Speculation: Does Shanahan have any say in how this team is being run?

[deprw]

While.i dont have anything particular dislike of Lou, i do find it strange how much on a pedestal by some folks. He hasnt had any sustained success in thr salary cap era NHL other than that flukey Devils cup run.

Thing that bothers me most is drafting during his Devils tenure. New Jersey has wasted tons and tons of draft picks and their development have been atrocious, but still Lou is standing on some kind of pedestal. What have been most important venue to acquire new talent in salary cap NHL? Drafting.

He couldn't fix that and continued with David Conte like forever, even when there was no results.

This board is Hockey Future and we talk about draft picks and prospects. We overvalue those assets and complain before, during and after the draft that we didn't have enough draft picks and how we picked wrong players.

Then we have people here that put Lou Lamoriello on pedestal, because of his leadership and skills. Even though he couldn't fix Devils drafting and basically got canned because of that.

I'm always grateful that Shanahan hired Lamoriello, because he really changed our culture and brought important values, but he did his job and it was time to move on. In perfect world he would have got one more year and Dubas would have started after that, but I think it's fair that Dubas has to maneuver around his own contracts (Nylander, Matthews, Marner). Lamoriello might have been able to squeeze few important dollars out of our young core. Might have been able. Maybe.

 

[ACC1224]

While.i dont have anything particular dislike of Lou, i do find it strange how much on a pedestal by some folks. He hasnt had any sustained success in thr salary cap era NHL other than that flukey Devils cup run.

And yes he made some good moves while GM here, but claims of him having this master plan seem pretty dubious - particularly since his plan to remain the Leafs D core was Hainsey and Zaitsev......

Maybe a few do, it hardly seems wide spread.
There will also be a few that are 'out there' a bit on anything, mostly looking for attention.

 

[The CyNick]

So what are your sources there, Nick? Or are you just bullshitting (again)?

What are these other times I have BS'd about something?

You want names? How about I put it this way, do you think it's likely or unlikely Lou had a plan to deal with all three young stars?

 

[The CyNick]

The guys who played Brown higher in the line up than Marner.

The guys who signed Marleau to an awful contract that set us back a year prospect wise.

The guys who haven't won anything since their brand of hockey was outlawed.

The guys who are excited to give players like Zaitsev long term deals.

How many combined playoff series wins did they have while they had 3 stars on ELCs?

ZERO.

Any lineup decisions clearly were successful given the fact that Lou had more success with the Leafs than Dubas had. He's also had more success with another team over two seasons vs Dubas with the Leafs.

Marleau was a perfect deal. Ask Marner and Matthews about the positive impact he had on their game. The prospect loss was 100% on Dubas. He had multiple options. First and foremost would have been to negotiate better deals with the big three. This alone would have saved the money to keep Marleau the third year. Second would have been to turn one of AJ or KK into an asset(s) to save some money. He failed to do those things, and then panicked and took the first deal on the table for Patty.

Guys like Lou and Babs understand you need balance. You need guys to play roles. You need a Brown to play with jam on a line, you need Marleau to set an example for young players, you need a Polak to be a physical presence. Dubas thinks you just need a bunch of fast waterbugs to win. So far that's proven to be wrong.

Lou is up on Dubas on playoff rounds last season. What always makes me laugh is that if Dubas had taken the TERRIBLE New York Islanders where Lou took them in ONE SUMMER guys like you would be on here belly aching saying "see he's a genius, look how quickly he turned around that tire fire in Long Island, we should have kept him". Meanwhile, Dubas takes our centre depth and craps it away for a terrible D man that didn't address a team need. He butchered the big contracts. He made a mess of the goalie situation, he burned draft picks like they were kindling. All the while turning us into a far less dangerous and less promising team.

All the while Shammy sits back and watches Rome burn and tries to blend in to the wallpaper so nobody notices him to hold him accountable for the mess he created.

 

[Merrrlin]

Any lineup decisions clearly were successful given the fact that Lou had more success with the Leafs than Dubas had. He's also had more success with another team over two seasons vs Dubas with the Leafs.

Marleau was a perfect deal. Ask Marner and Matthews about the positive impact he had on their game. The prospect loss was 100% on Dubas. He had multiple options. First and foremost would have been to negotiate better deals with the big three. This alone would have saved the money to keep Marleau the third year. Second would have been to turn one of AJ or KK into an asset(s) to save some money. He failed to do those things, and then panicked and took the first deal on the table for Patty.

Guys like Lou and Babs understand you need balance. You need guys to play roles. You need a Brown to play with jam on a line, you need Marleau to set an example for young players, you need a Polak to be a physical presence. Dubas thinks you just need a bunch of fast waterbugs to win. So far that's proven to be wrong.

Lou is up on Dubas on playoff rounds last season. What always makes me laugh is that if Dubas had taken the TERRIBLE New York Islanders where Lou took them in ONE SUMMER guys like you would be on here belly aching saying "see he's a genius, look how quickly he turned around that tire fire in Long Island, we should have kept him". Meanwhile, Dubas takes our centre depth and craps it away for a terrible D man that didn't address a team need. He butchered the big contracts. He made a mess of the goalie situation, he burned draft picks like they were kindling. All the while turning us into a far less dangerous and less promising team.

All the while Shammy sits back and watches Rome burn and tries to blend in to the wallpaper so nobody notices him to hold him accountable for the mess he created.

Lou is up on Dubas because Lou had the easiest playoff path of any team. You are kidding yourself if you think the team that beat the team that swept the Isles wouldn't have also beaten the Isle.

Marleau was the perfect deal? lol that level of trolling is good enough for a certain list.

 

[Merrrlin]

What are these other times I have BS'd about something?

You want names? How about I put it this way, do you think it's likely or unlikely Lou had a plan to deal with all three young stars?

I think it's very likely you are making things up.

 

[meefer]

What are these other times I have BS'd about something?

You want names? How about I put it this way, do you think it's likely or unlikely Lou had a plan to deal with all three young stars?

If we ignore the 'again' comment, is it not reasonable for you to present the names of sources you say talked with Lou and his plan? "How about I put it this way..." and reversing the question isn't really addressing the question, it's avoiding it.

 

[ShaneFalco]

While.i dont have anything particular dislike of Lou, i do find it strange how much on a pedestal by some folks. He hasnt had any sustained success in thr salary cap era NHL other than that flukey Devils cup run.

And yes he made some good moves while GM here, but claims of him having this master plan seem pretty dubious - particularly since his plan to remain the Leafs D core was Hainsey and Zaitsev......

It is mind boggling. But it seems if you're old and have been in the league a long time, you're better than any new guy.

 

[Menzinger]

It is mind boggling. But it seems if you're old and have been in the league a long time, you're better than any new guy.

And dont get me wrong. I respect the guys career.

I just dont see any relevance that what a guy did 20 years ago on another team has to moves being made right now ect

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[nuck]

Shanny and Dubie likely have 2 more playoffs to decide their futures. If they make playoffs and are gone round 1 for next 2 years then see ya later is my guess. Toronto needs to be a place where you win or you are gone.

Dubas is on a different timetable from Shanny. He will go under the bus first , and Keefe as well if they don't show signs of moving the club forward. KD is signed for 3 playoff runs. They likely won't keep him as a lame duck GM through the final year so I agree two years has to be his maximum shelf life as a mediocre GM. I'm just not sure how little success is enough. Winning a round and then falling in an epic 7 game second series isn't deep into the playoffs but it is an improvement on the last hundred years. That may be enough to generate talk about an extension but maybe not enough to save him, and then there is the x factor of who else is available following an early exit. Does Shanny have Pat Verbeek pajamas at home?

We can't blame Babcock if they get walked in the playoff this year so does that mean Shanny puts his foot down and Keefe is out and Gallant is in? Shanny will be tied to the fortunes of his next GM hire so he has that coin to spend, plus is signed through 24-25. He would have to do something terminally stupid like extend KD after two more first round exits and then have the club go out in the first round of year three.

This year might be a free pass for Leaf management. The league is so far removed from the regular season it seems like there could be a lot of random playoff outcomes so all they need is to look somewhat better next playoff and that will keep the wolves away. Conversely if they surprise and have a big playoff this year the good will might carry over to next season for them, even if 20-21 isn't as successful.

Or Shanny might have a loaded gun ready for Dubas today but it seems a little unlikely that heads would roll based on the results of what is going to be the most atypical playoff in history.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Dubas is on a different timetable from Shanny. He will go under the bus first , and Keefe as well if they don't show signs of moving the club forward. KD is signed for 3 playoff runs. They likely won't keep him as a lame duck GM through the final year so I agree two years has to be his maximum shelf life as a mediocre GM. I'm just not sure how little success is enough. Winning a round and then falling in an epic 7 game second series isn't deep into the playoffs but it is an improvement on the last hundred years. That may be enough to generate talk about an extension but maybe not enough to save him, and then there is the x factor of who else is available following an early exit. Does Shanny have Pat Verbeek pajamas at home?

We can't blame Babcock if they get walked in the playoff this year so does that mean Shanny puts his foot down and Keefe is out and Gallant is in? Shanny will be tied to the fortunes of his next GM hire so he has that coin to spend, plus is signed through 24-25. He would have to do something terminally stupid like extend KD after two more first round exits and then have the club go out in the first round of year three.

This year might be a free pass for Leaf management. The league is so far removed from the regular season it seems like there could be a lot of random playoff outcomes so all they need is to look somewhat better next playoff and that will keep the wolves away. Conversely if they surprise and have a big playoff this year the good will might carry over to next season for them, even if 20-21 isn't as successful.

Or Shanny might have a loaded gun ready for Dubas today but it seems a little unlikely that heads would roll based on the results of what is going to be the most atypical playoff in history.

Agreed COVID has thrown a wrench in things for sure ... but best for everyone if we can get past Columbus and then win at least 1 round this year whoever it is ... i don't even care if it is a Philli win who cares a win is a win

 

[hockeywiz542]

"Brendan Shanahan" - SmartLess podcast

Brendan Shanahan skates on in for this barnburner of an episode. “Shanny” is a former pro ice hockey player and Hall of Famer who currently serves as the President of the Toronto Maple Leafs. Having won the three most prominent team titles in ice hockey (an Olympic gold medal, a World Championship, and a Stanley Cup) he is a member of the elite “Triple Gold Club.” He’s also a really cool dude.