Is Colorado really that far off from being Edmonton?

[AvsGuy]

The similarities are really only starting to emerge this season, where Colorado's players who were previously only improving year by year are strangely struggling. Edmonton's allowed their young talent to stagnate for nearly half a decade now.

I'm still baffled by people who think that Colorado winning 52 games last season was somehow a fluke.

 

[Romang67]

Because the Avs are mediocre/good every other year.

 

[Derrty]

3rd place was a fluke

Edmonton is a poor mans Colorado, if that makes sense to anyone but me.

 

[tsujimoto74]

Yes. But in that time they did what the Oilers didn't do. Cleaned up the coaching staff, management and made playoffs. Even without Stastny they are the better team.

Yeah, that's the difference. Colorado has changed personnel to try to get better, and they haven't been sitting on their hands trade-wise like Edmonton has either. The 2 roster players that really separate the Avs from the Oil on paper (Johnson and Varlamov) were both through in through trades.

 

[MilanKraft*]

Oilers players suck.
Avs players are good.

 

[Extra Texture]

When was the last time Edmonton finished second in the conference or even made the playoffs?

Not comparable at all.

I think the point is that, even before last year, they never had the same reputation as the Oilers.

 

[Duck Off]

They are nowhere near the Oilers level. The reason? Oiler management. Regardless of talent, that group in Edmonton is horrible. Colorado's is nowhere near that bad.

 

[The Mars Volchenkov]

The Avs have made some pretty ballsy moves to address needs on the team in trading for Varlamov and Johnson. Hell, they even traded away a 1st rounder in that Varlamov trade. Both of those moves were not well received on these boards by many people. Would Edmonton do that? The Avs have at least tried to make big trades to address their needs, whereas Edmonton has been afraid too.

 

[Avelanche]

The Florida Panthers are not a gong show this season, unlike the Edmonton Oilers.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/standings.htm?type=WC#&navid=nav-stn-conf

He said Colorado and the Panthers. They're both pretty comparable in their ups and downs, quality of play this year and bright future.

That's the big difference between Colorado and Edmonton. Colorado has a bright immediate future.

 

[The Nuge]

We can all agree that they have a better top 6 for D, and I prefer their forward depth and goaltending.

However, I don't think there is as large as a gap in reality than we may think. They've drafted 1st, 2nd or 3rd overall in 3 of the last 6 drafts. This year, they could draft within 1 or 2 spots of Edmonton again.

Edmonton has not climbed out of the basement at all, but Colorado seems to be a team that is given a free pass, even though they have been in the lottery %50 of the time over the last 6 years.

Florida and Tampa Bay are the only two teams other than Edmonton that have seen recurring picks in the top 3 over the last 6 years.

No, we definitely can't agree. Johnson is clearly the best of the group, but I'll take our #2-8 dmen over their #2-8

 

[Freudian]

Avs aren't even a bottom five team since they started rebuilding after 2008-09. Oilers are by far the worst team in the league in that period.

Average finish and number of playoffs the past six seasons.

Tampa: 20th, two playoffs.
Colorado: 20th, two playoffs.
Columbus: 21st, two playoffs.
Toronto: 22nd, one playoff.
Winnipeg: 23rd, no playoffs.
Florida: 24th, one playoff.
Islanders: 25th, one playoff.
Edmonton: 27th, no playoffs.

 

[dahrougem2]

No, we definitely can't agree. Johnson is clearly the best of the group, but I'll take our #2-8 dmen over their #2-8

I will take EJ, Barrie and heck even Brad Stuart before I touch most of the Oilers. Jeff Petry is soft as butter, Andrew Ference is a #5 at best, Justin Schultz is downright awful, Nikita Nikitin doesn't even belong in the NHL anymore, Keith Aulie has never been an NHL caliber player to begin with. The only player I'd like would be Mark Fayne, he arguably doesn't get used enough by the Oilers. Klefbom/Marincin are looking to be great prospects but they haven't fully established themselves yet, so not sure what the Oilers have with them there whether it's 1st pairing potential or 2nd pairing potential.

As for the OP, I don't think these organizations are similar at all. The Avalanche have made the playoffs twice in the last 6 years and in 2012 made a serious push for the playoffs after finishing the previous year with the 2nd overall pick, falling 7 points short yet finishing with a winning record amassing 41 wins.

Last year's success wasn't a fluke, the success rate maybe. They were not the best team in the Central division but they absolutely were one of the top 8 teams in the Western conference, and that is why they are different from the Oilers. Why they flounder every other year is something I'll never understand, but this team has 2 playoff appearances and 3 seasons with a winning record under their belt over the last 6 years and they have STILL changed management twice in that timeframe. The Oilers have ZERO winning seasons and the only thing they've done is promote people from within. They aren't similar at all

 

[The Nuge]

I will take EJ, Barrie and heck even Brad Stuart before I touch most of the Oilers. Jeff Petry is soft as butter, Andrew Ference is a #5 at best, Justin Schultz is downright awful, Nikita Nikitin doesn't even belong in the NHL anymore, Keith Aulie has never been an NHL caliber player to begin with. The only player I'd like would be Mark Fayne, he arguably doesn't get used enough by the Oilers. Klefbom/Marincin are looking to be great prospects but they haven't fully established themselves yet, so not sure what the Oilers have with them there whether it's 1st pairing potential or 2nd pairing potential.

As for the OP, I don't think these organizations are similar at all. The Avalanche have made the playoffs twice in the last 6 years and in 2012 made a serious push for the playoffs after finishing the previous year with the 2nd overall pick, falling 7 points short yet finishing with a winning record amassing 41 wins.

Last year's success wasn't a fluke, the success rate maybe. They were not the best team in the Central division but they absolutely were one of the top 8 teams in the Western conference, and that is why they are different from the Oilers. Why they flounder every other year is something I'll never understand, but this team has 2 playoff appearances and 3 seasons with a winning record under their belt over the last 6 years and they have STILL changed management twice in that timeframe. The Oilers have ZERO winning seasons and the only thing they've done is promote people from within. They aren't similar at all

Petry isn't soft. That's just flat out wrong. He's a solid #3 dman. Fayne, Klefa, and Marincin are all good dmen. Colorado has a top pairing, and then they're awful

 

[Anglesmith]

There is no team you can find which is comparable to the Oilers. None. Three first round picks in three years. Five coaches (is it six now?) on the payroll at the same time. No playoffs in almost a decade. I'm pretty confident that there is no team that matches that.

You mention drafting first, second and third in a span of six years, but that doesn't compare to drafting first, first and first in a span of three years.

 

[tony d]

Colorado is not as a good a team as they where last year but they're far from being the next Edmonton.

 

[Beerfish]

Kevin Lowe, MacT

Until anyone comes up with a clown duo like these guys it is not even close.

 

[cgf]

I feel like this actually makes me feel more like they are close to Edmonton. That 3rd looks a little flukey.

I hope they make the playoffs personally, a lot of young players on that team that I like, I will just be amazed if they draft top 5 again and people blow it off. They are closer to Florida and Edmonton than I've ever really considered.

Even without that third we made the playoffs in duchene's rookie year and almost made it in Landy's rookie year. Over this time frame we've had more success than the Panthers, Islanders, Sabres, Stars, Canes, Flames, Jets and Leafs.

 

[DeYarmond Edison]

Yes, they are really far off.

Wouldn't Carolina be a better comparison?

 

[DoubleDouble*]

Yes, they are really far off.

Wouldn't Carolina be a better comparison?

Carolina and Florida are much better comparisons.

 

[Tad Mikowsky]

Yes. But in that time they did what the Oilers didn't do. Cleaned up the coaching staff, management and made playoffs. Even without Stastny they are the better team.

By doing the exact same thing as the Oilers, hiring an Old Boys club.

But that ALWAYS gets brushed by.

 

[Aceonfire*]

Sure the Avs made the playoffs last year but many of us know that they got lucky and over achieved.

Are they similar to the Oilers? Yes and no.

Both teams are guilty of playing 18 year old players in the NHL and using it as a development league.

Both teams still have glaring holes on D that the GMs are not able to fill.

Both teams have clear and apparent system issues with inconsistent play.

Both organizations brought in former players to run the team. (Good luck firing Sakic or Roy if they don't perform).

The Avs are obviously a better team than the Oilers right now but if they don't make the right choices the team could turn in to a **** show in the future.

If the Avs miss the playoffs (they will), Sakic had better have a good off season plan.

 

[Hazu*]

I'm sorry but you just CAN'T compare the Oilers to any other team in the NHL. It's true that Colorado has been pretty horrible in the last few years (except last season of course), but let's not forget the fact that Edmonton was given the first overall pick for three consecutive years.

Edmonton
2014 3rd
2013 7th
2012 1st
2011 1st
2010 1st
2009 10th

Colorado
2014 23th
2013 1st
2012 41st
2011 2nd
2010 17th
2009 3rd

Obviously Colorado has some pretty good picks too, but only one first overall pick, and this makes all the difference. The gap between a first overall pick and a second overall pick can be huge!

2004 Ovechkin = Malkin
2005 Crosby > Ryan
2006 Johnson < Staal
2007 Kane > Van Riemsdyk
2008 Stamkos > Doughty (not by far)
2009 Tavaras > Hedman
2010 Hall = Seguin
2011 Nugent-Hopkins = Landeskog
2012 Yakupov > Murray (so far)
2013 MacKinnon > Barkov
2014 Ekblad > Reinhart

It's unfortunate but Edmonton started being bad at the worst possible time. Three years earlier and they could've draft Kane, Stamkos and Tavares. They would be so much better that way.

Anyway, what's I'm trying to say is that you can't compare both teams since Colorado didn't get the "privilege" to draft the first overall pick many times as Edmonton.

 

[zeke]

literally the only appreciable difference is goaltending.

 

[who_me?]

Kevin Lowe, MacT

Until anyone comes up with a clown duo like these guys it is not even close.

Sakic / Roy ?

 

[Viqsi]

I think the only basis on which a Edmonton-Colorado comparison can be made is that, much like Edmonton, Colorado has had multiple very high picks with which they could draft the defensemen they desperately need and instead keep chasing forwards. Compare with Tampa Bay picking up Hedman, Florida drafting Ekblad, Columbus picking Murray, and NYI wanting Murray but settling for Reinhart.

That said, Colorado actually has more skill forwards than Edmonton overall, actually has a #1 defenseman in the mix, and has a better goaltender, so they're capable of being a better team overall so long as nobody important gets injured.

* * *​

EDIT:

Sakic / Roy ?

Okay, there's that, too. But those guys don't have nearly a decade of demonstrated futility that suggests they need to leave; they've barely gotten started.