Rumor: Edmonton possibly interested in Engelland

[wgknestrick]

That's not the question though. The question is whether you'd rather have Despres or Engelland in the press box playing 1 out of every 5 NHL games. And I know my answer.

Depres has a 2way contract so he is never sitting in press box. Why pay anyone not to play hockey? We can't have our cake and eat it too. If we want the young talent to play, we have to let go of these fringe NHL veterans. Why draft anyone if we never vacate openings for them?

If some team wants our 7th D man, we move him and never look back. The NHL-ready D men this team has that are NOT on the NHL team makes this an easy decision. They all have much higher ceilings than DE too. Pens are almost always going to have 1 D man injured during the season.

 

[alcanalz]

What about Bortuzzo as the 7th dman once Letang gets back? We lose strength in the bottom pairing if it's Niskanen with Despres or Maatta, but it's not like Bort is a 20 yo who still has a lot to gain by playing every night. He's a stay at home dman with limited offensive upside. This way one of the young guys breaks into the line up, and we still have a solid guy waiting for the inevitable injury.

Bort's still inexperienced at the NHL level, despite being older. It's not like experience only helps with offense.

 

[Darth Vitale]

Engo and a 2nd for Eberle (injury-prone, overrated and obsolete with Super Yakupov ready to bust out at any minute... they dohn need no steenking Eberle!).















(this is where we should insert the serious "Engo and 3rd for Hemsky", right? Just to get even with EDM fans for their dumb proposals over the years?)

 

[Big McLargehuge]

I don't see the value in moving Engelland. He's a league minimum salary 7th defenceman that can drop the gloves and still play reasonably good hockey.

All the guys that would take his spot in the press box are young and better served playing AHL minutes.

I endorse this post.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Depres has a 2way contract so he is never sitting in press box.

Uh, what?

Why pay anyone not to play hockey? We can't have our cake and eat it too. If we want the young talent to play, we have to let go of these fringe NHL veterans. Why draft anyone if we never vacate openings for them?

He's not getting paid not to play, he's getting paid to be able to jump in and play when we need him, which is infrequently. He's cheap, he's competent, he fills a niche, and he has no more developing to do, so he loses nothing by not playing regular hockey.

Bortuzzo and Maatta are regulars right now, and Despres almost certainly would be if it weren't for the cap wiggle room gained by Vokoun's injury. Orpik and Engelland's contracts are up this year, with Martin's coming the year after, and some of those spots will be filled by our young defensemen.

There are and will be opportunities for our young defensemen. They just won't come all at once, so people will have to exercise a little patience.

If some team wants our 7th D man, we move him and never look back. The NHL-ready D men this team has that are NOT on the NHL team makes this an easy decision. They all have much higher ceilings than DE too. Pens are almost always going to have 1 D man injured during the season.

Except that ignores all the previously mentioned advantages of keeping a cheap, experienced vet like Engelland who fills a niche as the #7 and all the disadvantages of putting a developing young defenseman in the press box.

These decisions aren't made in a vacuum.

 

[Shady Machine]

Depres has a 2way contract so he is never sitting in press box. Why pay anyone not to play hockey? We can't have our cake and eat it too. If we want the young talent to play, we have to let go of these fringe NHL veterans. Why draft anyone if we never vacate openings for them?

If some team wants our 7th D man, we move him and never look back. The NHL-ready D men this team has that are NOT on the NHL team makes this an easy decision. They all have much higher ceilings than DE too. Pens are almost always going to have 1 D man injured during the season.

So you only want to have 6 dmen on the roster?

 

[Ugene Magic]

Lovejoy got us a 5th. I'd expect the same +/- one round for Engo.

We also had a gluten amount of PMD's that Lovejoy was.

Bortuzzo = Engelland, so we have a replacement, but we are not loaded with what these two bring. I still think it's worth it for the 4th or better. Tough physical D they are not swimming in.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

With Bortuzzo improving Engelland is completely expandable. His only real purpose on this team is that its better to have a low upside veteran in the pressbox than a young player

If he's expandable, we should keep him. Those are qualities that are hard to come by, he's already the next step in human evolution.

 

[KIRK]

Engo and a 2nd for Eberle (injury-prone, overrated and obsolete with Super Yakupov ready to bust out at any minute... they dohn need no steenking Eberle!).















(this is where we should insert the serious "Engo and 3rd for Hemsky", right? Just to get even with EDM fans for their dumb proposals over the years?)

If you really want to get them, I say Glass and Engo for Eberle. When they doth protest, we just note that Glass has as many goals as Eberle, which is why we're not offering Craig Adams.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Trading Engelland for a pick could be decent. If Shero can some how get a 3rd from the Oilers for Engo, that'd be a solid move, a 2nd would be even better, to replace the one lost in the Murray trade and a higher 2nd if it's from EDM to boot. It depends on how desperate the Oilers are, I am guessing it's very.

What was that condition on that 2nd for 2014 anyway? Did the Pens lose it or do they still have it?

 

[KIRK]

Trading Engelland for a pick could be decent. If Shero can some how get a 3rd from the Oilers for Engo, that'd be a solid move, a 2nd would be even better, to replace the one lost in the Murray trade and a higher 2nd if it's from EDM to boot. It depends on how desperate the Oilers are, I am guessing it's very.

What was that condition on that 2nd for 2014 anyway? Did the Pens lose it or do they still have it?

It's good asset management, but who's your #7 in that scenario?

If Nisky ALSO were moved, then I wouldn't be averse to a 5/6/7 rotation of three young players, where each gets 50 or so regular season games. Borts and Despres being two of them. Choose between Maatta and Dumoulin for the other one.

No young player gets overwhelmed with too many games, and all FINALLY will get the type of experience they'll need under their belts to step up and replace Orpik after this year.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Unless the Oilers offer some sort of serious overpayment, I really don't think it's worth it to trade Engelland. Like has been mentioned, he's dirt cheap, and he fills a role that no one else on the roster can provide (actually fight and play the enforcer). Plus, while he's better suited as a #7, he's good enough to fill in as a physical, tough bottom pairing guy.

I really don't think he's the cause for the logjam on defense, anyway. Engelland fills that role of the guy who is usually in the press box, but dresses for certain games. It's guys like Niskanen and, to an extent, Orpik, that are holding up guys like Despres and Bortuzzo from getting regular minutes on the big club.

 

[KIRK]

Unless the Oilers offer some sort of serious overpayment, I really don't think it's worth it to trade Engelland. Like has been mentioned, he's dirt cheap, and he fills a role that no one else on the roster can provide (actually fight and play the enforcer). Plus, while he's better suited as a #7, he's good enough to fill in as a physical, tough bottom pairing guy.

I really don't think he's the cause for the logjam on defense, anyway. Engelland fills that role of the guy who is usually in the press box, but dresses for certain games. It's guys like Niskanen and, to an extent, Orpik, that are holding up guys like Despres and Bortuzzo from getting regular minutes on the big club.

Borts is getting his minutes, but yes to Despres. And Maatta. And Dumoulin. And soon enough Harrington. And then Pouliot and Ruopp and whoever else develops more than is anticipated.

 

[Vujtek]

I like Engo as the 7th D-man. But if the team wants to keep Maatta for the whole season (or send him to juniors and call up Despres to replace him) and activate D'Agostini from LTIR, they'd need to make a roster move and moving Engo's salary would be enough to achieve that. That would give the needed to cap room for D'Agostini and there'd still be 7 D-man with the team. The only problem would be that one of Bortuzzo or Maatta/Despres (whichever would be with the team) would be healthy scratch each night. They would need and deserve to play so I wouldn't be a fan of that but if the team keeps Niskanen over Engo then that's what the situation would be like.

 

[KIRK]

I like Engo as the 7th D-man. But if the team wants to keep Maatta for the whole season (or send him to juniors and call up Despres to replace him) and activate D'Agostini from LTIR, they'd need to make a roster move and moving Engo's salary would be enough to achieve that. That would give the needed to cap room for D'Agostini and there'd still be 7 D-man with the team. The only problem would be that one of Bortuzzo or Maatta/Despres (whichever would be with the team) would be healthy scratch each night. They would need and deserve to play so I wouldn't be a fan of that but if the team keeps Niskanen over Engo then that's what the situation would be like.

I suggested elsewhere moving Engo AND Nisky. Let say Borts, Despres, and Maatta (if you keep him)/Dumoulin (if you don't) rotate in the bottom pairing. Each one, if something happened in the next week, would get 50 games if split equally.

You definitely don't want to move just Engo and have whoever takes his place platooning with Borts.

 

[Ogrezilla]

I suggested elsewhere moving Engo AND Nisky. Let say Borts, Despres, and Maatta (if you keep him)/Dumoulin (if you don't) rotate in the bottom pairing. Each one, if something happened in the next week, would get 50 games if split equally.

You definitely don't want to move just Engo and have whoever takes his place platooning with Borts.

agreed. Engo is too cheap and has too little trade value to be worth trading on his own short of an over-payment.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

If you move Engelland, I think I would rather hang on to Niskanen, he's having a solid start and the Pens are in love with the guy, I'd be ok seeing him move because his value would be pretty damn good right now, but who do you move him for?

I don't want Nisky moved for a freakin' back up or another defenseman, I would love to see another young winger but maybe a prospect in the AHL rather than one that causes even more of a winger issue. Since no winger is likely getting moved.

 

[PensPlz]

Maybe Edmonton can just take him with them when they leave Tuesday night.

 

[wgknestrick]

Maybe Edmonton can just take him with them when they leave Tuesday night.

Just send him into the locker room with them when the game ends. See if he notices.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

I like Engelland as a #7 guy but we have too many D's in our pool. Right now if Shero can get a 3rd minimum for him I'd be happy, especially from the Oilers since it's basically a late 2nd

 

[Shady Machine]

If you move Engelland, I think I would rather hang on to Niskanen, he's having a solid start and the Pens are in love with the guy, I'd be ok seeing him move because his value would be pretty damn good right now, but who do you move him for?

I don't want Nisky moved for a freakin' back up or another defenseman, I would love to see another young winger but maybe a prospect in the AHL rather than one that causes even more of a winger issue. Since no winger is likely getting moved.

The problem with moving Engo and keeping Nisky is that you now have your number 7 dman filled by one of our young guys. So you are wasting development time on these guys. Engo is perfect for the number 7 role because he doesn't need ice time for development purposes. He is what he is.

That said, I can get behind KIRK's plan of moving Nisky and Engo. Then 5, 6, and 7 are Bortuzzo, Maatta, Despres/Dumoulin. You rotate all 3 so each gets about 50 games or so. Then you aren't wearing them out but not wasting development time. Now that won't happen, but it at least makes sense.

 

[Burgs]

Trading Engelland for a pick could be decent. If Shero can some how get a 3rd from the Oilers for Engo, that'd be a solid move, a 2nd would be even better, to replace the one lost in the Murray trade and a higher 2nd if it's from EDM to boot. It depends on how desperate the Oilers are, I am guessing it's very.

Getting a 2nd rounder for a 7th defenseman who'll be UFA next summer would be a steal of the highest order. Not even the Oilers can be that dumb.

What was that condition on that 2nd for 2014 anyway? Did the Pens lose it or do they still have it?

Conditions were a) Pens make conference finals or b) Pens re-sign Murray. Since we met the first condition the pick is gone. Otherwise we'd still have had to pay them a 2014 3rd rounder so in the end it's not that huge a difference.