Line Combos: Dumo or Petts in '22-'23

[Randy Butternubs]

He's injury prone, so he'd certainly fit in well as a Penguin.

No way do we even have close to the assets for this. We don’t have any legit high end blue chip prospects (and if Blomqvist is one at the goalie position, he’s not getting moved now that we moved Clang). And our 1st rounder will be in the 20’s.

There are plenty of other teams who can put together much better offers.

Chychrun is a pipe dream of mine. Also, why is it called a pipe dream? [via Merriam-Webster: from the fantasies brought about by the smoking of opium]

But yeah, a deal for the Pens to get him would likely involve POJ + Blomqvist + Poulin + Kapanen? Then picks to even it out.

 

[Andy99]

Right now I’d take Petts…in fact, Sullivan should promote him to the top line if Dumo is still out Monday because Math-Letang gives me the runs…

 

[jmelm]

Chychrun is a pipe dream of mine. Also, why is it called a pipe dream? [via Merriam-Webster: from the fantasies brought about by the smoking of opium]

But yeah, a deal for the Pens to get him would likely involve POJ + Blomqvist + Poulin + Kapanen? Then picks to even it out.

ARI is pretty deep on LHD in particular. Even if they were to not hang on to Ghost long term, they have Kolyachonok and Moser -- to guys that are of similar build and play a similar kind of game. I'm sure they'll be looking to add some size and physicality on D (I know POJ is 6'2 but he's not thick or physical).

Not sure Kapanen has any series value considering he's arbitration eligible and 1 year away from UFA, to go along with his inconsistent play. I think absolute best case scenario is we get a late 2nd for him, but it may be a 3rd or another player who's struggling and needs a fresh start. So I don't think he brings any value to ARI at all.

I don't think they have as good as G prospect as Blomqvist so that would be intriguing. Not sure if they like Poulin but if they do, it would have to be Poulin + Blomqvist + 1st rounder (mid 20s) and they would absolutely have to be in love with Poulin and Blomqvist for them to want that over what would likely be objectively much stronger offers from other teams.

It's good to have dreams though

Right now I’d take Petts…in fact, Sullivan should promote him to the top line if Dumo is still out Monday because Math-Letang gives me the runs…

100% agree.

 

[ChaosAgent]

It's been a couple months and I'm still dropping Dumo no matter what.

I just don't want to be in a position to offer him an extension. It's a huge mistake waiting to happen.
This is with or without Letang, BTW. Let Jake wear an A next year.

 

[Sidgeni Malkby]

This is a weird conversation :/.

Dumo has been rock solid for years, and because he has a bit of a hiccup (likely injury related), we want to throw him under the bus?

- 30 years old isn't even CLOSE to being old for a D, or over the hill.
- He's clearly a leader out there, and a major stabilizing force that can benefit either Letang, Matheson, or PoJ (assuming he's part of our plans).
- He's big... 6'4" 207lbs doesn't grow on trees.
- He's pretty mobile for he role he plays.

Pettersson hasn't proven that he can consistently replace Dumoulin. Heck he can't replace Dumoulin today.

If it comes down to salary cap issues, I'd rather keep our #2D, then take our chances on a #6 and best day #4D.

 

[Pengu]

Well, I dunno how to feel about Matheson. He's good going forward but an absolute nightmare in his own zone...

 

[Andy99]

This is a weird conversation :/.

Dumo has been rock solid for years, and because he has a bit of a hiccup (likely injury related), we want to throw him under the bus?

- 30 years old isn't even CLOSE to being old for a D, or over the hill.
- He's clearly a leader out there, and a major stabilizing force that can benefit either Letang, Matheson, or PoJ (assuming he's part of our plans).
- He's big... 6'4" 207lbs doesn't grow on trees.
- He's pretty mobile for he role he plays.

Pettersson hasn't proven that he can consistently replace Dumoulin. Heck he can't replace Dumoulin today.

If it comes down to salary cap issues, I'd rather keep our #2D, then take our chances on a #6 and best day #4D.

Even before this latest injury, he looked like he had lost his first step and because his skating couldnt get him in position anymore, he was taking chances that he had never taken before and was getting beat a lot…given the numerous injuries, I wouldn’t want the Pens to take a chance that he’s done. If they can get a first for him, I’d move him this summer or during the season. I don’t want to be the one giving him his next contract

 

[ChaosAgent]

This is a weird conversation :/.

Dumo has been rock solid for years, and because he has a bit of a hiccup (likely injury related), we want to throw him under the bus?

- 30 years old isn't even CLOSE to being old for a D, or over the hill.
- He's clearly a leader out there, and a major stabilizing force that can benefit either Letang, Matheson, or PoJ (assuming he's part of our plans).
- He's big... 6'4" 207lbs doesn't grow on trees.
- He's pretty mobile for he role he plays.

Pettersson hasn't proven that he can consistently replace Dumoulin. Heck he can't replace Dumoulin today.

If it comes down to salary cap issues, I'd rather keep our #2D, then take our chances on a #6 and best day #4D.

Dumo has been steadily regressing since COVID.

 

[eXile3]

This is a weird conversation :/.

Dumo has been rock solid for years, and because he has a bit of a hiccup (likely injury related), we want to throw him under the bus?

- 30 years old isn't even CLOSE to being old for a D, or over the hill.
- He's clearly a leader out there, and a major stabilizing force that can benefit either Letang, Matheson, or PoJ (assuming he's part of our plans).
- He's big... 6'4" 207lbs doesn't grow on trees.
- He's pretty mobile for he role he plays.

Pettersson hasn't proven that he can consistently replace Dumoulin. Heck he can't replace Dumoulin today.

If it comes down to salary cap issues, I'd rather keep our #2D, then take our chances on a #6 and best day #4D.

It's actually pretty much spot on when most players see a substantial decline. There are outliers of course but hoping Dumolin is one of them is a pretty far reach. In fact I believe the decline is more acute in defensive defenseman. Also, not sure if you've watched him recently but mobile he is not.

“Most players hit their peak age by age 24 or 25 then decline gradually until age 30, at which point their performance can begin to tumble more noticeably with the risk of absolute collapse by age 34 or 35.”

Stat Shot: The Ultimate Guide to Hockey Analytics

 

[Sidgeni Malkby]

Even before this latest injury, he looked like he had lost his first step and because his skating couldnt get him in position anymore, he was taking chances that he had never taken before and was getting beat a lot…given the numerous injuries, I wouldn’t want the Pens to take a chance that he’s done. If they can get a first for him, I’d move him this summer or during the season. I don’t want to be the one giving him his next contract

You sure it isn't due to some underlying injury?

If someone gives us a killer offer, then of course you go for it. If we are indeed in rebuild mode, then yeah also, you go for it.

I'm not in love with Dumo, but we have nobody to replace him. As the thread is Dumo vs Petts, even a 1 step down Dumo is a solid #4 and ahead of Petts.

I originally thought Friedman looked decent and may replace Petts, but he has been underwhelming the past few games.

 

[ChaosAgent]

You sure it isn't due to some underlying injury?

If someone gives us a killer offer, then of course you go for it. If we are indeed in rebuild mode, then yeah also, you go for it.

I'm not in love with Dumo, but we have nobody to replace him. As the thread is Dumo vs Petts, even a 1 step down Dumo is a solid #4 and ahead of Petts.

I originally thought Friedman looked decent and may replace Petts, but he has been underwhelming the past few games.

Dumo is always going to have underlying injuries. Not sure how that is an excuse. He isn't some picture of health. Why would we think he would be going forward?

 

[Andy99]

You sure it isn't due to some underlying injury?

If someone gives us a killer offer, then of course you go for it. If we are indeed in rebuild mode, then yeah also, you go for it.

I'm not in love with Dumo, but we have nobody to replace him. As the thread is Dumo vs Petts, even a 1 step down Dumo is a solid #4 and ahead of Petts.

I originally thought Friedman looked decent and may replace Petts, but he has been underwhelming the past few games.

It might be but then he must have had it all year because he’s been ass for most of the season…this is also his third or fourth LBI in the last three season…he’s had ankle or foot problems for awhile…move him

 

[Bowski]

Dumo. Serviceable, and still has very good trade value in a "we need to get rid of him" scenario if the Pens' wheels completely fall off.

Petts has very little value for his "meh" game.
Wouldn't be surprised if Hextall already had a "we need to get rid of him" moment with him, and got diddly squat interest.

 

[MayorofWBS]

Get rid of Dumo - It's time to start the redo on the defense. I think there will be offseason movement to replace Dumo in a trade (not Chychrun though...LOL).

Dumping Dumo should be the start of total rebuild of the defense which will take multiple years to complete. We need to invest some first and second round draft capital on the position.

 

[The Old Master]

Dumping Dumo should be the start of total rebuild of the defense which will take multiple years to complete. We need to invest some first and second round draft capital on the position.

when a guy in wbs is playing better than more than one of our de-men and is cheeper. that rebuild might not take as long as you might think

 

[Gurglesons]

You sure it isn't due to some underlying injury?

If someone gives us a killer offer, then of course you go for it. If we are indeed in rebuild mode, then yeah also, you go for it.

I'm not in love with Dumo, but we have nobody to replace him. As the thread is Dumo vs Petts, even a 1 step down Dumo is a solid #4 and ahead of Petts.

I originally thought Friedman looked decent and may replace Petts, but he has been underwhelming the past few games.

If we are judging players off the past few games, Dumo should retire.

I get the idea of why we should keep him, but he’s toast and we can get a return for him that we can probably turn into a younger version of him very easily. I’d try and get Hague or Whitecloud out of Vegas, maybe Middleton out of Minnesota, or even an older guy like Gio or Edler..

 

[bambamcam4ever]

This is a weird conversation :/.

Dumo has been rock solid for years, and because he has a bit of a hiccup (likely injury related), we want to throw him under the bus?

- 30 years old isn't even CLOSE to being old for a D, or over the hill.
- He's clearly a leader out there, and a major stabilizing force that can benefit either Letang, Matheson, or PoJ (assuming he's part of our plans).
- He's big... 6'4" 207lbs doesn't grow on trees.
- He's pretty mobile for he role he plays.

Pettersson hasn't proven that he can consistently replace Dumoulin. Heck he can't replace Dumoulin today.

If it comes down to salary cap issues, I'd rather keep our #2D, then take our chances on a #6 and best day #4D.

How many strictly defensive D who provide no offense maintained being an effective player into their thirties?

Dumo will be 31 next season: there were 68 Dmen 31 or older this year, the only two true defensive Dmen who averaged 20 minutes per game were David Savard and Chris Tanev, and Tanev is a much better player transitioning the puck. Dumoulin will turn into Vlasic soon, we don't want to be the ones holding the explosive when the timer runs out.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Well, I dunno how to feel about Matheson. He's good going forward but an absolute nightmare in his own zone...

Math is an absolute nightmare WHEN FACING #1 lines.
He's the perfect 2nd pair Dman. Anything beyond that responsibility he's going to struggle.

 

[Sidgeni Malkby]

Dumo. Serviceable, and still has very good trade value in a "we need to get rid of him" scenario if the Pens' wheels completely fall off.

Petts has very little value for his "meh" game.
Wouldn't be surprised if Hextall already had a "we need to get rid of him" moment with him, and got diddly squat interest.

Petts isn't anything special. His biggest issue is he isn't physically built to become something special in a shutdown D role, and his O instincts/abilities suck for the most part.

Unless he puts on 30lbs of muscle or something. He's not bad, but not 4M good.

 

[Pens1566]

Dumo just can't skate anymore. We need to take the exit while we can.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

You sure it isn't due to some underlying injury?

If someone gives us a killer offer, then of course you go for it. If we are indeed in rebuild mode, then yeah also, you go for it.

I'm not in love with Dumo, but we have nobody to replace him. As the thread is Dumo vs Petts, even a 1 step down Dumo is a solid #4 and ahead of Petts.

I originally thought Friedman looked decent and may replace Petts, but he has been underwhelming the past few games.

Well the question WAS : Is Friedman better than Petts? For this playoff series that answer is no

Now the question is: Friedman better than Dumo. And the way Friedman looked the past 2 games the answer is no

If Dumo goes you don't necessarily need a true #2 Dman. You just need someone who can play well w/ Letang (assume he resigns)

 

[Sidgeni Malkby]

Well the question WAS : Is Friedman better than Petts? For this playoff series that answer is no

Now the question is: Friedman better than Dumo. And the way Friedman looked the past 2 games the answer is no

If Dumo goes you don't necessarily need a true #2 Dman. You just need someone who can play well w/ Letang (assume he resigns)

That’s an interesting take. Do we even need a shutdown D?

My memory serves me that our PK was significantly better with Dumo, but that isn’t enough to justify his presence.

The only want to know is to try other D with Letang. The Matheson Letang pairing looked good over the regular season but not so great in the playoffs.

I don’t think Friedman/Petts can keep up with Letang.

Ultimately we do need a shutdown D, even if it’s a #4 or #6 + someone to play with Letang. Easier said than done IMO.

 

[ChaosAgent]

That’s an interesting take. Do we even need a shutdown D?

My memory serves me that our PK was significantly better with Dumo, but that isn’t enough to justify his presence.

The only want to know is to try other D with Letang. The Matheson Letang pairing looked good over the regular season but not so great in the playoffs.

I don’t think Friedman/Petts can keep up with Letang.

Ultimately we do need a shutdown D, even if it’s a #4 or #6 + someone to play with Letang. Easier said than done IMO.

Not sure if you are being facetious. Dumo has not been a shutdown D at all. In fact he has been making 1-2 epic brain farts per game that are feeding premium chances to our opponents.

 

[Gurglesons]

That’s an interesting take. Do we even need a shutdown D?

My memory serves me that our PK was significantly better with Dumo, but that isn’t enough to justify his presence.

The only want to know is to try other D with Letang. The Matheson Letang pairing looked good over the regular season but not so great in the playoffs.

I don’t think Friedman/Petts can keep up with Letang.

Ultimately we do need a shutdown D, even if it’s a #4 or #6 + someone to play with Letang. Easier said than done IMO.

Marino has been acting as our shut down D for two years now. If he keeps up his performance this playoffs moving forward we don’t really need one that is above a # 3/4.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

I think it's time for Hextall and company to see what type of return a guy like Dumo can bring back. I think we should move him.