Post-Game Talk: Grade Canucks 2013 draft

[BenningHurtsMySoul]

9/10.

Horvat will make the show for sure, you can just tell he's one of those big-game players. 16 goals in 21 playoff games...enough said. That's better production than MacKinnon or Drouin. Nichushkin might put up more points but we could not afford to take the risk of him leaving for Russia. He seems exactly like the kind of player that would butt heads with Torts as well...awful showing at the combine.

Shinkaruk will be a steal, no doubt in my mind. He's an easy top 10 pick in a weaker draft and if he'd duplicated his 49 goal season from last year he'd have probably gone in the top 10 year. Fantastic skillset here and should be on the top line for the WJC. Attitude issues are a bit troubling but that can always get sorted out. You can't teach hands like this kid has.

Don't know anything about Cassels. Neat that he gets picked by his Dad's old team.

Subban is another great pick, dropped because of size concerns but he put up numbers comparable to guys like Nurse and Pulock. Plus, he's got that competitive Subban drive. I have no doubt that he'll make the show one day.

Don't know much about the other picks.

No idea about Cassels

 

[Canucker]

Without the Schneider trade it's an 8, with the trade it's a 5. Gillis didn't get enough for Schneider.

 

[Shareefruck]

Unless Horvat (or who am I kidding, Shinkaruk) make an immediate impact, as in playing a full time role with this club, I have to say this whole draft is tainted by the the Schneider trade. We moved the most valuable asset and kept the lower valued asset, while still keeping a high level of performance at the position. Moving Schneider wasn't the mistake. Moving Schneider that didn't maximize our return was.

This has shades of Hodgson and Kassian, a trade that came from no where that got us a ho-hum present return, and the promise of improvement. I can't write off Kassian, and keeping Hodgson would have been bad news, but I feel for both Schneider and Hodsgon, we could have, and should have, gotten more.

Anyway, I am warming up to Horvat as our top prospect, but I still feel Nichushkin would have been the better pick. We don't need another "two way forward". He may be a future leader of the team, but anyone drafted that high this year has that expectation on them.

Nurse(or Horvat again...who knows)+2nd+Klefbom could have been enough to play Schneider 8 times a season. By moving him for less, but further away, I feel Gillis acknowledged his value and ability, which drives me crazier.

Shinkaruk would have more then then made up for the pick of Horvat, but him dropping 10 spots or so wouldn't have been realistic to expect. I'm actually more excited for Shinkaruk then I am for Horvat, Gaunce and even potentially Jensen. Let's rock.

Cassels I have no comment on, since I'd never heard of the guy before we took him.

Subban as a 4th round pick could be a steal, but I'm not holding my breath. Corrado, Tanev, K-Conn, Polasek and I'm sure a few others show that low drafted (or not at all) Dmen can be made into contributing roster players (juries out on K-Conn, but he got us Roy anyway, and Polasek has made leaps forward). I don't expect the world of him, but I'm excited to see if he can live up to the hype his brother created for him.

Liberati, Cedarholm and the rest I honestly don't have any word on. Fingers crossed, but I'm not holding my breath.

After a night to sleep on it, I stand by my 8, even thinking it could drop to a 7 because of that trade.

I feel the complete opposite. I believe the return was solid and what should be expected in the current market for goalies, but that the idea of trading Schneider and keeping Luongo is a horrible decision that will bite us in the ass for years to come.

Getting Horvat as the return softens the blow, from my perspective.

 

[Eddy Punch Clock]

No but maybe it's the ******* child of Raymond's mother and Jim Hughson's father.

You win.

(Funny that you can't say *******. Totally legitimate word used in the context you did. )

 

[KDizzle]

I feel the complete opposite. I believe the return was solid and what should be expected in the current market for goalies, but that the idea of trading Schneider and keeping Luongo is a horrible decision that will bite us in the ass for years to come.

Getting Horvat as the return softens the blow, from my perspective.

I think, if anything, this shows Gillis' confidence in the development of Lack, Ericsson, and maybe even Cannata.

We have goaltenders in the pipeline and if we have to revisit this fiasco in 3 or 4 more years, we'd be in a much better position to buy out or trade Luongo.

That said, it would be such an unprofessional move to put Luongo through this again, so I don't know how it's all going to shake out.

 

[Addison Rae]

I can back him up on this one. I clearly remember Y2K saying we might as well not make that trade if it's our only move, because even with Roy we were still a lousy team. Turns out, he was right all along

I can second this.

 

[Drop the Sopel]

I can second this.

Yeah, he wanted us to dump a bunch of picks to get Ryane Clowe on top of the Roy trade. In hindsight, that likely would have been a big mistake. Would have compounded the problem.

 

[DennisReynolds]

The more and more I think about, I don't think the return was as bad as people are making it out to be. So 7/10

Draft-wise, I give it 8/10.

7.5/10 overall

 

[Archangel]

I remember the 96 and the 97 draft how many people were over the moon with are picks. Josh Holdon was supposed to be a C that would develop a Thomas Gradin or Patrick Sundstrom type of player. Ever since those drafts I have always been hesitant when too many people say we have had a great draft.

 

[RandV]

I remember the 96 and the 97 draft how many people were over the moon with are picks. Josh Holdon was supposed to be a C that would develop a Thomas Gradin or Patrick Sundstrom type of player. Ever since those drafts I have always been hesitant when too many people say we have had a great draft.

Josh Holden's career kind of got derailed by injuries though.

But what I like is the potential top six forward depth we have: Horvat, Shinkaruk, Gaunce, Jensen, Schroeder, Kassian

Offensive forward prospect has been this franchises weakness for the longest time, and I can't remember a time when we've ever looked better in this area.

 

[CanaFan]

I remember the 96 and the 97 draft how many people were over the moon with are picks. Josh Holdon was supposed to be a C that would develop a Thomas Gradin or Patrick Sundstrom type of player. Ever since those drafts I have always been hesitant when too many people say we have had a great draft.

What pick were we over the moon about in '97? Wasn't on message boards back then but I remember lots of criticism in the papers and talk radio that Quinn had drafted a glorified scrapper in Ference. 6'3 and thin as a rail but seemed to fancy himself a scrapper. Pretty sure Van fans weren't thrilled with that pick (I definitely wasn't).

As for Holden in '96, he was ranked a top 5 pick who fell to 12 due to size concerns, plus a huge run on "big defensemen who can skate" between 8 and 11. No reason we shouldn't have been excited, especially since a freak skate cut to his wrist tendons is what ostensibly ruined his development.

Just because success rates on 1st round picks aren't 100% is no reason not to be excited. After all, future NHL stars do have to come from somewhere.

 

[pitseleh]

I like that the Canucks seemed to target three guys, Cassels, Cederholm and Liberati, who seemed to be buried down their teams' depth charts and probably didn't get as much exposure as a result. I don't have empirical evidence for this, but I think that's probably a good way to find undervalued players late in the draft.

 

[Burke's Evil Spirit]

I like that the Canucks seemed to target three guys, Cassels, Cederholm and Liberati, who seemed to be buried down their teams' depth charts and probably didn't get as much exposure as a result. I don't have empirical evidence for this, but I think that's probably a good way to find undervalued players late in the draft.

They also drafted younger players, which I like, and they drafted players that really improved their play in the latter half of the season, which I also like (as long as it's true improvement and not a percentage-based mirage).

 

[PhilMick]

I voted 10, I'm more excited about Canucks hockey than I've been in years because of what went down Sunday. I don't think I've ever seen the team pick the players I actually wanted them to, just crazy. I even had Cassels and Subban on my list. The only thing that didn't happen was I was hoping for Greg Chase or Brady Brassart in the 6th so we'd have a Hitman in the prospect pool.

 

[StevenToddIves]

THW Column: Canucks draft analyzed & graded

I recently published a column on thehockeywriters discussing the drafts of the teams in "Conference A" (of course including the Canucks):

http://thehockeywriters.com/grading-the-2013-nhl-draft-on-a-curve-conference-a/

I steered away from focusing on the Schneider deal and instead focused more on the draft selections. I would love to hear what the Canucks' faithful thinks!

 

[LickTheEnvelope]

Looks about right thanks.

 

[BeardyCanuck03]

While Subban may have the higher more flashy ceiling of the late round picks, I like Cederholm as being the late round sleeper for the Canucks. He got drafted by the Portland Winterhawks today in the CHL Import Draft.

 

[arsmaster*]

How Edmonton gets an A and vancouver gets an A- has be scratching my head.

I actually think Edmonton trading away from selecting Zykov (whom LA traded up to get) was a huge blunder.

This is the larger bodied 'heavy' player that winning teams target. I honestly think LA might have another Toffoli-esque steal in the 2nd round with Zykov.

To be honest, I think you're overvaluing Fasching.

For the Canucks to get two top 15 prospects in a draft they entered with 24th overall and no 2nd, I don't see how LA gets a B+ and they only get an A-.

I disagree with your analysis and I think Vancouver had the best draft in this conference.

 

[Catamarca Livin]

How Edmonton gets an A and vancouver gets an A- has be scratching my head.

I actually think Edmonton trading away from selecting Zykov (whom LA traded up to get) was a huge blunder.

This is the larger bodied 'heavy' player that winning teams target. I honestly think LA might have another Toffoli-esque steal in the 2nd round with Zykov.

To be honest, I think you're overvaluing Fasching.

For the Canucks to get two top 15 prospects in a draft they entered with 24th overall and no 2nd, I don't see how LA gets a B+ and they only get an A-.

I disagree with your analysis and I think Vancouver had the best draft in this conference.

Excellent article, though i do agree with the above. Edmonton cannot be an A if L.A. is a B+ based on the Zykov trade. Based on the analysis Edmonton made a big mistake. Enjoyed the article. We will all see how the draft turns out.

 

[Bankerguy]

How did Subban fall so far?

The way P.K talked about him.... sounded like he expected his little brother to be better than him!!!

Based on bloodlines alone, you think he'd go 3 rd or 4th round

 

[Eddy Punch Clock]

How did Subban fall so far?

The way P.K talked about him.... sounded like he expected his little brother to be better than him!!!

Based on bloodlines alone, you think he'd go 3 rd or 4th round

For the same reason Gerbe is being bought out.

... and he did go in the fourth round.

 

[StevenToddIves]

Excellent analysis

How Edmonton gets an A and vancouver gets an A- has be scratching my head.

I actually think Edmonton trading away from selecting Zykov (whom LA traded up to get) was a huge blunder.

This is the larger bodied 'heavy' player that winning teams target. I honestly think LA might have another Toffoli-esque steal in the 2nd round with Zykov.

To be honest, I think you're overvaluing Fasching.

For the Canucks to get two top 15 prospects in a draft they entered with 24th overall and no 2nd, I don't see how LA gets a B+ and they only get an A-.

I disagree with your analysis and I think Vancouver had the best draft in this conference.

You make many strong points. I agree that drafting Zykov would have been a better move than trading away the pick to a conference rival.

Fasching seemed to thought of higher by the ISS and myself than other scouting services, but check out film on this kid -- he's the complete package.

Keep in mind that I thought Edmonton and Vancouver both had phenomenal drafts. Also, Calgary, LA and Phoenix did quite well. Anaheim and San Jose, however...

 

[CloutierForVezina]

How did Subban fall so far?

The way P.K talked about him.... sounded like he expected his little brother to be better than him!!!

Based on bloodlines alone, you think he'd go 3 rd or 4th round

I wouldn't read much into how someone describes their siblings. Remember all the Staal hooplah? Each one better than the last and all the jazz? Of course someone isn't going to come out and say their little brother is a garbage player who will never do anything and no team should bother wasting a draft pick on them.

If your voice carried enough weight to get your little brother drafted a few rounds earlier and maybe to get him a chance at playing in the NHL, of course you'd sign his praises.

 

[StevenToddIves]

Thanks for the kind words

Excellent article, though i do agree with the above. Edmonton cannot be an A if L.A. is a B+ based on the Zykov trade. Based on the analysis Edmonton made a big mistake. Enjoyed the article. We will all see how the draft turns out.

And you make a very strong point perhaps I should have considered more.

 

[King of the ES*]

trade 11/10 Schnedier is OVERATED and replaceable

draft 9/10

Incredible.

Woefully bad trade that will haunt us for years, like very much the Shinkaruk, Cassels, and Subban picks.