Post-Game Talk: Fire Gallant

[bleedblue94]

The guys who care about preseason games simply aren’t that good. The guys who could make an impact if they pushed back don’t really have much reason to exert themselves in a meaningless game with 20% of the real roster. I’m absolutely fine with “saving it” for when the games matter. If the team is flat in game 1, 2, 3 of the regular season we can talk. Literally the only reason I am watching these games is because I love hockey and it’s a chance to see what the fringe guys and kids look like in a limited showing. I wouldn’t care if we set the single game goals allowed record in a preseason game. I couldn’t possibly put less stock in the performance of the established players. The only thing even close to concerning is that KAM looks truly shaky.
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It's a culture thing, and for something that's been a problem around here for a few years you got to stop making excuses about it. The guys that have been here the last few years in the country club atmosphere that's developing again should not be allowing it to continue. It's a slippery slope to get back into the dark ages and especially with so much young talent around our vets should be setting an example of what is acceptable here rather than sitting back in this kind of trash. People can try to justify it all they want, but every single year we go through the same thing we're training camp is a complete joke and then the season starts and we're awful and then everybody wants to say oh well they should have done better and taking it more serious during camp to be ready for the games. This is the same old crap it's been the last few years and I'm sick of the excuses. And people are crazy if they think the kids aren't going to copy what the vets are doing here. The good teams in this league don't make excuses for this kind of garbage. The good teams in this league actually take all the game serious and prepare properly for the season. If anybody thinks that the efforts that have been shown so far during preseason are preparing properly for the regular season and they're out of their minds

 

[romba]

A good coaching staff works through these problems.

If this is happening 20+ games into the season, we can start to panic.

It's pre-season. What's disheartening is that all of our 'captains' were playing yesterday. Never seem 'ready to go'. Maybe Fox is the true Captain.

Fox is the brains, Panarin is the heart

 

[PuckLuck3043]

It still amuses me how people get worked up over pre season games with half the real roster not playing. I don't care if they lost 15-1. I always give it 15-20 regular season games to see what we have. Remember, it's an 82 game marathon.

 

[Slurpeelover27]

I'll be brutally honest...after the way lundkvist looked in the rookie games and the 2 preseason games so far..I'd have sent him down to Hartford rather than giving him another game tonight.

If Ryan mcdonagh...a prospect at the time WAY better and way more seasoned here, could spend time in Hartford..Nils can.


And I'm sorry but anyone who thinks his career is over because he has to go to Hartford can just put me on ignore cause I've already done it to you.

Develop.ent is not linear, it's not a step by step process. Sometimes you go backwards. Sometimes you have to unlearn stuff. There's a lot that goes into it. Lundkvist does not look even remotely as good as Schneider or Jones.

If it's me, both Jones and Schneider are making this team...and nemeth is your 7th d.

Don’t know what you were watching but Schneider was terrible yesterday. Looked slow, fumbled the puck, no offense and terrible all around defense. Jones looked better but that pair was on the ice for a ton of chances against. Not all their fault as forwards were not good. Nils was very solid making good reads and smart passes all night. Good positioning as well and assist on only Rangers goal. Not perfect and not flashy but just getting warmed up. Nils played over 20 minutes in 2 games where his team was throttled and his line did not let a goal in and he looked very solid. According to the Athletic writer Rick Carpinello he was 3rd best and 2nd best Rangers player in the 2 games he played. I take his opinion over yours any day.

 

[romba]

I only hope Miller was told his spot is his from the start, and he only looks putrid be use he’s avoiding injury and working on things due to preseason

 

[will1066]

It still amuses me how people get worked up over pre season games with half the real roster not playing. I don't care if they lost 15-1. I always give it 15-20 regular season games to see what we have. Remember, it's an 82 game marathon.

For me, it's not the score. It's how it got there. It's about the quality of play.

 

[WojtekWolski86]

It still amuses me how people get worked up over pre season games with half the real roster not playing. I don't care if they lost 15-1. I always give it 15-20 regular season games to see what we have. Remember, it's an 82 game marathon.

We didn't fail last year because of a skill problem, it was a will problem. Far too many games where we have phoned it in effort wise the past 2 years. The blame was pointed at Quinn. Now we have Gallant and the problem still exists. It's not like Gallant I coming in with a Trotz system to implement. Gallant wants guys to work their tails off and no one is doing it with exception of 1 or 2 kids. That's not a good first impression the roster players are setting.

In preseason I give 2 shots about the score or result. But so far with the exception of Panarin making AHLers look like minor leaguers we have been out hustled and made terrible decisions against mostly AHL rosters.

 

[duhmetreE]

Lololol



"I can't wait till we have a real coach who gives kids a chance...like gallant!"

Then lundkvist looks like shit, holds him accountable and everyone is shocked and surprised.


Quinn was a good coach .firing him was dumb.

Gallant is a good coach. Turning on him is dumb.

People need to reassess themselves and how the game and lineup spots and time on the ice is actually earned.

Quinn could be a good assistant coach. He was not a good head coach at the back half of his tenure.

 

[SA16]

The guys who care about preseason games simply aren’t that good. The guys who could make an impact if they pushed back don’t really have much reason to exert themselves in a meaningless game with 20% of the real roster. I’m absolutely fine with “saving it” for when the games matter. If the team is flat in game 1, 2, 3 of the regular season we can talk. Literally the only reason I am watching these games is because I love hockey and it’s a chance to see what the fringe guys and kids look like in a limited showing. I wouldn’t care if we set the single game goals allowed record in a preseason game. I couldn’t possibly put less stock in the performance of the established players. The only thing even close to concerning is that KAM looks truly shaky.
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The leading point scorer in the preseason from 2017-2019 is Connor McDavid. The best players in the league in the regular season put up the best results in the preseason.

 

[PuckLuck3043]

For me, it's not the score. It's how it got there. It's about the quality of play.

With no Fox, Panarin, Laf, Kakko, etc it still doesn't matter. I watched a little of the game and what I saw was poor goaltending. It's 3 preseason games. Gallant is a good coach but he still needs time to evaluate and implement his system.

 

[duhmetreE]

We didn't fail last year because of a skill problem, it was a will problem. Far too many games where we have phoned it in effort wise the past 2 years. The blame was pointed at Quinn. Now we have Gallant and the problem still exists. It's not like Gallant I coming in with a Trotz system to implement. Gallant wants guys to work their tails off and no one is doing it with exception of 1 or 2 kids. That's not a good first impression the roster players are setting.

In preseason I give 2 shots about the score or result. But so far with the exception of Panarin making AHLers look like minor leaguers we have been out hustled and made terrible decisions against mostly AHL rosters.

Like everything in life, It takes a few weeks, minimum, to build new habits.

It’s not instant. If they look like this in November-December…. It starts to be concerning

 

[PuckLuck3043]

We didn't fail last year because of a skill problem, it was a will problem. Far too many games where we have phoned it in effort wise the past 2 years. The blame was pointed at Quinn. Now we have Gallant and the problem still exists. It's not like Gallant I coming in with a Trotz system to implement. Gallant wants guys to work their tails off and no one is doing it with exception of 1 or 2 kids. That's not a good first impression the roster players are setting.

In preseason I give 2 shots about the score or result. But so far with the exception of Panarin making AHLers look like minor leaguers we have been out hustled and made terrible decisions against mostly AHL rosters.

It's pre-season. Do you really think that Gallant is going to stand for players not playing hard during regular season when games count? I'll wait until 20 games into the season to see how the team is playing.

 

[WojtekWolski86]

It's pre-season. Do you really think that Gallant is going to stand for players not playing hard during regular season when games count? I'll wait until 20 games into the season to see how the team is playing.

Can we stop using the pre-season excuse? This isn't football where you play 3 snaps in 1 game and you are G2G.

1. This team hasn't had a captain in years. An entire coaching tenure felt that no one was deserving the C. The current staff/GM have made it a point to say there will be a Captain. Does anyone want to step up and lead by example? Maybe show the young kids the work you have to put in and never take a shift or game off?

2. Again the criticism with the last coach was guys weren't "prepared" to start games. No in-game adjustments. Gallant isn't here for x's and o's. If the owner cleans house and the players recognize "I guess playoffs are the goal" wouldn't you want to make a good first impression? I knew Quinn was going to get axed because its easier to replace him than the whole core of players. I'm afraid this core of "veterans" are lazy and if Gallant can't get their asses motivated than its time to blow it up again.

 

[will1066]

With no Fox, Panarin, Laf, Kakko, etc it still doesn't matter. I watched a little of the game and what I saw was poor goaltending. It's 3 preseason games. Gallant is a good coach but he still needs time to evaluate and implement his system.

My criticism didn't concern any of those names you listed. I'm not encouraged by the spottiness of play, the lack of defensive coverage, the careless puck management, the lack of a forecheck, basically the same stuff we've been accustomed to the last several years.

 

[PuckLuck3043]

Can we stop using the pre-season excuse? This isn't football where you play 3 snaps in 1 game and you are G2G.

1. This team hasn't had a captain in years. An entire coaching tenure felt that no one was deserving the C. The current staff/GM have made it a point to say there will be a Captain. Does anyone want to step up and lead by example? Maybe show the young kids the work you have to put in and never take a shift or game off?

2. Again the criticism with the last coach was guys weren't "prepared" to start games. No in-game adjustments. Gallant isn't here for x's and o's. If the owner cleans house and the players recognize "I guess playoffs are the goal" wouldn't you want to make a good first impression? I knew Quinn was going to get axed because its easier to replace him than the whole core of players. I'm afraid this core of "veterans" are lazy and if Gallant can't get their asses motivated than its time to blow it up again.

Sorry, but pre season is an excuse tbh. The football Jets looked good and were 2-0-1 in preseason and then reality set in. I think most veterans view these games as a chore and are just doing enough to get by and get ready for when it counts. You just can't take anything away from 3 preseason games aside from evaluating some of the younger guys who have a real shot at making the team like Jones or Lundkvist. I'll wait until 15-20 games in to pass judgement. I think we will see an entirely different team. As a matter of fact I am sure of it. If you want to panic after 3 games that mean nothing then go right ahead.

 

[PuckLuck3043]

My criticism didn't concern any of those names you listed. I'm not encouraged by the spottiness of play, the lack of defensive coverage, the careless puck management, the lack of a forecheck, basically the same stuff we've been accustomed to the last several years.

It is still a new coach with a new system and some new players. It still takes time. Talk to me in late November- December.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

rykov was mediocre in the ahl while blais is an established nhl player with a cup ring. hayes was a c, a cheap contract, young enough to still have upside. both were also deadline deals so you get a premium there, and with buch trade there's the added complication of the flat cap.

i think it really comes down to we just view blais differently. personally i think he could be an absolutely perfect fit with what he brings, how we plan to use him, and a player i think will thrive under gallant. i think you're really undervaluing what his skillset can allow him to become here if things break the right way.

the other thing is i'm not sure what you would have considered fair value which team fit the profile of a match would theoretically provide that. a guy like blais is what we were looking for in the return. thats what we don't have. i'm curious what you would have preferred the return look like? not being sarcastic, curious what you'd think was fair value that was realistic re total return and player types.

We could have had a first or a mid prospect. I think a middle six player. Blais seems like a 4th liner.

 

[2014nyr]

rykov wasnt part of the hayes deal. Rykov was part of the grabner trade.

Hayes was 1st and lemeiux.
Grabner was a 2nd and rykov.

i know who was traded for who, can see how it came off otherwise tho there. point was trying to get at was more neither was all that special or much better than buch return, and both cases had factors favoring the seller versus buch - deadline deals and not looking at flat cap, maybe for several years.

 

[Ola]

I knew Schneider was going to give Nils a run for his money for the last D spot this camp. Some people freaked cause Nils was the older prospect coming off a big year the the SHL.
From all indications from everything that was put out, Schneider was coming like a freight train. He wasn’t that far off from NHL duty and has impressed to this point. They still may send him down to Hartford, but if your just going on merit and who looks the best in camp/preseason, Schneider probably takes the spot.
What I didn’t expect was how polished Jones looked. I knew he didn’t look out of place when he got his taste of NHL action last season, but for being a young guy who hasn’t played D very long, I didn’t expect him to make it into the horse race for that last D spot. I thought he was Hartford bound for sure to tighten up his game. But he looks calm cool and collected out there. Kudos to him for busting his ass.
At most we have 1 season before guys either have to make the switch to LD and/or a trade will be made. They aren’t going to keep guys in the A for long if they are ready for NHL duty. These kids want to play, and you don’t want to make them disgruntled or damage their development just because they can go to the AHL. You want to ice the best team possible.
I don’t think Nils has looked bad, but I do think the smaller ice surface and players being bigger and faster has had an effect on his decision making. I also agree, a Half season of 1St pair AHL minutes wouldn’t be the worst thing for him. Sure as hell doesn’t mean he’s a bad prospect lol.

There is always going to be an evolution among players when you have a loaded farm. Just like Kravy and Kakko basically pushed Buch out, there will be moves on defense.

Which D will be moved? If there is a pecking order, it’s probably good for the organization if the guy to get traded — makes the team first. Ds often need a little time. It’s one thing to play well for 10-15 games, another to do it for 40 and another to do it for 80, season in and season out. Even if we really like Schneider, it’s not wrong that Nils get first dibs, can establish himself in the NHL and build up even more value, before he is traded.

 

[2014nyr]

We have no idea if we got what we could for buch bc for all we know Drury sacrificed a much better offer to bring in grit in blais just like he gave up a laughable amount for reaves

what much better return helps us and where would it potentially come from? our needs are at top 6 c and grit. top 6 c player or prospect was never happening.

laughable amount for reaves? a 3rd rounder? the guy is gonna be awesome...he's not a goon. he's a solid player who's gonna give us a physical presence on the ice and bring an attitude/personality we've been lacking to the bench. phenominal teammate and a veteran leader...a 3rd rounder and extending him a year on a cheap deal is a no brainer price to pay

 

[cheech70]

Come on...enjoy an IPA and the beautiful weather...once the bell rings then we evaluate....if I were Kreider I better have a good start cause GG will replace him on the right with Gauthier.

 

[jay from jersey]

There is always going to be an evolution among players when you have a loaded farm. Just like Kravy and Kakko basically pushed Buch out, there will be moves on defense.

Which D will be moved? If there is a pecking order, it’s probably good for the organization if the guy to get traded — makes the team first. Ds often need a little time. It’s one thing to play well for 10-15 games, another to do it for 40 and another to do it for 80, season in and season out. Even if we really like Schneider, it’s not wrong that Nils get first dibs, can establish himself in the NHL and build up even more value, before he is traded.

Yea I got no problem with him getting it coming out of the gate. Just reinforcing the fact that Schneider is much closer talent wise to being a NHL player on a 3rd pair.
A lot of people think he needs a full year in the AHL maybe more. I doubt that’s the case. Schneider will be ready sooner then later. Both guys still have things to work on, but overall both should be ready or close to 3rd pair duty

 

[2014nyr]

Speaks to the leadership on the team and the abysmal job our gms have done the last 4 seasons. Hopefully, this turns around when the games matter

its embarassing and hopefully is taken a little more seriously in the locker room. but big picture i its a preseason game with less than half the roster etc...nothing to draw any conclusions from

 

[jay from jersey]

We have no idea if we got what we could for buch bc for all we know Drury sacrificed a much better offer to bring in grit in blais just like he gave up a laughable amount for reaves

A 3rd rounder at this point in time isn’t really an overpay for Reaves. He’s 34 now, which def decreases his value, but he’s still an everyday 4th liner that brings grit/leadership. Those guys are worth a premium to teams that need them.
Shit the Pens paid a 1st for him (Kostin) in his younger days.
Blais still has room to grow as well. He has a cup ring and NHL experience. He’s also still young and can hopefully elevate his game a bit. Having a guy like that, that can play up and down your 2nd to 4th lines is pretty valuable especially come playoff time.
I don’t think the prices drury paid were extravagant.
Look at what pens paid for a young Reaves and Tampa to bring in Goodrow and Coleman. These guys cost. I dread to think what Calgary would want for Mangipane

 

[chosen]

It's over. Pack it up boys. It's a mystery to me why Miller-Trouba is some kind of an Olympic super pairing set in stone.

After this camp, if Quinn had stuck with Miller-Trouba as a top-4, his balls would have been roasted here and the narrative would be that Gallant can't adjust to reality.