If Phoenix gets expansion. Is Murelo the owner?

[hockeyboy1923]

I did not want to agree with everything Bettman said. But I agreed with pretty much everything Bettman said.

Bettman is correct that the situation was bad for the NHL and changes were needed, but he still completely mismanaged the situation.

As a healthcare executive that currently sits on several boards, my guess is this has been a major sore issue for the board for a long time, but because it is a hard problem to solve, they were paralyzed and kept putting off the decision. Then along comes Bettman's buddy Ryan Smith, wining and dining the board, greasing their palms, and likely trashing AM and Phoenix to further undermine confidence, and promising to solve all their problems if only he gets the team in Utah. This has been a sore issue for the board for so long, they rush into a decision to make the problem go away.

This is still a terrible management move but not surprising coming from the NHL. If this was a truly sore issue, they should have acted forcefully in a quicker timeframe (not kept pushing it off), and they should have spent the time required to come up with the best solution, not the quickest, easiest and most convenient. If *I* was in that tough position, as soon as the board lost confidence in AM, they should have forced a sale and made it public, including meeting with and drumming up interest from investors in AZ, which I argue is probably the best market for the team, followed closely by Houston as the second best option. AZ is a great market for sports right now given the large growing population, demographics, the rapid growth of sports gambling/media, and the coyote history here. It really took a lot of stupidity and mistakes in the NHL and AZ ownership to screw this up.

 

[cobra427]

The arena was an issue for the NHL and the other owners because it constrained the money that the team could pull in and it also didn't reflect well on the sport. While I am sure the players and staff did not like playing in Mullett, I have a hard time believing many of the Phoenix players would prefer to uproot their families and move to SLC rather than wait 3 more years for an arena. Do you honestly believe if polled the majority of the players would choose to move there? I joked about moving to SLC one time and my wife joked about leaving me.

I can understand the NHL wanting to part with AM because he has been a terrible owner, but they should have forced him out and launched a transparent sale process to see where everything shaked out, rather than sell it to the Chairman's buddy in a rushed backoffice deal. The team very well could have ended up in another market, but at least Phoenix would have had a chance to keep the team, and the team would have gone to the most worthy market for the team, which is good for hockey. I only recently moved to AZ so never jumped on the Coyotes bandwagon, but I am upset that the NHL is giving up on the market and making a decision that is bad for the sport.

They need grounds to force him out. AM got a cheap price to get in and own an NHL franchise. He got a great price to get out. Franchise values increasing helped the NHL and AM make this sale work. If AM or anyone else can build an arena and be ready to go, the NHL will be back in AZ.

 

[DustyDangler]

Bettman is correct that the situation was bad for the NHL and changes were needed, but he still completely mismanaged the situation.

As a healthcare executive that currently sits on several boards, my guess is this has been a major sore issue for the board for a long time, but because it is a hard problem to solve, they were paralyzed and kept putting off the decision. Then along comes Bettman's buddy Ryan Smith, wining and dining the board, greasing their palms, and likely trashing AM and Phoenix to further undermine confidence, and promising to solve all their problems if only he gets the team in Utah. This has been a sore issue for the board for so long, they rush into a decision to make the problem go away.

This is still a terrible management move but not surprising coming from the NHL. If this was a truly sore issue, they should have acted forcefully in a quicker timeframe (not kept pushing it off), and they should have spent the time required to come up with the best solution, not the quickest, easiest and most convenient. If *I* was in that tough position, as soon as the board lost confidence in AM, they should have forced a sale and made it public, including meeting with and drumming up interest from investors in AZ, which I argue is probably the best market for the team, followed closely by Houston as the second best option. AZ is a great market for sports right now given the large growing population, demographics, the rapid growth of sports gambling/media, and the coyote history here. It really took a lot of stupidity and mistakes in the NHL and AZ ownership to screw this up.

They have limited abilities to force a sale that does not wind up in litigation which I am certain they wanted to avoid.

 

[cobra427]

Yeah, I have a hunch that one billion smackaroonis had a lot more to do with this sale than the players' tender sensibilities.

The suggestion that Muruelo, the Coyotes, the NHL or Bettman give a rat's ass about the players is a crock of shit.

At the end of the day it's a math equation for AM and the NHL, plain and simple.

 

[Naych_PHX]

I'm watching the press conference and Uncle Gary is like, "What my client meant to say..."

 

[Jamieh]

Which is just bullshit because Tempe had the exact same timeline.

There is no present timeline, that was and is the issue.

I put more trust in Friedman than any of them, but I think there would have been more "smoke" (even locally), if it had validity.

Who would report it locally?? It's been very obvious for a long time that the only local reporter, Morgan, is noting more than Team PR and was never gonna rock the boat.

 

[Jamieh]

The arena was an issue for the NHL and the other owners because it constrained the money that the team could pull in and it also didn't reflect well on the sport. While I am sure the players and staff did not like playing in Mullett, I have a hard time believing many of the Phoenix players would prefer to uproot their families and move to SLC rather than wait 3 more years for an arena. Do you honestly believe if polled the majority of the players would choose to move there? I joked about moving to SLC one time and my wife joked about leaving me.

I can understand the NHL wanting to part with AM because he has been a terrible owner, but they should have forced him out and launched a transparent sale process to see where everything shaked out, rather than sell it to the Chairman's buddy in a rushed backoffice deal. The team very well could have ended up in another market, but at least Phoenix would have had a chance to keep the team, and the team would have gone to the most worthy market for the team, which is good for hockey. I only recently moved to AZ so never jumped on the Coyotes bandwagon, but I am upset that the NHL is giving up on the market and making a decision that is bad for the sport.

I dont think Players would have chosen to move and I have never suggested that BUT I have suggested they didn't like the Mullett situation and I'm fairly confident that played a role in Bettman pushing for this resolution. That and almost zero faith that Mureulo could deliver. The money issue isn't really that big of a deal imo

 

[DustyDangler]

There is no present timeline, that was and is the issue.


Who would report it locally?? It's been very obvious for a long time that the only local reporter, Morgan, is noting more than Team PR and was never gonna rock the boat.

Craig got the opening question and it had some bite to it.

 

[Jamieh]

Even if it were true it'd be irrelevant, I think we all know that the players' opinions of Mullett had nothing to do with the sale of the team. It was likely more of a "ok AM even if you win the Desert Ridge auction can you actually get this entertainment district built in a reasonable time" and after AM f***ed up the Tempe vote (and hasn't even met with the mayor of Phoenix yet), Bettman is right to be skeptical. And you can't stay in a college arena indefinitely.

Anyway this is just our resident Leafs troll trying to troll one last time before F40 goes inactive. More power to him I guess

You sure are a one trick pony, have you ever considered discussing the topic rather than the Poster?

Craig got the opening question and it had some bite to it.

Now that's its over he has suggested he is gonna peel it back, he wasn't doing that for last couple years.

 

[Prarievarg]

f*** that was awkward. But I don't agree he lost his temper, not any more than Gary did at least. Just a matter of media training and/or intelligence.

 

[rt]

Does Arizona becoming a Utah TV market and carried by Scripps mean that I can’t watch Utah games here with a national package?

 

[Naych_PHX]

Weren't Coyotes games broadcast in Utah Nevada and New Mexico? I might be wrong.

 

[PainForShane]

You sure are a one trick pony, have you ever considered discussing the topic rather than the Poster?


Now that's its over he has suggested he is gonna peel it back, he wasn't doing that for last couple years.

Have you ever considered reading and understanding the messages you quote?

One suggestion is to start with the first paragraph in the post you quoted (ie the part that starts with "even if it were true" and takes up most of the message), this was clearly the main point of my post. Thx

 

[Jagged Ice]

Does Arizona becoming a Utah TV market and carried by Scripps mean that I can’t watch Utah games here with a national package?

That's my interpretation. Back to Channel 61. Which works for me. Either way, I'm keeping ESPN+.

 

[XX]

Everybody loves booing him and sure I would too cuz it's fun but...dude is good at his job and has been great for the NHL.

If the Coyotes were a plane on fire with nowhere to land, not only did Gary land the damn thing but he did it in a desirable new market with a solid owner and got the other owners paid in the process. This cements the possibility of the next round of expansion (the #1 factor in all of this) by taking the problem child out of the equation so they didn't have to worry about QC or losing a more $$$ ripe market. The league will soon be two billion dollars richer and none of it will be shared with the players. Oh and they are out of Mullett, which was apparently the worst thing in the world to the BoG because the PA wouldn't stop whining about it.

The Coyotes aren't even technically dead, leaving open that possibility once two more teams join the league.

Tidy business.

 

[hockeyboy1923]

They have limited abilities to force a sale that does not wind up in litigation which I am certain they wanted to avoid.

They do not have limited options - they have hard options.

The Coyotes were almost certainly violating their covenants in the NHL legal requirements, so the NHL always had the legal option to terminate the team's license, which means they effectively can strongarm AM into doing whatever they want, which is precisely how they were able to force AM to sell the team to Utah.

If AM commits money to relaunch the Coyotes and he fails and loses that money, he will almost certainly launch lawsuits anyway. The fact that the NHL would coherce him into a sale without forcing a broad auction, to confirm he got paid full market value, is not the typical practice in these situations. The NHL probably thinks his option is an out legally, but if the NHL does sabotage this option then AM has a real case, Especially if there is evidence during discovery that the NHL wanted AM to fail and set him up for failure.

The publicity around a real sales process would have been hard but it would have put the NHL in a significantly better legal position than privately selling to the chairman's buddy.

 

[rt]

If the Coyotes were a plane on fire with nowhere to land, not only did Gary land the damn thing but he did it in a desirable new market with a solid owner and got the other owners paid in the process. This cements the possibility of the next round of expansion (the #1 factor in all of this) by taking the problem child out of the equation so they didn't have to worry about QC or losing a more $$$ ripe market. The league will soon be two billion dollars richer and none of it will be shared with the players. Oh and they are out of Mullett, which was apparently the worst thing in the world to the BoG because the PA wouldn't stop whining about it.

The Coyotes aren't even technically dead, leaving open that possibility once two more teams join the league.

Tidy business.

I agree.

That's my interpretation. Back to Channel 61. Which works for me. Either way, I'm keeping ESPN+.

I hope I can just buy a regular streaming service to watch Utah games. I don’t want this OTA junk anymore and I’m not buying cable or satellite.

The Bally App was the best thing ever for me. Spoiler for DVR that never had issues and was priced reasonably per month.

I wonder if the Jazz have a good streaming/DVR service. And if so, I wonder if Smith can just add the hockey team to it and I can just buy the Utah service.

 

[lanky]

First sentence, 100%. He makes Gary Bettman look like Oprah. As an owner of a major sports team though I feel like you kind of have to talk to the media sometimes. Idk.

Link:

That was enlightening. There was so much speculation, it's nice to get a cohesive story from the Bettman and Meruelo.

 

[hockeyboy1923]

If the Coyotes were a plane on fire with nowhere to land, not only did Gary land the damn thing but he did it in a desirable new market with a solid owner and got the other owners paid in the process. This cements the possibility of the next round of expansion (the #1 factor in all of this) by taking the problem child out of the equation so they didn't have to worry about QC or losing a more $$$ ripe market. The league will soon be two billion dollars richer and none of it will be shared with the players. Oh and they are out of Mullett, which was apparently the worst thing in the world to the BoG because the PA wouldn't stop whining about it.

The Coyotes aren't even technically dead, leaving open that possibility once two more teams join the league.

Tidy business.

This logic only works if there were no other options. Once the NHL decided they would strongarm AM into selling the Coyotes they had a plethora of options and did not explore any of them. Instead they rushed to sell the team to Bettman's buddy.

So in terms of your analalogy, Gary plugged his buddy's private airfield into the google maps, letting him buy a team off-market at a potentially below market price, and decided to land there without checking if there were other potentially better airports available.

To be clear, this shouldn't really be debatable either. Does anyone honestly believe if the Coyotes went to market, no other investors would be interested? Even if they were not in AZ, other investors would have been interested in potentially moving the team.

 

[Sinurgy]

everyone does. some want just logo name others want name and records.

I want the name, the logo, and the records. I would do away with all the Jet 1.0 stuff though, that should go to Jets 2.0 and be the end of it. If ever there's hockey in AZ again, I want to cheer for players who are breaking records that have been held since 1996!

 

[XX]

This logic only works if there were no other options. Once the NHL decided they would strongarm AM into selling the Coyotes they had a plethora of options and did not explore any of them. Instead they rushed to sell the team to Bettman's buddy.

So in terms of your analalogy, Gary plugged his buddy's private airfield into the google maps, letting him buy a team off-market at a potentially below market price, and decided to land there without checking if there were other potentially better airports available.

What other options were there? We're talking cities decisively better than SLC in terms of a new American hockey market, ready to take a team on short notice at a little over a billion? It's a short list. With Seattle and Vegas in the league I can't really think of any. Houston may not even end up willing to pay full expansion price.

The league began preparing this particular exit ramp as a possibility back in 2021: Frozen Fury - Wikipedia

Bettman is constantly gardening the league, planning things out, watching potential owners etc... They already suffered one embarrassing defeat with the Tempe initiative, with the current word being they had no faith Meruelo could pull off the N.Phoenix deal. They're right to believe that given the guy isn't even paying road hotels.

SLC is at like 20k deposits, I think Gary won pretty convincingly here.

 

[hockeyboy1923]

What other options were there? We're talking cities decisively better than SLC in terms of a new American hockey market, ready to take a team on short notice at a little over a billion? It's a short list. With Seattle and Vegas in the league I can't really think of any. Houston may not even end up willing to pay full expansion price.

The league began preparing this particular exit ramp as a possibility back in 2021: Frozen Fury - Wikipedia

Bettman is constantly gardening the league, planning things out, watching potential owners etc... They already suffered one embarrassing defeat with the Tempe initiative, with the current word being they had no faith Meruelo could pull off the N.Phoenix deal. They're right to believe that given the guy isn't even paying road hotels.

SLC is at like 20k deposits, I think Gary won pretty convincingly here.

We do not know if there were other options because the NHL did not explore any of them. Houston, QBC, moving Phoneix back to Glendale, who knows? It honestly does not matter whether or not SLC is a good or the best option, the fact they did not explore any other buyers after forcing AM to sell is the issue.

This whole situation is bizarre and highly atypical. As someone that worked in mergers and acquisitions for 12 years, including forced sale processes as a part of bankruptcy, I have never seen deals conducted like this where a seller is forced to sell to one party without exploring other potential options - it is always a broad sales process run by a reputable investment bank to prove objectively it was the best outcome for the seller. Its possible the NHL has great lawyers and they have iron clad legal agreements giving them the power to do whatever they want, but given the ineptitude I have seen I highly doubt it. I do think the option could be a key to getting it done legally, but if the NHL does sabotage that, then the legal situation gets very hairy.

Additionally, it is also not a good look for the NHL how it was done secretly with a friend of the chairman. If this went to a jury trial, a good attorney for AM could have a field day on this one depending on what comes up in discovery.

 

[XX]

We do not know if there were other options because the NHL did not explore any of them. Houston, QBC, moving Phoneix back to Glendale, who knows? It honestly does not matter whether or not SLC is a good or the best option, the fact they did not explore any other buyers after forcing AM to sell is the issue.

The league is constantly exploring other options privately. Years in advance. They already know what the appetite is in a place like QC with regards to price, ownership, and how the other owners feel about it. It's why Quebec doesn't have a team despite deserving one. The math isn't mathing. Winnipeg's downturn isn't helping matters.

This whole situation is bizarre and highly atypical. As someone that worked in mergers and acquisitions for 12 years, including forced sale processes as a part of bankruptcy, I have never seen deals conducted like this where a seller is forced to sell to one party without exploring other potential options - it is always a broad sales process run by a reputable investment bank to prove objectively it was the best outcome for the seller. Its possible the NHL has great lawyers and they have iron clad legal agreements giving them the power to do whatever they want, but given the ineptitude I have seen I highly doubt it. I do think the option could be a key to getting it done legally, but if the NHL does sabotage that, then the legal situation gets very hairy.

Brother it's a professional hockey franchise, and a billion dollar one at that. The market is limited and the league controls all the relevant levers. We had an entire long ass court case to reaffirm that. I don't know what "ineptitude" you've actually seen.

Additionally, it is also not a good look for the NHL how it was done secretly with a friend of the chairman. If this went to a jury trial, a good attorney for AM could have a field day on this one depending on what comes up in discovery.

Hard to show damages when you're talking purely hypotheticals AND you profited massively off of the transaction that did go through. Meruelo gave them this legal recourse with his behavior, any slight misgivings he has are irrelevant at that point. It's mostly just a massive hit to his outsized ego.

 

[DustyDangler]

We do not know if there were other options because the NHL did not explore any of them. Houston, QBC, moving Phoneix back to Glendale, who knows? It honestly does not matter whether or not SLC is a good or the best option, the fact they did not explore any other buyers after forcing AM to sell is the issue.

This whole situation is bizarre and highly atypical. As someone that worked in mergers and acquisitions for 12 years, including forced sale processes as a part of bankruptcy, I have never seen deals conducted like this where a seller is forced to sell to one party without exploring other potential options - it is always a broad sales process run by a reputable investment bank to prove objectively it was the best outcome for the seller. Its possible the NHL has great lawyers and they have iron clad legal agreements giving them the power to do whatever they want, but given the ineptitude I have seen I highly doubt it. I do think the option could be a key to getting it done legally, but if the NHL does sabotage that, then the legal situation gets very hairy.

Additionally, it is also not a good look for the NHL how it was done secretly with a friend of the chairman. If this went to a jury trial, a good attorney for AM could have a field day on this one depending on what comes up in discovery.

He wasn't forced to sell. He was provided an opportunity to sell a portion of the franchise for ~3 times the perceived value of the entire franchise. He wasn't going to get a better deal than what the NHL offered him.

 

[Sinurgy]

I did not want to agree with everything Bettman said. But I agreed with pretty much everything Bettman said.

Unfortunately he's not wrong. I almost feel bad for him, he looks a bit defeated (much to the delight of some base dwelling zealots) like he absolutely hates this is how it ended up. Tried and tried and tried but the reality is enough was enough, they had to pull the plug.

Good news for F40 fans following the team to Utah - Scripps' streaming service will continue to broadcast the games from SLC, and likely so will Arizona61.

Perhaps I'm misinterpreting but that kinda sucks! Doesn't that mean they're going to treat AZ as "in the market" for Utah? If that's the case ESPN+ games and Center Ice games are still going to be blacked out.

Everybody loves booing him and sure I would too cuz it's fun but...dude is good at his job and has been great for the NHL.

The BoG does not regret hiring him in the slightest, there's a reason he's been the commish for seemingly forever.

Love Gary. I even call my dog Gary.

And Alex, its time to go to work

It's hard to hate on Gary, he is our uncle after all.