How many 1st round picks do we need to be competitive?

[Jumptheshark]

only going to post in this thread once and then putting it on ignore

part of the problem is some fans and posters have fallen in love not only with high picks--but first overall picks

hall is in his 5th yea--Nuge in his fourth and yak in his third--


collectively they have all under achieved

For me, hall and nuge have excaped their fair share of critism while Yak got tossed un the bus the first season

 

[Mr McV]

Yeah. If there's one thing we've learned from these past 5 years it's that rookies are the solution.

They are not the solution right now, but in a few more years, we will have a solid core of veterans. They will provide support to a new wave of rookies, when the real rebuild begins.

 

[winnipegger]

Some of it's down to luck, unfortunately. Some years the draft just isn't very strong.

The 2012 draft was really the nail in the coffin (oh look I made a pun). Edmonton takes Nail Yakupov first overall. If you look at the draft, there were 8 D-men taken in the top ten, among them Matt Dumba, Morgan Reilly, Jacob Trouba, Hampus Lindholm. All of them already contributing significantly to their clubs on entry level contracts, and projected to only get stronger. In hindsight, was Edmonton best served by getting the consensus #1? Or would they have been better served getting Jacob Trouba at #9? That's just down to bad luck in my opinion, you would have had to have had genius scouts to take one of those D-men. Most of them, unfortunately, are going to be studs for their respective teams.

This is why I am harping on the posters in the winnipeg forum who want to trade our vets and get a top 3 pick. While that may be a viable strategy this year, nobody is going to outsuck buffalo. And then it's a crapshoot for who will have the worse record. Purposefully trying to suck serves nobody, and it's a regular occurance that a great player is taken late in the draft. Hell, Jamie Benn was taken like 190th overall or something stupid like that.

 

[17Kurri]

only going to post in this thread once and then putting it on ignore

part of the problem is some fans and posters have fallen in love not only with high picks--but first overall picks

hall is in his 5th yea--Nuge in his fourth and yak in his third--


collectively they have all under achieved

For me, hall and nuge have excaped their fair share of critism while Yak got tossed un the bus the first season

Hall has produced at better than PPG over the last two seasons. I'd say that he's achieved just fine.

RNH and Yak are a different story at this point.

 

[The Human Torch]

All the 1st overalls in the universe won't help this team until there's competent ownership, management, coaching, and scouting in place. We need all of those things. We currently have none of those things.

 

[harpoon]

The correct answer to the op is - always just one more.

The truth is, the whole concept of a rebuild is being proven to be a dumb idea just like I said it was five years ago. Look at what Vancouver has done in terms of roster and management overhaul in like one season. And then someone will say "oh but Vancouver always gets the good FA cause nobody wants to play in Edmonton". And that excuse was working out like gold until Calgary manages to turn over key roster components and clear house on management/coaching and still maintain respectability.

Not Edmonton. We need to just keep on sucking for one more top draft pick. Why would Katz even care about making improvements. He's got half the fanbase fooled into thinking watching junior hockey and salivating over the next great hope is what being an Oiler fan is all about.

 

[The Nuge]

The reality is that we needed to get a higher pick one of the 2 previous years. We need that top dman, and Ekblad and Jones are the best to come along in quite a while. We need a top dman regardless of how we get him. If it's through the draft, so be it. We don't need to draft more forwards though

 

[Valic]

Zero.

We need a manager who will trade from a position of strength to address weaknesses.

We need a coach who has some experience and doesn't make all the bonehead mistakes Eakins makes.

We need a manager who recognizes there was three or four starting goalies going to be free agents this year, and not trade 4 collective picks for two back ups just prior.

They need a managment team that doesn't alienate players and ruin development by forcing them to play though injuries.

They need an owner who isn't content to collect high picks, who will hold everyone in the organization accountable.

They need to create at least the illusion of anti-neoptism by not handing over jobs to former players.

 

[Mr Positive]

You missed Pouliot at 4th overall for your OP btw

 

[BowDangles]

How many first round picks do we need to be successful?

All of them.

 

[Smart Dunsparce*]

Its not the players, its the coaching. Look at Vancouver and how a new but competent head coach can do for a team.

 

[GretzkytoKurri9917]

Just one-McDavid.

 

[Soundwave]

McDavid is so good he would make this team OK.

But there would be other factors to this too ... like Klefbom and Nurse also having developed more and being able to play some games next year (Klefbom will probably be a full time NHLer). And also Drasaitl will be NHL ready probably by next season too. So if they landed McDavid, they'd also finally start to reap more benefit from all these other picks they've amassed (lol).

Having said that the management simply needs to go. All of them. They are like a poison cloud of bad karma hanging over this franchise, we need a fresh new start.

I don't know what kitten Kevin Lowe kicked after the 2006 run, but the hockey gods just don't like him. He needs to leave, so does Mac T, and Howson, and Eakins.

 

[NeverForget06]

Our problems, as has been mentioned above, do not come from weaker first round picks but rather failing to pick up valuable players in the later rounds. There are not really any oilers are on the roster that you can say are late round steals or even second or third rounders that turned into nhlers besides Petry.

 

[Soundwave]

Our problems, as has been mentioned above, do not come from weaker first round picks but rather failing to pick up valuable players in the later rounds. There are not really any oilers are on the roster that you can say are late round steals or even second or third rounders that turned into nhlers besides Petry.

I do think some of the issues do stem from RNH and Yakupov being relatively weaker picks. If you swapped those two out with Stamkos and Tavares, the Oilers probably would be decent. Your lineup would probably look like this

Hall Stamkos Purcell
Perron Tavares Eberle

At this point Yakupov produces nothing like a no.1 overall pick and RNH seems more like a no.3 pick in a different draft year. The only player that plays like he's a no.1 overall is Hall. If we had two more players as good as him or better, sure we'd be better.

McDavid is better than all three of them and better than RNH + Yakupov combined most likely.

 

[oobga]

It's pretty astonishing to be honest. I look at the Tambo/Lowe era and think, "how the **** did they even accomplish this?" Our team doesn't have a single top player that wasn't acquired through the draft or college UFA. They haven't made a solid asset management deal since 2008.

Then you had the Lowe/Lowe era of slowly breaking down the core that Sather left him for diminishing returns (aside from the Pronger trade) and getting almost nothing at all from the draft no matter what round we picked in. Thank goodness he left enough Sather pieces so we had a team with some balls to make that 2006 run, but when the last good Sather bits left, we finally went completely off the cliff.

 

[Zaddy]

You missed Pouliot at 4th overall for your OP btw

Only included the players the Oilers picked (and the guys they returned in trades).

 

[Raab]

I do think some of the issues do stem from RNH and Yakupov being relatively weaker picks. If you swapped those two out with Stamkos and Tavares, the Oilers probably would be decent. Your lineup would probably look like this

Hall Stamkos Purcell
Perron Tavares Eberle

At this point Yakupov produces nothing like a no.1 overall pick and RNH seems more like a no.3 pick in a different draft year. The only player that plays like he's a no.1 overall is Hall. If we had two more players as good as him or better, sure we'd be better.

McDavid is better than all three of them and better than RNH + Yakupov combined most likely.

IMO if we had kept our 1st in 2008 and took Myers and then added Hedman or OEL in 2009 our team would have be fine. Ive said it a million times but it doesn't matter if we have Crosby, Malkin, and Tavares up front if we don't have any defence;

 

[ManofSteel55]

So a couple of years ago everyone loves Stu for his picks. These guys don't develop the way they are expected to, so Stu is the one that should get the boot? Sorry, to me, that screams of issues in player development, not drafting.

 

[ManofSteel55]

Our problems, as has been mentioned above, do not come from weaker first round picks but rather failing to pick up valuable players in the later rounds. There are not really any oilers are on the roster that you can say are late round steals or even second or third rounders that turned into nhlers besides Petry.

And Marincin. But yes, its our lack of late rounders that is hurting our draft record. I think some people have unrealistic expectations of the draft though. Outside of the first round, you are lucky if you get one or two guys a year who become full time NHL'ers. People who expected all of Lander, Hamilton, Pitlick, Marinincin, etc to become NHL'ers were a bit unrealistic. The problem is that more than one of those guys should be.

 

[Soundwave]

So a couple of years ago everyone loves Stu for his picks. These guys don't develop the way they are expected to, so Stu is the one that should get the boot? Sorry, to me, that screams of issues in player development, not drafting.

For exactly what picks did Stu get all that love for?

I think people were so happy to see Pendergrast gone and enamoured with the early pick of Eberle that we prematurely labelled Stu some kind of genius.

Fact is none of his 2nd/3rd round picks have really amounted to much. And that's where IMO scouting has to earn their paycheque, drafting in the top 10 is fairly straight forward.

I'll be honest too I'm not nearly as enthralled with Marincin as a lot of people on this board are either. He's nothing all that special, I think we're just so accustomed to having the dumbest defensemen in the NHL that anyone who looks like they chew gum and skate at the same time without falling over suddenly seems great.

 

[OilTastic]

This. But the Oiler scouts are so pathetic, how could we expect any goalie they select to turn out anyway.

Case in point: Zach Nagelvoort - http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=144163
Case2 in point: Keven Bouchard - http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=169571

WTF. I cannot believe these scouts have a job. Fire the lot. Save your money Katz - send these guys along the road to ruin, and have your kid pick the next name off Redline's list every year. I assure you, that this would provide better results!

^i believe that Nagelvoort and Bouchard were picks Stu and the boys pulled out of their a$$e$! they passed on higher ranked goalies to pick there two slugs that only add to the mediocrity in our system. i'm really starting to get pi$$ed off with them and their lack of faith in taking goalies in the 2nd round. the ones they have passed on in recent drafts in the 2nd, John Gibson, and Robin Lehner are starting to pay off now, and yes i realize that there are a lot more who haven't panned out, either yet or at all, but maybe it's time to take a gamble? especially when we have had no luck in the later rounds.

 

[Game 8]

So a couple of years ago everyone loves Stu for his picks. These guys don't develop the way they are expected to, so Stu is the one that should get the boot? Sorry, to me, that screams of issues in player development, not drafting.

Its called accountability! If you get a new job your resume everything else lines up for you to be offered the position. After a given period if you are not getting the job done changes have to be made simple as that. There is no more important support staff position in a sports organization than scouting. If your scouts are finding hidden gems in the later rounds it can make mediocre GM's or Coaches look far better! At least it gives you some options!

 

[Bankerguy]

I just checked the standings..you guys are last in the west.

Then i came here and saw this thread. It seems like the Oilers have been one of the worst teams in the league for a long time. When do you expect to start improving to at least a 7th - 9th place team? next year? or the year after that?

 

[Pros and Cons]

I just checked the standings..you guys are last in the west.

Then i came here and saw this thread. It seems like the Oilers have been one of the worst teams in the league for a long time. When do you expect to start improving to at least a 7th - 9th place team? next year? or the year after that?

I think you are a little late for the party. This is not news to Oiler fans, but thank you for poking the bee's nest. This should be fun.