KHL Expansion Part VIII

[KTl]

The KHL is not in a position to expand at any costs. So, the league will accept just those foreign clubs who are bringing some benefits to the league. And of course, with stable financing.

As I said, the KHL World Games is a good indicator where they are looking at.

So Dubai is a candidate for KHL expansion?

 

[TheWhiskeyThief]

Until you have a breakdown of a KHL team's budget, I highly doubt travel is the line between making and losing money in the league.



Poprad did not relocate to Prague. Lev Poprad ceased operations. The Czech Ice Hockey Association had to give permission for an entirely different team to start in the country. Entirely different franchise.



Why don't Gazprom sized companies want to finance hockey clubs in the rest of Europe? Because financially responsible and sustainably spending is practiced in the rest of Europe.

It’s fairly easy to calculate flight times and plug into what it costs to charter aircraft and buses. I did it for a hypothetical London team and it was between $4-5mm and that didn’t include Vladivostok.

 

[Jussi]

It’s fairly easy to calculate flight times and plug into what it costs to charter aircraft and buses. I did it for a hypothetical London team and it was between $4-5mm and that didn’t include Vladivostok.

Add in security and insurances for every player and staff and that number balloons.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

They weren't meant to play in Poprad to start with though, their eventual time there was not really a failure in the same sense as some other projects might have been. Lev Praha came to be as technically separate, but the team was always meant to play in a major Czech city.

Being meant to play in another city in another country doesn't mean they are the same team, which was the incorrect assertion I was refuting. Wherever they were supposed to be is completely irrelevant to what was being discussed.

It’s fairly easy to calculate flight times and plug into what it costs to charter aircraft and buses. I did it for a hypothetical London team and it was between $4-5mm and that didn’t include Vladivostok.

You might get some skewed results considering travel costs for a London team are entirely different than any actual teams in the league.

 

[Albatros]

Being meant to play in another city in another country doesn't mean they are the same team, which was the incorrect assertion I was refuting. Wherever they were supposed to be is completely irrelevant to what was being discussed.

Yeah, but I don't see how Lev Poprad would have been a failure. Poprad was never meant to be a long-term KHL location and the time they had there was about as successful as it was ever going to be. They were a placeholder team that played to a full arena every night, what more can you ask.

 

[ItWasJustified]

This seems like positive news, What Europe has now is a mixed bag of garbage. I said it before I want to see teams like St. Petersburg SKA, Zurich Lions, Gothenberg Frolunda and Sparta Prague play each other in meaningful league games instead of playing teams in small towns. Funnel the best players in Europe into one league for the best product.

That idea is complete trash.

 

[vorky]

Yeah, but I don't see how Lev Poprad would have been a failure. Poprad was never meant to be a long-term KHL location and the time they had there was about as successful as it was ever going to be. They were a placeholder team that played to a full arena every night, what more can you ask.

I attended the games in Poprad, there was many fans from Czech Rep, Poland, Hungary, Austria and of course all Slovak regions.

 

[vorky]

You describe the European clubs as „financially responsible and sustainably spending.“ I asked you why Gazprom-sized corporations are not interested in financing the hockey clubs in Sweden, Finland, Czech Rep etc. Do you really believe those clubs would refuse the financing from such corporations? I see another problem here – the European hockey clubs have closed doors to these corporations because 1) their leagues are unattractive from business point of view, so marketing & all 2) clubs leaderships are not professionals from big business, they do not know how big business works. 3) corruption & amateurism of employees

If I were you, I would think about these & other reasons. The European club hockey needs more money from different sources. Once again, I am not saying the one corporation to finance all budget. I just say that the hockey officials need to bring the big corporations to European hockey. Looks like, they are not able to do that.

And you blame the KHL for the structure of their clubs budgets. You present is as „unresponsibility.“ I would say it is just different way of doing. It is stable enough. And the KHL is doing everything to diversify the clubs revenues, they have been going step by step. It can not be done within a day.

Last but not least, the European clubs have much lower budgets than KHL clubs. It is much easier to be profitable in such enviroment. The level is too low for European clubs. Last season showed us how un/stable the European clubs business model is.

 

[TheWhiskeyThief]

Being meant to play in another city in another country doesn't mean they are the same team, which was the incorrect assertion I was refuting. Wherever they were supposed to be is completely irrelevant to what was being discussed.



You might get some skewed results considering travel costs for a London team are entirely different than any actual teams in the league.

The number of road trips were limited in my study, it only adds $12k per trip for 4 hours flight time.

The KHL still has 7 time zones.

 

[Jonimaus]

Some KHL fans seem to think that the rest of europe is envious of them. Trust me when I say 99% of the swedish fans are thankfull we are not in that mess. Any swedish team joining KHL would have 0 fans left. There is absolutely 0 interest here playing regularly in a league against teams from anywhere but maybe Finland and Denmark.
The average swedish hockey can probably only name 2 or 3 KHL teams at most, there's no gain for us.
People here always mention a few swedish hockey teams that should join KHL. Is their expectation that they'd somehow become "team sweden in KHL" and that the entire country would rally behind them?

 

[Exarz]

Is their expectation that they'd somehow become "team sweden in KHL" and that the entire country would rally behind them?

 

[Jonimaus]

I mean, there has actually been news about Leif recently.

 

[Albatros]

A Swedish KHL team could have worked in the past, but nowadays the gap between the KHL and the SHL just isn't wide enough for it to make any sense.

 

[Rigafan]

Omg! I will have nightmares tonight

 

[p0nchik]

Add in security and insurances for every player and staff and that number balloons.

What type of security do KHL players receive? From the airport to the arena? I thought it would just be typical staff at the arena.

 

[p0nchik]

Some KHL fans seem to think that the rest of europe is envious of them. Trust me when I say 99% of the swedish fans are thankfull we are not in that mess. Any swedish team joining KHL would have 0 fans left. There is absolutely 0 interest here playing regularly in a league against teams from anywhere but maybe Finland and Denmark.
The average swedish hockey can probably only name 2 or 3 KHL teams at most, there's no gain for us.
People here always mention a few swedish hockey teams that should join KHL. Is their expectation that they'd somehow become "team sweden in KHL" and that the entire country would rally behind them?

I only recently started visiting my Swedish family. I grew up in the U.S. thinking Swedes were the least patriotic country, but from what I've gathered through my visits, it's that they are secretly the proudest.

I don't doubt that there is zero interest. I wholly believe that. For Swedes to consider the KHL, more Swedish players need to choose it over the SHL and NLA. Swedes follow Swedes, just as Russians follow Russians.

It doesn't really make sense for Swedes. I agree with you. Would be cool to see how a Swedish club could do in a better league like the KHL. It makes sense for Finland, considering they border Russia and have a number of Russians living in Finland. Makes sense for Latvia considering even more Russians live there. Same with Kazakhstan and so forth

I hope we get to a point where the primary nationality of a league is inconesequtional and the desire to play against the best overcomes that hurdle because I would love to see the top clubs in all of the leagues competing against each other on a regular basis. Right now, there is too much pride and politics to achieve this on a continental scale.

 

[Exarz]

I don't doubt that there is zero interest. I wholly believe that. For Swedes to consider the KHL, more Swedish players need to choose it over the SHL and NLA. Swedes follow Swedes, just as Russians follow Russians.

People really don't care about players outside the NHL, they just care about their own team. Swedish players already choose the KHL over the SHL and I doubt that any amount of Swedes in the league would make people more interested in it. It's a tough market to break into as fans are very conservative. Plus, the club structure makes it rather impossible for an established team to switch league.

It doesn't really make sense for Swedes. I agree with you. Would be cool to see how a Swedish club could do in a better league like the KHL. It makes sense for Finland, considering they border Russia and have a number of Russians living in Finland. Makes sense for Latvia considering even more Russians live there. Same with Kazakhstan and so forth

Saying that it make sense for Finland due to the amount of Russians living in Finland is just plain ignorance. The reason it "made sense" for a Finnish team to join the KHL is due to Russian ownership of Hartwall Arena which then led to Jokerit playing in the KHL.

 

[p0nchik]

And would they own it, as a precursor of moving a team to the KHL, if those conditions did not exist...? Logistics, proximity to Russia, Russians living in Finland, etc... That's like saying a Russian owned arena in Barcelona would be fit for the KHL. Or am I reading into your thought process incorrectly?

 

[Exarz]

And would they own it if those conditions did not exist...? Logistics, proximity to Russia, Russians living in Finland, etc... That's like saying a Russian owned arena in Barcelona would be fit for the KHL. Or am I reading into your thought process incorrectly?

Well, considering that a team from Croatia played in the league I highly doubt that the proximity to Russia is a significant factor

And can you please elaborate about the "Russians in Finland" and what type of role they would play in making sense for a Finnish KHL team? Neither of the arena owners nor any former/current foreign owners of Jokerit actually lives in Finland.

 

[filip85]

Well, considering that a team from Croatia played in the league I highly doubt that the proximity to Russia is a significant factor

Zagreb was hockey mecca before joining KHL compared to Barcelona.

 

[Exarz]

Zagreb was hockey mecca before joining KHL compared to Barcelona.

Absolutely! My reply was not about that, just strictly that the proximity to Russia is insignificant in that matter.

 

[vorky]

Tardif: The idea of a French KHL club is alive. We will re-consider the idea after COVID-times.

Bříza: Soon we will meet with all parties, including the KHL.

 

[Albatros]

"The idea is alive" is a polite way to express that absolutely nothing is going on.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

Tardif: The idea of a French KHL club is alive. We will re-consider the idea after COVID-times.

Bříza: Soon we will meet with all parties, including the KHL.

The idea of a Bolivian KHL team is alive. It will be reconsidered after COVID-times.

Los Pollitos de La Paz. 85% of their budget provided by Rosneft to keep with KHL tradition.

And it has the same chance of happening as a French KHL team. Same non-existent owner, same non-existent available arena, same empirical evidence for its possible existence.

 

[Jussi]

The idea of a Bolivian KHL team is alive. It will be reconsidered after COVID-times.

Los Pollitos de La Paz. 85% of their budget provided by Rosneft to keep with KHL tradition.

And it has the same chance of happening as a French KHL team. Same non-existent owner, same non-existent available arena, same empirical evidence for its possible existence.

Trust the process. The process which has not worked ever before. And no, I don't include Jokerit as being part of a process, their situation was unique and nothing to do with a process. Case closed.