pappyline
Registered User
Yeh, they basically won their share as there were 3 stacked teams in the late 40's early 50's: Habs, Leafs. WingsHe won his last 5 seasons in the NHL. The other 3 cup winners weren't stacked teams.
Yeh, they basically won their share as there were 3 stacked teams in the late 40's early 50's: Habs, Leafs. WingsHe won his last 5 seasons in the NHL. The other 3 cup winners weren't stacked teams.
I don't remember any Ferguson-Hull fight when Hull's jaw was broken. Ferguson did go after Hull in one game but a fight never materialized. Richard played on a loaded tem from '55 - '60 but some of the teams he played on before that weren't that good.
There it is folks. Hull fought & beat the reputed toughest player in the league wereras the Rocket is known for swinging his stick at Hal Laycoes's head & punching a couple of referees.The Hull & Ferguson fight in 1968 was big news at the time because of Ferguson's reputation as a fighter. On this occasion, Hull was coming across the ice and Ferguson crosschecked Hull just over the nose. It was pretty viscious and almost as bad as what Chris Simon did. Hull, bleeding, dropped his gloves and won a decision over the reputed heavyweight champion of the NHL. There are a number of photos and stories of the fight.
A few days later, Hull suffered a broken jaw in a game and when he played Montreal the next week, Hull was ready to go at it with Ferguson again, wired jaw or not.
Bobby Hull was as tough as they came.
Not sure about your comment Richard's teams before 1955-56. The Canadiens were in the finals every year from 1951 to 1955.
There it is folks. Hull fought & beat the reputed toughest player in the league wereras the Rocket is known for swinging his stick at Hal Laycoes's head & punching a couple of referees.
There it is folks. Hull fought & beat the reputed toughest player in the league wereras the Rocket is known for swinging his stick at Hal Laycoes's head & punching a couple of referees.
Funny how Bobby Orr is an icon with a short NHL career but Hull jumping to the WHA hurts his rep' even after 15 NHL seasons most of which he was the premier player. Note that I am not duscrediting Orr as IMO he is the best all time but Hull IMO is top 5 easily but is downgraded because he didn't finish his career in the NHL. Don't understand it.
Hull was wearing a football style helmet with a face guard to protect his jaw. He and Ferguson collidedand the helmet was knocked off. Hull and Ferguson threw a few punches before grappling and at least one of the punches by Ferguson landed on Hull's jaw.Those not so good teams didn't win the cup. The Ferguson versus Hull with the broken jaw happened.. It is a fact,
Hull was wearing a football style helmet with a face guard to protect his jaw. He and Ferguson collidedand the helmet was knocked off. Hull and Ferguson threw a few punches before grappling and at least one of the punches by Ferguson landed on Hull's jaw.
The press (including the Montreal media) vilified Ferguson for his actions. Ferguson would later claim he never in fact landed a punch but from what I recall he did so.
Here are pictures of Hull and the helmet from the 1968-69 season:
http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080...p?mem=p198302&page=gallery&pic=43&list=#photo
http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080...p?mem=p198302&page=gallery&pic=92&list=#photo
And for returning to a game against the Bruins after being knocked out and scoring the winning goal against Sugar Jim Henry while only half concious.
Both were tough players. Both were elite goal scorers. Richard played on better teams but he also scored more clutch goals than Hull.
I stand corrected but the 50 in 50 was a war year. Not that it wasn't a great accomplishment but a lot of good players were in the military.
I always hate that theory. Yes I know 50 in 50 came in '44-45 when WWII was still going on and a lot of guys where overseas (Milt Schmidt and all). To me discrediting his accomplishment that year is like saying Gretzky only scored 200 points because it was the '80s, to me its ignorant. Here's why.
Richard has 50 goals that year, and although the competition was weaker at the time because of the war then why didnt anyone else do it (much like Gretzky's theory in the '80s). Lach was a playmaker not an elite goal scorer but why didnt Blake do it? Why didnt Teeder Kennedy do it? If it was that easy wouldnt more all-time greats have done it? Richard had 50 goals, and the next in line that year was Herb Cain with 32. If anyone had elite seasons during WWII, and only then, it was Cain. That's pretty good dominance I think.
Hull I like and when you compare regular seasons its pretty close but the Rocket scored at the right time all the time. Hull had an all-star like team in Chicago too throughout the 60s and only one once. That hurts him on these polls I think.
Hull's got that creepy voice though. I swear Pappy, you must have a transistor set in your forehead that alerts you every time a disrespectful word is said about the Golden Jet.There it is folks. Hull fought & beat the reputed toughest player in the league wereras the Rocket is known for swinging his stick at Hal Laycoes's head & punching a couple of referees.
I always hate that theory. Yes I know 50 in 50 came in '44-45 when WWII was still going on and a lot of guys where overseas (Milt Schmidt and all). To me discrediting his accomplishment that year is like saying Gretzky only scored 200 points because it was the '80s, to me its ignorant. Here's why.
Richard has 50 goals that year, and although the competition was weaker at the time because of the war then why didnt anyone else do it (much like Gretzky's theory in the '80s). Lach was a playmaker not an elite goal scorer but why didnt Blake do it? Why didnt Teeder Kennedy do it? If it was that easy wouldnt more all-time greats have done it? Richard had 50 goals, and the next in line that year was Herb Cain with 32. If anyone had elite seasons during WWII, and only then, it was Cain. That's pretty good dominance I think.
Which is what I wrote?? Grappling?Sorry, but it didn't happen that way. I described the actual true version above. Even Ferguson in his book relates an incorrect story to make himself look good.
There was the one fight before Hull had a broken jaw and Hull decisioned Ferguson on that. Hull and Ferguson tangled again after Hull had a broken jaw. But it wasn't a real fight like the first one, but it did show the courage that Bobby Hull had.
Just trying to clear up the facts.
You are wrong on all counts. Number 1, Hull had lots of opposition. Teams always put a man on him. Claude Provost of Montreal & Bugsy watson of Detroit were probably the best known. Number 2, is that Hull & Mikita rarely played on the same line. Hull had many different linemates. Except for a brief period with Espo, none of them were HOFers. He played with guys like Red Hay, Pit Martin, Murray Balfour, Chico Maki, bryan Campbell while still putting up 50 goal seasons. The rocket played with the likes of Lach, Balake,brother Henri & Dickie moore--all HOFers.Voted dead even...
If I had absolutely to take one, that would be Maurice Richard... He had more "opposition" than Hull got in his whole career, and he never got a center as good as Stan Mikita. Not saying that Elmer Lach was a slouch... He just wasn't Stan Mikita.
Voted dead even...
If I had absolutely to take one, that would be Maurice Richard... He had more "opposition" than Hull got in his whole career, and he never got a center as good as Stan Mikita. Not saying that Elmer Lach was a slouch... He just wasn't Stan Mikita.
The Hockey News Top 100 had Richard ranked #5 and Hull ranked #8 (1998?).
The rankings might well have been different if Hull had not jumped to the WHA.
If the Conn Smythe would have been awarded in Richard years. You would look at the facts, the rings, the 50/50, the era he played in, the adversity he had.
There's no «myth» about french canadian being disadvantaged in 40/50's hockey. Heck. Look at Don Cherry and Avery today and try to picture good old canadian hockey back in 1955 before Quebec quiet revolution.
There's no evidence he's been stolen many assist, I conceed but I'll beleive the Rocket on that one.
Which is what I wrote?? Grappling?