Post-Game Talk: Jets 6 - Devils 1

[Guffman]

I have no use for it in evaluating it in the context of a single game

Neither do I but that is what is being posted... the "advanced stats" for a single game along with commentary from a non-forum poster.

If it's worthless in evaluating a single game, why support bringing it to our PGT?

 

[Guffman]

Dude literally said he doesn't post on here anymore because some posters seem to take offence when he simply posted his statistical analysis... and that they wouldn't let up so it took the fun out of it.

As for who was doing that, you're guess is as good as mine

I mean look at the same fans who turn to 'statistically' we should have beaten Las Vegas... kinda the same people flaming @Fatdrunk for just posting stats

I think I gave him the gears once when he was concluding about the play of certain players based on Corsi when he admitted he didn't watch the game.

If I was the one who drove him out for that single critique (which was deserved, TBH), I don't know what to say.

PS: I do like to use "advanced statistics" if it furthers my agenda when debating someone who truly believes in the gospel of "advanced statistics being the be-all, end-all of analysis. Jets outplayed the Blues, the eventual SC champs. Making a trade was a smart thing to do. I will die on that hill.

 

[Inanna]

Making a trade was a smart thing to do. I will die on that hill.

It seems to me that everyone who says "I will die on that hill" doesn't.

 

[Ducky10]

Neither do I but that is what is being posted... the "advanced stats" for a single game along with commentary from a non-forum poster.

If it's worthless in evaluating a single game, why support bringing it to our PGT?

Didn’t say it was worthless. It’s not.

Nice cherry pick though.

 

[Guffman]

Didn’t say it was worthless. It’s not.

Nice cherry pick though.

If you have "no use" for something, that's actually the definition of worthless LMAO

 

[Ducky10]

If you have "no use" for something, that's actually the definition of worthless LMAO

Read the post again and try to understand. I know that’s asking a lot, but really, really try. I think you can do it.

 

[Jets 31]

This debate about posting analytics shows the value of simply ignoring things and moving on - no ignore button, just don't read it and move along.

Who cares if a poster here posts a tweet unless it's inflammatory? Pretty much everything on this site is opinion anyway, it's just shown different ways.

I choose to just watch the games, and have never dug into analytics or any deep analysis. I do however appreciate the posters that do take the time to either post the work of others, or write it out themselves. This adds to my assessment of and interest in the game when I feel like doing a deep dive. On the days I don't - which is most - I simply skip over these posts.

Live and let live.

Never skip over one of the Dude's posts , they are always very informative.

 

[Ducky10]

Wpgcheif presents a really interesting stat recap each game (that I appreciate) that is always dripping with anti-Jets cynicism (that I don't appreciate).

It's as though it's not cool to be positive about the Jets on Twatter.

I think the latter is what rubs some people the wrong way. I get that, it used to for me as well. It’s just a commentary based on the numbers though, not necessarily the more contextual things that go into it.
That’s my take on it, lord knows the Jets make it easy for people to be cynical though.

 

[Guffman]

Read the post again and try to understand. I know that’s asking a lot, but really, really try. I think you can do it.

I read your post again that talks about when "advanced stats" are useful (which isn't the issue being discussed) but I did quote you (which you call cherry picking) on its relevance to a single game, which you essentially said it's worthless, which I agree with.

Let's go back to what was originally posted. Advanced stats for a single game, which, I think we're both agreed on, is worthless.

Sorry guy... no matter how dismissive you're trying to be now, you've actually fallen on my side of this.

Thanks for the support.

Feel free to move the goal posts though.

 

[Jets 31]

I really like how the Jets have played the last 2 games and the line combinations . Now lets kick those Cowpokes on Wednesday .

 

[Stumbledore]

Never skip over one of the Dude's posts , they are always very informative.

So it's not just Coach Bowness who suffers from ocular migraine?

 

[JetsFan815]

Every post-game thread, he just links WPG Chief’s tweets and nothing else. Like I said before, if WPG Chief doesn’t want to post here, don’t bring his tweets here. Since he’s consistently ignored that, I have dealt with that and just put him on ignore. Moving on.

As for my supposed “ignorance towards analytical models”, yeah… I sure received an earful a few years ago when most of you were Corsi zealots. We sure don’t hear about Corsi anymore.

Clinging to simplistic mathematical models doesn’t make posters more informed. It makes you say silly things like… oh, I dunno… ”Perfetti is playing like a fourth liner” or “Petan has better goal scoring metrics than Laine” or “Marko Dano deserves top 6 position based on his advanced stat metrics”.

He can chose to post about whatever he wishes here, it's a free message board. Who died and made you the chief censor on this board? People post about all kinds of stuff here, this is hockey/Jets related.

His posts and tweets of Wpg Chief's tweets brings useful discussion and shares knowledge whereas many of your posts are about celebrating your own ignorance about these topics.

 

[GeorgeJETson]

So, that's the second game for the Jets that I've missed and the second time they came out flying. Coincidence? You're welcome, but I'm afraid I plan to be glued to the screen for Wednesday.

I'm kidding, of course. Maybe we can get your opinions during the game in the GDT? You seem to have some pretty good insights!

 

[DRW204]

Funny thing is Wpg chiefs tweets aren't even his captured or authored stats.

They're a summation of publicly available sites that use (I'm pretty sure) use the nhl.com open source data (API I beleive it's called). So anyone can just go on natural stat trick etc and grab it.

How someone gets so mad over this is beyond me.

 

[Guffman]

He can chose to post about whatever he wishes here, it's a free message board. Who died and made you the chief censor on this board? People post about all kinds of stuff here, this is hockey/Jets related.

His posts and tweets of Wpg Chief's tweets brings useful discussion and shares knowledge whereas many of your posts are about celebrating your own ignorance about these topics.

1. I am also free to put someone on ignore if their only contribution to a PGT thread is to repost some other rando person's stuff. I suppose that part is resolved.

2. As @Ducky10 admitted, those stats have "no use" for a particular game discussion. If you find it useful, I guess that's cool but most people agree that it isn't useful on such a micro level.

3. I suppose your enlightenment on advanced stats led you to suggest not protecting Morrissey for the expansion draft or others to suggest Perfetti is playing as a fourth liner this year or Mark Dano deserved top 6 position or Nic Petan is a better goal scorer than Laine. But I guess I'm ignorant to this stuff (but almost always right)

 

[gojetsgo]

Funny thing is Wpg chiefs tweets aren't even his captured or authored stats.

They're a summation of publicly available sites that use (I'm pretty sure) use the nhl.com open source data (API I beleive it's called). So anyone can just go on natural stat trick etc and grab it.

How someone gets so mad over this is beyond me.

I don't care if they get posted here, just find it annoying when people use public advance stats from a single game sample size as the end all be all

 

[Guffman]

I don't care if they get posted here, just find it annoying when people use public advance stats from a single game sample size as the end all be all

Apparently, it brings "useful discussion".

See? We're discussing it (but perhaps not in the way intended).

 

[Ducky10]

1. I am also free to put someone on ignore if their only contribution to a PGT thread is to repost some other rando person's stuff. I suppose that part is resolved.

2. As @Ducky10 admitted, those stats have "no use" for a particular game discussion. If you find it useful, I guess that's cool but most people agree that it isn't useful on such a micro level.

3. I suppose your enlightenment on advanced stats led you to suggest not protecting Morrissey for the expansion draft or others to suggest Perfetti is playing as a fourth liner this year or Mark Dano deserved top 6 position or Nic Petan is a better goal scorer than Laine. But I guess I'm ignorant to this stuff (but almost always right)

I said they are of no use to me in relation to whether the Jets win a particular game or not. If you’re going to continue to quote me, at least get it right.
They are of very good use in many other aspects in a micro and ultimately a macro level.

You’re correct about one thing though, you’re ignorant to this stuff.

 

[Ducky10]

I read your post again that talks about when "advanced stats" are useful (which isn't the issue being discussed) but I did quote you (which you call cherry picking) on its relevance to a single game, which you essentially said it's worthless, which I agree with.

Let's go back to what was originally posted. Advanced stats for a single game, which, I think we're both agreed on, is worthless.

Sorry guy... no matter how dismissive you're trying to be now, you've actually fallen on my side of this.

Thanks for the support.

Feel free to move the goal posts though.

Missed again….

 

[WolfHouse]

Holy fk. Advanced stat virginity debate and more word policing... please let us win on Wednesday.

 

[Been around]

First off...if your advanced stats tell you the devils should win that game..good luck on selling your stats as there is no way njd deserved to win...meaning fix your shit.
Secondly..advanced "HOCKEY" stats have their uses, but not nearly as much as they are trotted out to be...there are far too many variables to consider. Ridiculous bounce from a stanchion, freak bounce, 2 or 3 ricochet off players...ffs even the very ice they play on is a factor...oooohhh but not as much as you think...amirite lol

 

[Been around]

And that's merely the minute variables imagine trying to factor in players attention to detail per game, or their drive for that game or throughout the season....well folks, they have averages. Tell me the average hockey iq of each player now please...as I'm dying to know

While you're at it, why don't you tell me their gaf factor for each game...

And that's merely the minute variables imagine trying to factor in players attention to detail per game, or their drive for that game or throughout the season....well folks, they have averages. Tell me the average hockey iq of each player now please...as I'm dying to know

While you're at it, why don't you tell me their gaf factor for each game...

Lol good luck

 

[Ducky10]

 

[Been around]

View attachment 681307

Is that directed at me? If so lol

 

[Guffman]

I said they are of no use to me in relation to whether the Jets win a particular game or not. If you’re going to continue to quote me, at least get it right.

Interesting. What you ACTUALLY originally said was:

I have no use for it in evaluating it in the context of a single game and whether or not the Jets won.

See, what you originally said, and I will paraphrase for clarity, is that you have no use for advanced stats for:

1. Evaluating it in the context of a single game; AND
2. Whether or not the Jets won

Maybe you just don’t understand what the word “and” is used for. It’s a conjunction. If you’re still not sure, someone could substitute the phrase “in addition to” for “and”.

I certainly did quote you properly. I just dismissed the stuff after “and” as inconsequential to the first phrase.

What I find amusing is that you told me to “get it right” when I quote you and yet, your paraphrasing of your own quote was incorrect.

LOL.

Anyways, chalk another one up for Guffman!