Player Discussion J.T. Miller

[nevesis]

Interesting article...read it and let's hear some opinions...

http://www.blueshirtbanter.com/2014/11/6/7161415/its-time-to-give-j-t-miller-a-legitimate-chance

Click to read more...

 

[NYR Viper]

I would agree with this. If nothing else, I would play him against teams like the Red Wings who don't carry a 'tough guy' like Glass. He needs to play at the NHL level.

 

[Thirty One]

In regards to the gif of him skating through the whole team up ice, and the conclusion that he has nothing to prove at the AHL level: we all know he has the ability to do that. What he needs to prove is that he knows when to take that chance and when not to.

 

[Steve Kournianos]

He's 99pct right except that Hayes wasn't mostly a wing in college.

He was a 4th line center most of his freshman year, centered Kreider for half his sophomore season, was the No. 2 center before getting hurt as a junior, and was a center as a senior until being moved to Arnold's wing halfway through his senior season.

Hayes and Miller deserve to be up right now. Mueller doesn't.

When Stepan comes back, I'd love to see Miller as the 4th line LW and Hayes center Hagelin and MSL.

Def won't happen though. This will be a veteran lineup when healthy.

 

[NYR Viper]

Miller and Hayes should be playing together on this teams 3rd line/4th line.Those 2 should be learning to play together so they can grow together.

 

[Ail]

Interesting article...read it and let's hear some opinions...

http://www.blueshirtbanter.com/2014/11/6/7161415/its-time-to-give-j-t-miller-a-legitimate-chance

The one thing I agree the most with is that Miller has nothing left to learn in the AHL. If the issues are still off-ice then Hartford serves as nothing more than a jail sentence to "teach him" whatever lesson AV is trying to convey.

Post camp Miller did not do much, and optimally Hayes and Miller would both stay up to work through their rookie mistakes. However only one of them has proved their game is above the AHL level by playing there and dominating. This is really about who deserves what, but for as good as Hayes has been at times, I don't think a swap with Miller would hurt him. Miller can get another crack at the NHL and Hayes can prove his game is similarly above AHL caliber. At the very least he can work on his faceoffs.

Optimally the 4th line should be Stempniak, Moore and someone not Tanner Glass. However I don't think Mueller is optimal for the role either.

 

[Steve Kournianos]

It is puzzling why Sather in conjunction with Vigneault aren't allowing Miller to follow the same career track they afforded everybody else.

I mean, he trusts Kostka and Glass with late game minutes, sometimes by default. They're stilll here, though.

Seems hypocritical. I think guys like Mcilrath and Miller think so as well.

Play them or trade them.

 

[silverfish]

It is puzzling why Sather in conjunction with Vigneault aren't allowing Miller to follow the same career track they afforded everybody else.

I mean, he trusts Kostka and Glass with late game minutes, sometimes by default. They're stilll here, though.

Seems hypocritical. I think guys like Mcilrath and Miller think so as well.

Play them or trade them.

Explain this. It confuses me.

Do you mean the career track where Miller was the #1 option for 3C going into camp. Played every preseason game and 3 NHL games before the team realized they had more in Hayes than Miller? Because if you mean that path, you're right. They should have offered him more of an opportunity to win the job they essentially handed to him this off-season.

Not to mention his zone starts, too. The team really put him in a position to fail. 18 ozone starts, 6 neutral zone, and 2 defensive zone. It's just unbelievable how poorly AV and the staff used JT this season. Despite those zone starts, Miller was on the ice for 5 goals against and 1 goal for in his 3 games with the Rangers.

They gave him every opportunity early this year. He was outplayed by Hayes at center and by Duclair at wing. He's in the minors so he can play top minutes in all three zones. JT as a lot of his game to work on.

Don't look now, but Duke and JT are tied in career points!

EDIT 2 - inb4JeffMagnum says all I do on these boards is bash JT

 

[McRanger]

Its hard to let centers and D-men learn at the NHL level when you expect to be a Stanley Cup contender.

 

[Idlerlee]

Miller wont ever take the step, its all downhill from here.

#Boldprediction2014

 

[savebyrichter94]

Its hard to let centers and D-men learn at the NHL level when you expect to be a Stanley Cup contender.

While I can understand the sentiment here, cups are neither won or lost this early in the season. Also, I'm pretty sure we expect to be contenders for the foreseeable future so at some point we have to bite the bullet and deal with some growing pains and mistakes for the good of the team moving forward.

 

[TheTakedown]

makes sense to play Miller in Hayes spot for about 10 games... these little 3-4 game windows are not enough to prove whether or not the player is actually capable, especially when coupled with the fact that there has been so much line juggling in a short amount of time (we've only played 11 games and we've seen about 30 different line combinations).

Then again, I've answered my own question. There IS no stability on this team, and expecting Miller or Hayes to essentially be a 2C while Dominic Moore slots up as a 3C was never going to happen. It sucks, but that was the cards we were dealt. With Stepan coming back, there may be a time in the VERY near future (thinking game 20, when Glass wears out his welcome) where Miller gets a good 7-10 game stint. We will see.

if both Miller solidifes in the NHL, AND Hayes shows he is too good for the AHL, then they should BOTH play. Hayes on the 4th line if necessary next to Moore and Stempniak, replacing Mueller or Glass.

Kreider-Stepan-MSL
Zucc-Brass-Nash
Hagelin-Miller-Stempniak/Duclair
Hayes-Moore-Duclair/Stempniak/Glass

 

[Mikos87]

I think he's ready and needs to be allowed to play. AV isn't the best coach when it comes to bringing up youth, outside of guys like Burrows who came up with AV from the minors in VAN, the only prospect that "flourished" under him during his tenure there was Hogdson and he was traded after requesting more ice time.

AV is adverse to playing young guys because they make mistakes. That's one thing Torts, for all his flaws, was really good at doing. Bringing up kid after kid.

On Miller:

I think that the team can afford to have in the middle in a protected role. Basically what Richards got last year except with less ice time.

I don't think Miller nor McIlrath who were "Torts Picks" really strike AV's fancy. The leash on those two were much shorter than a guy like Pouliot last year who was thrown over the boards repeatedly until Benny got his game together.

 

[Ail]

Don't look now, but Duke and JT are tied in career points!

This is not really to defend Miller or take anything away from Duclair, but Duclair is by far the more talented player, better skater, offensively gifted etc. He's also a wing who has been given the opportunity to play strictly wing.

The two situations are not really comparable for several reasons.

Hayes and Miller are the best comparison insofar as talent, age, skating ability and role with the team.

 

[haveandare]

I honestly disagree about Hayes though. I think he looks fine at the NHL level, better than Miller did this year by a fair margin.

 

[Riche16]

3 goals and 5 assists doesn't necessarily sound "rudimentary" to me but maybe that's nitpicking.

Not to mention the gif he shows is him taking the puck up ice and then doing absolutely nothing with it.

I'd love JT to grab a spot, he's been given chances and I think fairly soon he'll be given another one. I don't think the org has given up on him or relegated him to Hartford Prison.

He needs to be better at the NHL level to stick... until that happens it's not on AV, Sather or anyone except JT Miller.

 

[Mac n Gs]

I think he'll either get the same treatment as Kreider did last year, in which he's yo-yoed back and forth between Hartford for a bit until he's able to solidify a spot in the lineup. If not, unfortunately, I can see him being used as part of a trade package.

 

[McRanger]

While I can understand the sentiment here, cups are neither won or lost this early in the season. Also, I'm pretty sure we expect to be contenders for the foreseeable future so at some point we have to bite the bullet and deal with some growing pains and mistakes for the good of the team moving forward.

You are right, but with parity being prevalent throughout the league, 1 or 2 games/points might be the difference between A Stanley Cup win/appearance and being bounced in the first round. Would we have gotten past Philly if we didnt have the 2nd seed in the Metro and played game 7 on the road?

Kids get a chance when one opens up and need to make the most of it. I doubt AV would risk any points pushing someone into the lineup that hasn't proved they deserve to be there.

 

[lilphildub]

I can't say I agree with this article. What has Miller done to prove he belongs in this line up? We're already struggling fit all the forwards in when Stepan comes back. Where does Miller fit in this line up? He was given the chance to stick and the 3C spot was his to lose. And he lost it. He got outplayed by Hayes and I don't think it was close. If Hayes continues to struggle then I can see a swap but saying he deserves the the first shot is funny to me.

I don't think Miller is a bust as some crazies are stating and think he'll make it eventually . He's still very young but I'm tired of people saying he deserves a spot in the line up. I haven't seen anything from him to convince me of that. Duclair has shown he deserves to be in the lineup. Although inconsistent, Hayes has shown more than Miller has this year and honestly years past. Hayes deserves to be in the lineup. Glass? not so much but they're not fighting for the same roster spot. I'd rather have Moore on the third line than Miller at this point

 

[True Blue]

Miller wont ever take the step, its all downhill from here.

#Boldprediction2014

Good to know everything. Based on what are you saying he cannot learn?

 

[Idlerlee]

Good to know everything. Based on what are you saying he cannot learn?

Nothing tangiable, only a gut feeling. Its worrying that he hasnt been able to stick this year

 

[BroadwayStorm]

I don't know if it was jitters. But I saw a very physically talented but clumsy and sometimes very dumb player. Like he didn't know how to position, when to attack the boards, when not to. I saw a lot of off sides. I just thought he was a very raw player. Definitely not the same player he is at the AHL on the NHL level. Except guys like that usually don't have physical talent to do the things they do in the minors at the fast passed NHL level. But this guy has talent and he "should" be fine but I don't blame AV for not trusting him. Although with all of the injuries and this guy still doesn't play... that says something. And I really don't think he should be a center in the NHL. At least at the moment.

 

[NYR Viper]

I don't know if it was jitters. But I saw a very physically talented but clumsy and sometimes very dumb player. Like he didn't know how to position, when to attack the boards, when not to. I saw a lot of off sides. I just thought he was a very raw player. Definitely not the same player he is at the AHL on the NHL level. Except guys like that usually don't have physical talent to do the things they do in the minors at the fast passed NHL level. But this guy has talent and he "should" be fine but I don't blame AV for not trusting him. Although with all of the injuries and this guy still doesn't play... that says something. And I really don't think he should be a center in the NHL. At least at the moment.

I think he is nervous and overthinking it. Similar to what Kreider was doing

 

[Steve Kournianos]

Explain this. It confuses me.

Do you mean the career track where Miller was the #1 option for 3C going into camp. Played every preseason game and 3 NHL games before the team realized they had more in Hayes than Miller? Because if you mean that path, you're right. They should have offered him more of an opportunity to win the job they essentially handed to him this off-season.

Not to mention his zone starts, too. The team really put him in a position to fail. 18 ozone starts, 6 neutral zone, and 2 defensive zone. It's just unbelievable how poorly AV and the staff used JT this season. Despite those zone starts, Miller was on the ice for 5 goals against and 1 goal for in his 3 games with the Rangers.

They gave him every opportunity early this year. He was outplayed by Hayes at center and by Duclair at wing. He's in the minors so he can play top minutes in all three zones. JT as a lot of his game to work on.

Don't look now, but Duke and JT are tied in career points!

EDIT 2 - inb4JeffMagnum says all I do on these boards is bash JT

If you read the article, you'll know what I was referring to.

Three games.

Why are Glass, Mueller and Malone held to different standards?

That was my point.

 

[silverfish]

If you read the article, you'll know what I was referring to.

Three games.

Why are Glass, Mueller and Malone held to different standards?

That was my point.

Because they are vets and offer different things?

Glass, agreed, and I have no idea. He doesn't belong on the Rangers.

Mueller - He had a good camp, and came up and showed he could take a shift. On top of that, he was a right-handed shot who AV could use on the PP. This was something Miller can't do. I believe he was sent to the AHL after your post, so that is not a point I will raise here.

Malone - Again, a veteran. They are held to different standards. Lest you forget, Malone was waived. Malone also can be with the Rangers and not play every game. Miller needs to play every day.

I just don't see how anyone could have watched Miller's game as the preseason went on (he started well), and in his three regular season games, and be clamoring for his return to the lineup, or say he got the cheap end of the stick. Especially when Stepan is coming back now, and with the way Hayes has played.