Proposal: Jets need to start utilizing load management; start rotating press box players into line-up

[HannuJ]

I've gone on about this before, but this weird season's the best example of the NHL needing to take its head out of its arse and to start resting players as part of load management.

Hockey, as you know, is (grossly) old school. players will come back from injuries too early, not play at 100% and then either get injured again quickly or their on-ice performance takes a hit. Coaches are also reluctant to rest players during a game or to give them the night off. it's like pulling teeth for a backup goalie to get action, never mind rotating your forwards and D in and out of the line-up.

The Jets are starting to enter a weird part of their schedule. Tonight's a travel night back to Wpg, then you see 3 games in 4 nights, 3 nights off, then 4 games in 6 nights, with 3 of the games likely being physical games vs Calgary.

IF NHL coaches were smart and actually thought outside the box, NOW would be the time to best utilize their taxi squad/press box players.

On D, we know that Demelo and Poolman are ready to come back in. We've seen a sample size of ONE game where the D hasn't looked shaky. If you are putting both Demelo and Poolman back in vs Ottawa, then this should be the start of rotation ONE of EVERY d-man out of the line-up for each game. Yes, sit Pionk, Forbort and Morrissey for a game. have each of them sitting once every 4 games. You have the manpower to do it.

On O, we just had our franchise centre, Nate Thompson, go down with an injury. Gus will likely get some ice time. Know who else should pop into the line-up? Vesalainen. Start him on the 4th line. Sit a player. Give Vesalainen 1 out of every 3 games. Pop him into the line-up, rotate a player out. Same with Suess. Do this so that Scheifele, Ehlers, Wheeler and Connor end up sitting every 4 or 5 games. 1 of them sitting for a game = no big deal. fresher legs. also gives some playing time to two prospects to see if they fit and puts them at lower risk situations, gets them acquainted to NHL hockey, keeps them fresh.

I know this is outside-the-box thinking for a lot of you, but when you'll see the inevitable rash of injuries and COVID protocol benchings, being proactive means that your club will be at an advantage.

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[KingBogo]

You will have to add to your plan how to get around waiver wire rules on moving players back and forth from the taxi squad.

 

[Farmboy Patty]

You wanna watch players rotating in and out of the lineup – go and watch soccer. Just kidding! Your idea would be cool but as KingBogo pointed out, there would be trouble with waivers. I also can't see a reason to rest your top players unless they are unfit to play. I think that with proper time management (which Maurice is not so great at) they can pull through this shortened season with acceptable level of play.

 

[surixon]

Yesterday actually saw good load management for our top players. All played a a number of minutes less per game and a good chunk of it was less taxing pp time.

They should be pretty rested for the b2b this weekend.

 

[HannuJ]

You will have to add to your plan how to get around waiver wire rules on moving players back and forth from the taxi squad.

waiver claims won't be much of an issue at this point. who are you worried about losing?
and then there's losing a player on waivers to a US team. 14 days of quarantine reduces that option significantly

 

[Gnova]

waiver claims won't be much of an issue at this point. who are you worried about losing?
and then there's losing a player on waivers to a US team. 14 days of quarantine reduces that option significantly

So you are talking about rotating out players who already aren't playing a lot.of minutes? Those are the only ones that wouldn't get snatched up on waivers.
The players that may benefit from this because they play big minutes would never clear waivers.

 

[voyageur]

I think there's a lot of things to consider. When you've played 4 hockey games as a team, and one warmup game, in almost 9 months, chemistry is an important factor. We're seeing chemistry from training offseason paying dividends in the Forbort-Pionk pairing, who most would agree lost stronger than Kulikov-Pionk. We'll probably see Beaulieu-De Melo at some point, with the same expectation, of chemistry, and synchronism. The lack of this has shown in our early PK struggles, which could have cost us more points than it has, if not for some OT wins.

In regards to the young players. For Heinola the Jets have to make a critical decision on him. Starting him at 19 takes a year off his ELC. So that his contract would come up before the Jets have the Cap space with Wheeler, Scheif and Helly's contracts all expiring to give him a big payout. If you bridge a young player you risk losing them not long after that bridge. That said this might be the best Jets team assembled, needing a defenseman of his potential to stabilize it. So I see Heinola as someone on a trial basis. Samberg might get more games than him this year. I think the work with Dylan is integrating him into the defensive systems, and getting him back up to speed, after a lengthy layoff.

Thompson is Maurice's vet. Can't state his influence in the room, since I am not in it. But his performance has been underwhelming, and if injured, well next man up. Maybe CJ Suess gets a look.

I feel like the Jets are thinking that Ves may need more development. I thought there was an opportunity with Laine out, to see what he can bring, especially to our PP, but I'm not watching him practice so there may be things I don't understand. I think his consistent up and down from the taxi squad may be more financially motivated than anything. Couple of days of earning an NHL salary here and there is a big difference from a $70 000 (do they even get that much in a shortened season?) payout sitting on the taxi squad. A little extra money in the kid's pocket is good, and he's around the team, which is a good way to integrate someone into it. Gustafsson started his days as a Jet in the PB, in the integration process.

We do have some flexibility right now.

But if Forsberg actually joins the team, and Niku is permanently relegated, and one of Thompson or Perreault is in the PB, then there is a lot less flexibility. Hinged on waiving players. And that's a risky management game, because it's not a guarantee that every young player is going to be better than every vet, and the key to depth at the NHL level, other than spending a lot on AHL players (Leafs), is ELC depth.

Maurice has always emphasized getting his teams off to strong starts. Last year with Buff leaving the team in TC, and Little going down in TC, and Beaulieu going down, made it harder to get a strong start.

But you start strong and you can rest your big guns when you need to, since you are not chasing all season. That seems to be the goal. So far, so good I'd say. The biggest improvement we need is in special teams, otherwise I feel like this team is already starting to come together, waiting for De Melo to join the team next.

 

[kcin94]

So you are talking about rotating out players who already aren't playing a lot.of minutes? Those are the only ones that wouldn't get snatched up on waivers.
The players that may benefit from this because they play big minutes would never clear waivers.

The players you rotate out who require waivers can still be on the 23 man roster.

The players who rotate onto the taxi squad can be the ones who don't require waivers. It would be delicate, but could work.

The bigger issue is those players on ELCs/2 way-contracts getting rotated onto the taxi squad (Ves, Heinola, Stanley). You will piss them off massively if they've earned a place on the roster but get rotated off for "load management" which cuts their pay by 80-90%.

 

[KingBogo]

waiver claims won't be much of an issue at this point. who are you worried about losing?
and then there's losing a player on waivers to a US team. 14 days of quarantine reduces that option significantly

The possibility of waiver claims would severely limit your proposed plan. The Jets currently have 23 players who would require waivers. 20 on the active roster and 3 on the non active roster (DeMelo - leave and Poolman and Forsberg Covid protocols). To replace the 3 on leave/Covid protocol you have KV, Stanley and Heinola up with the NHL team. If everyone is healthy with no leaves or Covid protocols the Jets have a full 23 man NHL roster of players requiring waivers. To rest someone you are then merely putting in the 13th forward or 7th D for that player. So basically you are using Nate Thompson to replace whichever forward you bring out, same idea on defense. If/when you have injuries you can bring up someone from the taxi squad, you can't however bring them up to rest a player, which is basically a healthy scratch. The only 2 players the Jets would likely risk are Thompson and maybe Forsberg if they want to go looking for another 3rd string goalie.

 

[Jetsfan79]

I think team chemistry/synchronism is a factor to be considered as eloquently pointed out by voyageur. I also think depth (or lack therof) could be another factor as are waiver considerations. That being said, I think the overall premise by the OP has allot of merit.

If the load management concept continues to grow over the years and becomes more of a league wide mindset, perhaps the NHL considers changing the waiver rules. Instead of immediately requiring waivers for a player to be sent down, perhaps they create a rule that allows players to be sent down but only for a certain time threshold. Maybe only requiring teams to put said players on waivers after 3 minor league games are played or 7 calendar days elapse. Veteran players can protect themselves with NMCs or if a new, specific "No demotion Clause" option is available when negotiating contracts.

 

[Buffdog]

I was listening to the head trainer of (I believe) the Kings and he was talking about how they use wearable technology to gauge both short term and long term load on players. They contain GPS technology that tracks strides taken, acceleration, total distance skated, etc. They can only use them for practices (NHL doesn't allow them for games).

I believe they also use other metrics like HRV to determine if a player is overworked and needs a break - the first thing they do when they get to the rink before practice/pre game skate is put this thing on and sit for a bit.

For the life of me I can't remember the name of the device (it's on the tip of my tongue) or the exact podcast episode it was but it was definitely the Pacey Performance Podcast. If there are any other exercises phys nerds in here, you'd probably dig it

https://podcasts.google.com/?feed=a...2V5cGVyZm9ybWFuY2Vwb2RjYXN0L2ZlZWQueG1s&ep=14

 

[DeepFrickinValue]

I’ve been advocating for load management for Jets defenceman for sometime now.

Jets must have the highest injury rate for defenceman in the league.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I've gone on about this before, but this weird season's the best example of the NHL needing to take its head out of its arse and to start resting players as part of load management.

Hockey, as you know, is (grossly) old school. players will come back from injuries too early, not play at 100% and then either get injured again quickly or their on-ice performance takes a hit. Coaches are also reluctant to rest players during a game or to give them the night off. it's like pulling teeth for a backup goalie to get action, never mind rotating your forwards and D in and out of the line-up.

The Jets are starting to enter a weird part of their schedule. Tonight's a travel night back to Wpg, then you see 3 games in 4 nights, 3 nights off, then 4 games in 6 nights, with 3 of the games likely being physical games vs Calgary.

IF NHL coaches were smart and actually thought outside the box, NOW would be the time to best utilize their taxi squad/press box players.

On D, we know that Demelo and Poolman are ready to come back in. We've seen a sample size of ONE game where the D hasn't looked shaky. If you are putting both Demelo and Poolman back in vs Ottawa, then this should be the start of rotation ONE of EVERY d-man out of the line-up for each game. Yes, sit Pionk, Forbort and Morrissey for a game. have each of them sitting once every 4 games. You have the manpower to do it.

On O, we just had our franchise centre, Nate Thompson, go down with an injury. Gus will likely get some ice time. Know who else should pop into the line-up? Vesalainen. Start him on the 4th line. Sit a player. Give Vesalainen 1 out of every 3 games. Pop him into the line-up, rotate a player out. Same with Suess. Do this so that Scheifele, Ehlers, Wheeler and Connor end up sitting every 4 or 5 games. 1 of them sitting for a game = no big deal. fresher legs. also gives some playing time to two prospects to see if they fit and puts them at lower risk situations, gets them acquainted to NHL hockey, keeps them fresh.

I know this is outside-the-box thinking for a lot of you, but when you'll see the inevitable rash of injuries and COVID protocol benchings, being proactive means that your club will be at an advantage.

I agree in theory. But you know they are not going to sit Scheifele out. He needs it more than anyone else. The best you can hope for is that they will give him less TOI in some games.

You can't send anyone to the taxi squad who would need waivers. We have some waiver exempt players who could be taxied. Waiver players could stay on the roster in the PB for a game. But the players who need the rest most won't get it. So it becomes about rotating the non playing players into the bottom of the roster for an occasional game.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Yesterday actually saw good load management for our top players. All played a a number of minutes less per game and a good chunk of it was less taxing pp time.

They should be pretty rested for the b2b this weekend.

Sure, all we need to do is jump out to a 4-0 lead every game and Mau will manage TOI.

 

[HannuJ]

I agree in theory. But you know they are not going to sit Scheifele out. He needs it more than anyone else. The best you can hope for is that they will give him less TOI in some games.

You can't send anyone to the taxi squad who would need waivers. We have some waiver exempt players who could be taxied. Waiver players could stay on the roster in the PB for a game. But the players who need the rest most won't get it. So it becomes about rotating the non playing players into the bottom of the roster for an occasional game.

less TOI isn't as good as a day off.
i know that NHL coaches wouldn't dare do this...but, damn, sport science is probably on my side saying that they should be doing it

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

So you are talking about rotating out players who already aren't playing a lot.of minutes? Those are the only ones that wouldn't get snatched up on waivers.
The players that may benefit from this because they play big minutes would never clear waivers.

You can PB a Scheifele. No waivers required. Send down a waiver exempt player. Problem there is that that exempt player is the one you want to give some playing time to. Seriously, you can send someone else down. You are only going to rest 1 top player at a time.

I think the real flaw is that you are then playing every game without one of your top players. Not going to happen.

 

[Spock]

You can PB a Scheifele. No waivers required. Send down a waiver exempt player. Problem there is that that exempt player is the one you want to give some playing time to. Seriously, you can send someone else down. You are only going to rest 1 top player at a time.

I think the real flaw is that you are then playing every game without one of your top players. Not going to happen.

Yeah. The biggest issue with this whole idea is the Jets aren't in a position to be giving Scheifele, Wheeler, Et Al. a day off. They aren't a 14-1 NFL team.

 

[HannuJ]

You can PB a Scheifele. No waivers required. Send down a waiver exempt player. Problem there is that that exempt player is the one you want to give some playing time to. Seriously, you can send someone else down. You are only going to rest 1 top player at a time.

I think the real flaw is that you are then playing every game without one of your top players. Not going to happen.

same shit happens if that player's injured. it happens.

 

[KingBogo]

Sure, all we need to do is jump out to a 4-0 lead every game and Mau will manage TOI.

Yup. The best way to load manage is to get a 4 goal lead, then role 4 lines and even up the ice time.

 

[kcin94]

I think team chemistry/synchronism is a factor to be considered as eloquently pointed out by voyageur. I also think depth (or lack therof) could be another factor as are waiver considerations. That being said, I think the overall premise by the OP has allot of merit.

If the load management concept continues to grow over the years and becomes more of a league wide mindset, perhaps the NHL considers changing the waiver rules. Instead of immediately requiring waivers for a player to be sent down, perhaps they create a rule that allows players to be sent down but only for a certain time threshold. Maybe only requiring teams to put said players on waivers after 3 minor league games are played or 7 calendar days elapse. Veteran players can protect themselves with NMCs or if a new, specific "No demotion Clause" option is available when negotiating contracts.

If they really want this, then they can expand the roster to be more than 23 players. They don't need to change the waiver wire.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

less TOI isn't as good as a day off.
i know that NHL coaches wouldn't dare do this...but, damn, sport science is probably on my side saying that they should be doing it

I really don't know about the science. And I don't know where a tipping point would be, but if we are going to go past it, this would be the year.

But you saw us against Flames in the play-in without Scheif. Stastny hasn't played well enough to make me think we would be any better now. Giving Scheif a day off would be like throwing a game. Don't know if any other player would be in the same category. Probably not. So under what circumstances do we rest Scheifele for a game?

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Yeah. The biggest issue with this whole idea is the Jets aren't in a position to be giving Scheifele, Wheeler, Et Al. a day off. They aren't a 14-1 NFL team.

Wheeler, we could probably spare for a game. Stastny, sure. Laine, Ehlers and Connor? Maybe against Sens if there is a day we play them when we are less tired than they are and then only 1 of them at a time.

We may be forced to play some games without some of those players. We've already missed Laine for 3 games - and counting. But I can't honestly see it being done deliberately, except maybe for the 2 old men, Wheeler and Stastny.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

same shit happens if that player's injured. it happens.

Yeah, I know. We have played 3 without Laine, so far.

It might even be a good idea to rest even Scheifele - once.
I don't see Mau doing that though. He expects his top men to push through anything and everything and still produce at a top level.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

same shit happens if that player's injured. it happens.

This topic reminded me of something. In recent years there has been a scheduled break for each team, plus the ASB. Are there any such breaks this year? Other than some schedule anomalies like the gap we had after our first game, that is.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Yup. The best way to load manage is to get a 4 goal lead, then role 4 lines and even up the ice time.

If our goalies keep playing the way they have, a 3 goal lead might suffice.