t report and was declared defective. The Fronts received the #9 pick in 2012 as a compensatory pick.

That ended up being Sam Bennett.

They also pulled in 3 2nd rounders from the Knights when they dealt Domi to London.

Those picks netted defencemen Dylan Di Perna and Jakob Brahaney.The other pick was dealt in the Billy Jenkins acquisition.

On the whole, not too shabby, no?

The downside of declaring a pick defective?

A team’s reputation.

Think about when Ryan McLeod refused to report to Flint. The Firebirds’ owner had just been suspended for 5 years, a league-appointed staff ran the team, a very public walkout by the players had taken place and the ugly story was reported across North America.

Flint needed a high profile pick who would jumpstart the club’s credibility, and they failed miserably with the McLeod selection. They looked even worse when he refused to show up and they still deal with reputation issues.

Having said this, dealing McLeod did bring in Ty Dellandrea as a compensatory pick and SIX MORE picks from Mississauga. But the value of those picks declines when a franchise is on the players’ “Please, anywhere but there!” list.

Anyway, the Fronts should be safe with Shane Wright. But if by some chance he informed Kingston that he did not want to play for them, the club would reap a King’s ransom for him.

 

[dirty12]

The “defective pick” rule has pros and cons when we’re dealing with first rounders.

On the plus side, a team gets a compensatory pick just one spot lower the following season.

Further, they have until September 15th to trade the player. My recollection is that there is approximately 2 weeks from the date the pick can be declared defective and a trade can occur. Plenty of time to get a bidding war up and running. See the Cuylle haul or just look back to previous years with Logan Brown, Victor Mete, or Max Domi.

Surely some Kingston fans remember Gilmour selecting his former teammate’s son #8 overall in 2011.

Domi wouldn’t report and was declared defective. The Fronts received the #9 pick in 2012 as a compensatory pick.

That ended up being Sam Bennett.

They also pulled in 3 2nd rounders from the Knights when they dealt Domi to London.

Those picks netted defencemen Dylan Di Perna and Jakob Brahaney.The other pick was dealt in the Billy Jenkins acquisition.

On the whole, not too shabby, no?

The downside of declaring a pick defective?

A team’s reputation.

Think about when Ryan McLeod refused to report to Flint. The Firebirds’ owner had just been suspended for 5 years, a league-appointed staff ran the team, a very public walkout by the players had taken place and the ugly story was reported across North America.

Flint needed a high profile pick who would jumpstart the club’s credibility, and they failed miserably with the McLeod selection. They looked even worse when he refused to show up and they still deal with reputation issues.

Having said this, dealing McLeod did bring in Ty Dellandrea as a compensatory pick and SIX MORE picks from Mississauga. But the value of those picks declines when a franchise is on the players’ “Please, anywhere but there!” list.

Anyway, the Fronts should be safe with Shane Wright. But if by some chance he informed Kingston that he did not want to play for them, the club would reap a King’s ransom for him.

The only thing wrong with this is McLoed was selected the draft previous to the owner’s sanctions. The teams first pick was stripped, comp picks Dellandrea & Wismer reported, Holmes reported, Busby reporting was a big deal, ... no real reporting issue until the 2002 born draft when several top ranked players were going to be tough to recruit for most teams. Flint, Petes, Niagara, others I’m sure, have not been able to sign a 2-4 round pick

 

[BadgerBruce]

The only thing wrong with this is McLoed was selected the draft previous to the owner’s sanctions. The teams first pick was stripped, comp picks Dellandrea & Wismer reported, Holmes reported, Busby reporting was a big deal, ... no real reporting issue until the 2002 born draft when several top ranked players were going to be tough to recruit for most teams. Flint, Petes, Niagara, others I’m sure, have not been able to sign a 2-4 round pick

You’re right — my bad. McLeod was dealt to Mississauga after being declared defective by Flint, and the compensatory picks were made the following year.

 

[Naz]

Shane Wright is going to be a awesome player, the next 3-4 years are going to be fun enjoy