SeanMoneyHands
Registered User
- Apr 18, 2019
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Bringing up the fact that the Sabres have been vastly better than the Habs offensively isn’t scrapping the barrel, it’s bringing up context.Now that's a weird argument... it looks like you had to scrape the barrel to find it...
Opposite effect? The issue I brought up isn't about Suzuki, it's about the lack of offensive support Suzuki gets from the rest of the team due to injuries/not being good enough.and it actually might have the opposite effect of what you're hoping. Suzuki is his team's N.1 Center... Cozens has to fight with Tage Thompson and Casey Mittelstadt for TOI and offensive opportunities... Suzuki plays several more minutes per game...
Except for the fact that the Sabres were a lethal offensive team last year while the Habs 2nd leading scorer had 38 points which is pretty much unheard of.I am a fan of facts though
P/60 is one of the worst stats ever. People used it to say that Kotkaniemi was also better than Suzuki and look how that turned out.Did you know for example that Cozens has more Points/60 than Suzuki despite the additional minute on the PP?
Well I can't help you if think being on an elite offensive team compared to one of the worst ones doesn't help with production as much as playing 60 more seconds on a powerplay.It's a factor but yeah, you're right, it doesn't.
Good for Cozens. You're still ignoring a massive piece of context here that you chalk up to me "scrapping the barrel" regarding offensive support. Not to mention that Suzuki has already been a beast in both his playoff runs at that age.Suzuki scored 102 pts in 138 games at the same age which is very similar to what Cozens has done so far (102 pts in 135 games)
The whole board would say that if he wasn't wearing a Habs sweater.I can tell you for sure that Suzuki is a gamer. Good player there, the type that will do what needs to be done to win when it matters.
Cozens I never notice at all when he plays against the Leafs.
I'd easily take Suzuki.
Cozens because he doesn't look like he's 12 years old.
While adding context you're neglecting that Cozens was basically AWOL for 6 weeks while wearing the fish bowl after his I'll advised tilt. He's been much better, and much more involved physically the last month, as lingering affects has finally dissipated
Bringing up the fact that the Sabres have been vastly better than the Habs offensively isn’t scrapping the barrel, it’s bringing up context.
Opposite effect? The issue I brought up isn't about Suzuki, it's about the lack of offensive support Suzuki gets from the rest of the team due to injuries/not being good enough.
Except for the fact that the Sabres were a lethal offensive team last year while the Habs 2nd leading scorer had 38 points which is pretty much unheard of.
P/60 is one of the worst stats ever. People used it to say that Kotkaniemi was also better than Suzuki and look how that turned out.
Well I can't help you if think being on an elite offensive team compared to one of the worst ones doesn't help with production as much as playing 60 more seconds on a powerplay.
Good for Cozens. You're still ignoring a massive piece of context here that you chalk up to me "scrapping the barrel" regarding offensive support. Not to mention that Suzuki has already been a beast in both his playoff runs at that age.
You brought up last year and this season combined, not just this season. Stay consistent with your arguments. Sabres are 11th in GF/GP while the Habs are 28th.Sabres are currently 21st in GF/GP with 2.91, Habs are 28th with 2.74.
The 2nd leading scorer on the team had 38 points which is unheard of, it's not that hard to understand.Suzuki has the advantage of being the go to guy and he receives prime time at ES and PP
Caufield played 46 games last year, Slaf played 39 and wasn't anywhere near as productive as this year considering he was a rookie, and Monahan played 25 games. They all had season-ending injuries early on. As someone who's supposedly a big fan of facts, it's odd that you don't include the fact that they were injured for a significantly long amount of time. Which is why the 2nd leading scorer had 38 points last year for the Habs. It makes a difference when you have to play with the likes of RHP to end the season who isn't good enough to be a quality top 6 forward.I have heard ad nauseam that Cole Caufield was one of the best picks in 2019, is he not great offensive support, also Salfkovsky and Monahan with who he got most of his points.
You also score way more goals like how the Sabres have. Not to mention that when you're the only offensive threat (as per the fact that your 2nd leading scorer ended the season with 38 points), you are who the other team targets to shut down. Cozens never had to face that the same way as the other Sabres lines were also a threat to score.Yes the point is valid but the nuance that you seem to avoid is that in a more offensive team, you might have to share the load with more players. Same thing for Cozens last season, his points came with the same players who had even less experience
Yeah the Habs should diminish that ES+PP time and give it to their 2nd line center Jake Evans instead. Your P/60 stat fails to highlight that last year, Suzuki was the only top 6 center so obviously he's going to play more. This year, even though Monahan was a much better improvement, the center depth after them is practically nonexistent due to the Dach/Dvorak injuries and now with Monahan gone, they have to overplay Suzuki even more.I only used it in the context that Suzuki receives prime ES + PP minutes, P/60 highlights that
Playing for a team that is 11th in GF/GP and doesn't have their second leading scorer have 38 points is the absolute biggest factor that you keep minimizing for no valid reason.I never said it's not a factor, it's more you that decides to ignore the other factors. 1 minute PER GAME more on the PP is CERTAINLY a factor that can help production... being the main offensive guy on a team vs being stuck behind many other guys is also a factor.
You brought up 2022-2023 + 2023-2024, NOT 2023-2024 on its own. Funny how I gotta consider that for Cozens when you consistently fail to consider Suzuki's ridiculous lack of offensive support last year. Not to mention that you're saying Cozens had to share the ice time unlike Suzuki, wich means that Suzuki is in fact facing more difficult competition. You're contradicting yourself badly here.I also already shown you the stat for GF/GP for the 2 teams this year, the difference is not significant. It was significant last season and yes it helped Cozens for his PP pts for example, but for ES, you gotta consider who he played with and against what kind of competition
Maybe start by considering that how a player is injured like how Caufield and Monahan were last year doesn't mean that they suck. It means that they are unable to produce since they aren't playing due to their injury. Or that having your 2nd leading scorer have 38 points is essentially unheard of and very clearly demonstrates how Suzuki got little to no offensive support last year.Listen I can't explain all hockey in just one post.
You probably shouldn't critique someone's reading comprehension when you can't even acknowledge that the Caufield/Slaf/Monahan had season ending injuries last year. Are you going to tell me that I'm scrapping the barrel again or admit that you have zero idea what you are talking about as per your disingenuous "facts"? The fact master has made some very serious errors numerous times now and is in denial about it.I am not ignoring anything, it has been VALIDATED several times in every post. Lack of reading of comprehension on your part or simple denial.
He looks like he's 10...
A Habs player is overrated on HF ? what a shockHabs fans massively overrate Suzuki. He’s a mediocre 5v5 producer who gets a ton of minutes to put up ok totals. He’s a better defensive Bo Horvat, not the 1C they want him to be.
Using career stats is pretty meaningless in a comparison of someone this young. Cozens started in the NHL a year earlier, and is 2 years younger. His age 20 and 21 seasons have roughly the same PPG (0.66) as Suzuki at the same ages (0.65). Meanwhile he outproduced him last year while playing nearly 5 fewer minutes per game.
You brought up last year and this season combined, not just this season. Stay consistent with your arguments. Sabres are 11th in GF/GP while the Habs are 28th.
The 2nd leading scorer on the team had 38 points which is unheard of, it's not that hard to understand.
Caufield played 46 games last year, Slaf played 39 and wasn't anywhere near as productive as this year considering he was a rookie, and Monahan played 25 games. They all had season-ending injuries early on. As someone who's supposedly a big fan of facts, it's odd that you don't include the fact that they were injured for a significantly long amount of time. Which is why the 2nd leading scorer had 38 points last year for the Habs. It makes a difference when you have to play with the likes of RHP to end the season who isn't good enough to be a quality top 6 forward.
Now that the team is way healthier, he's been getting far better linemates and it's no surprise that his production has benefitted from it tremendously. This includes Caufield who has a shooting % well below what he should have and Slaf who despite making massive strides in development is still on pace for 42 points.
You also score way more goals like how the Sabres have. Not to mention that when you're the only offensive threat (as per the fact that your 2nd leading scorer ended the season with 38 points), you are who the other team targets to shut down. Cozens never had to face that the same way as the other Sabres lines were also a threat to score.
Yeah the Habs should diminish that ES+PP time and give it to their 2nd line center Jake Evans instead. Your P/60 stat fails to highlight that last year, Suzuki was the only top 6 center so obviously he's going to play more. This year, even though Monahan was a much better improvement, the center depth after them is practically nonexistent due to the Dach/Dvorak injuries and now with Monahan gone, they have to overplay Suzuki even more.
Playing for a team that is 11th in GF/GP and doesn't have their second leading scorer have 38 points is the absolute biggest factor that you keep minimizing for no valid reason.
You brought up 2022-2023 + 2023-2024, NOT 2023-2024 on its own. Funny how I gotta consider that for Cozens when you consistently fail to consider Suzuki's ridiculous lack of offensive support last year. Not to mention that you're saying Cozens had to share the ice time unlike Suzuki, wich means that Suzuki is in fact facing more difficult competition. You're contradicting yourself badly here.
Maybe start by considering that how a player is injured like how Caufield and Monahan were last year doesn't mean that they suck. It means that they are unable to produce since they aren't playing due to their injury. Or that having your 2nd leading scorer have 38 points is essentially unheard of and very clearly demonstrates how Suzuki got little to no offensive support last year.
You probably shouldn't critique someone's reading comprehension when you can't even acknowledge that the Caufield/Slaf/Monahan had season ending injuries last year. Are you going to tell me that I'm scrapping the barrel again or admit that you have zero idea what you are talking about as per your disingenuous "facts"? The fact master has made some very serious errors numerous times now and is in denial about it.
55pts-33 pts seems to be quite a difference.Sabres are currently 21st in GF/GP with 2.91, Habs are 28th with 2.74. It's not the huge difference you are making it out to be.
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It's literally the opposite %90 of the time. Main board trolls crap on Habs players and end up wrong about their value nearly every single time. Same here, Suzuki is vastly better and the only reason it's up for discussion is because he plays for the Habs.A Habs player is overrated on HF ? what a shock