GDT: Devils @ Maple Leafs, 7:00 PM

[Unknown Caller]

Agree. @StevenToddIves has completely sold me on Gauthier.

I don’t want any part of Gauthier with players like Kemell on the board. Like Fitz said, he’s instructing his scouts to go find him a star. Cutter Gauthier just isn’t turning into a star. He can certainly be a nice complementary piece, but the Devils will go find that outside of a top 10 pick.

 

[Buck Dancer]

^^^ Not to turn this conversation into the draft but I think this MIGHT be the draft where we trade down, if we end up with the #1 (or #2) pick.

That would make absolutely no sense at all since two of our biggest weaknesses are available at pick #2 and #3.

When looking where we're at in the standings, we better be picking top #5 in order to get one of Nemec, Jiricek or Slafkovsky.

I don't see us finishing in the bottom #10 next year if we can make the tweeks we all want us to make this summer, so this is the time for us to get another prime pick since we suck and there's about 18 games left.

If we're not in a place to pick any of those guys, it's Cutter Gauthier or I'm looking to move the pick for immediate help for a bonafide stud by adding other assets. I honestly believe that this year is the last year we'll be looking at the draft thread come November, December, etc. I think we'll be looking at the standings come February, March and April and we'll be buyers instead of sellers at the deadline.

 

[Unknown Caller]

That would make absolutely no sense at all since two of our biggest weaknesses are available at pick #2 and #3.

When looking where we're at in the standings, we better be picking top #5 in order to get one of Nemec, Jiricek or Slafkovsky.

I don't see us finishing in the bottom #10 next year if we can make the tweeks we all want us to make this summer, so this is the time for us to get another prime pick since we suck and there's about 18 games left.

If we're not in a place to pick any of those guys, it's Cutter Gauthier or I'm looking to move the pick for immediate help for a bonafide stud by adding other assets. I honestly believe that this year is the last year we'll be looking at the draft thread come November, December, etc. I think we'll be looking at the standings come February, March and April and we'll be buyers instead of sellers at the deadline.

As I posted above, there’s a ton of people overlooking Joakim Kemell here. He’s an incredibly skilled winger and his production to date is comparable to players like Pastrnak, Ovechkin, Naslund and Laine. The Devils would be insane to pass on him if he falls into their lap (if Slafkovsky and Nemec are off the board).

And I don’t have time for the argument that the Devils are already skilled and need to add grit and size. If Tampa followed that logic, they would never have Point.

 

[Buck Dancer]

I don’t want any part of Gauthier with players like Kemell on the board. Like Fitz said, he’s instructing his scouts to go find him a star. Cutter Gauthier just isn’t turning into a star. He can certainly be a nice complementary piece, but the Devils will go find that outside of a top 10 pick.

Adding a guy in the mold of a Matthew/Brady Tkatchuk or even Tom Wilson (without the cheap shots), that would make Jack Hughes or Nico Hischier even more impactful, I'm on board.

This isn't just drafting for need by adding a big physical winger, it's drafting a guy that is also on par to be one of the best goal scorers in the draft. His intangibles are through the roof and would be the difference maker, for me, between taking him or a diminutive winger who can snipe pucks a little better but doesn't move the needle anywhere else.

 

[Buck Dancer]

As I posted above, there’s a ton of people overlooking Joakim Kemell here. He’s an incredibly skilled winger and his production to date is comparable to players like Pastrnak, Ovechkin, Naslund and Laine. The Devils would be insane to pass on him if he falls into their lap (if Slafkovsky and Nemec are off the board).

And I don’t have time for the argument that the Devils are already skilled and need to add grit and size. If Tampa followed that logic, they would never have Point.

Tampa took Brayden Point AFTER Tony DeAngelo, Dominik Masin and Jonathan MacLeod, in round #3.

If Yzermand and his crew knew that point was going to be the player he turned out to be, he would've been picked in round #1... not 79th overall.

Calling Cutter Gauthier just a big body physical winger is a lazy assessment of what he does on the ice and what he will turn out to be, which is exactly what we need to think about. Projecting 2 to 4 years down the line is why we pick the kids we pick, not what they're doing right this second.

 

[Unknown Caller]

Adding a guy in the mold of a Matthew/Brady Tkatchuk or even Tom Wilson (without the cheap shots), that would make Jack Hughes or Nico Hischier even more impactful, I'm on board.

This isn't just drafting for need by adding a big physical winger, it's drafting a guy that is also on par to be one of the best goal scorers in the draft. His intangibles are through the roof and would be the difference maker, for me, between taking him or a diminutive winger who can snipe pucks a little better but doesn't move the needle anywhere else.

I don’t know who said that Cutter Gauthier is on board with guys like Slafkovsky and Kemell in terms of scoring, but it isn’t remotely true. The Devils can go get themselves a big physical winger elsewhere. Gauthier’s production also isn’t in the same stratosphere as Matthew Tkachuk’s.

 

[Unknown Caller]

Tampa took Brayden Point AFTER Tony DeAngelo, Dominik Masin and Jonathan MacLeod, in round #3.

If Yzermand and his crew knew that point was going to be the player he turned out to be, he would've been picked in round #1... not 79th overall.

Calling Cutter Gauthier just a big body physical winger is a lazy assessment of what he does on the ice and what he will turn out to be, which is exactly what we need to think about. Projecting 2 to 4 years down the line is why we pick the kids we pick, not what they're doing right this second.

Yeah but those who know the importance of production as a predictive factor all knew that Point should go high in the first round. It’s not a lazy assessment to call out Cutter Gauthier’s upside. It’s lazy to compare him to someone like Matthew Tkachuk when they are on entirely different planets as prospects.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

I really don’t buy picking anyone because you think they’re “in the mold” of someone. BPA always with top picks. Although this team is in a situation where a Schneider type trade would make some sense if something is available (Hellebuyck if they’re doing a full tear down? Idk).

 

[Buck Dancer]

I don’t know who said that Cutter Gauthier is on board with guys like Slafkovsky and Kemell in terms of scoring, but it isn’t remotely true. The Devils can go get themselves a big physical winger elsewhere. Gauthier’s production also isn’t in the same stratosphere as Matthew Tkachuk’s.

From all the research I did, Slafkovsky is not labeled to be a scorer at all and one of the knocks he has is actually his shot. He did score 7 goals in the Olympics but his main quality is his vision more so than his shot.

Gauthier is the main goal scorer of his team when he's not being utilized as a point producer and has been bounced up and down the lineup to kick start lines that are snoozing on the job. I understand the fact that we need to draft the best available player but we also have to take into consideration what we have on our roster moving forward and us drafting Holtz over someone like Lundell probably had everything to do with the fact that we already had Jack and Nico and we were lacking a pure sniper to pair alongside one of our two promising centers.

The lack of interior play is disturbing and when the playoffs will roll around, someone in the mold of a Tkatchuk/Wilson will come in handy in more ways than one. Nico scored his goal last night by jamming away in the crease and I can't remember the last time we scored a goal like that. That's the main way of scoring goals during the playoffs and having a big body to worry about down low opens up all kinds of space everywhere else in the offensive zone. Hamilton won't have someone breathing down his neck and our main guys will be able to add a fraction of a second, which is huge at that level.

 

[Buck Dancer]

Yeah but those who know the importance of production as a predictive factor all knew that Point should go high in the first round. It’s not a lazy assessment to call out Cutter Gauthier’s upside. It’s lazy to compare him to someone like Matthew Tkachuk when they are on entirely different planets as prospects.

So comparing a guy that went in the 3rd round where teams passed him up as often as 3X is legit but a kid who's labeled to go in the middle of the 1st, at worst, is flawed when comparing him to a guy that went 6th overall?

How does that make any sense?

 

[Blackjack]

Goddamn has Byron Bader ever poisoned the prospect discussion. Imagine putting Kemell in the same sentence as Ovechkin. That should tell you how useful his model is right there.

 

[Buck Dancer]

I really don’t buy picking anyone because you think they’re “in the mold” of someone. BPA always with top picks. Although this team is in a situation where a Schneider type trade would make some sense if something is available (Hellebuyck if they’re doing a full tear down? Idk).

Draft comparisions are made litteraly every year. The first thing you see when a kid get's drafted is "he's a potential..." or when someone wants a better idea of a prospect, the first question is "who does he play like?".

We need a kid like Gauthier more so than a kid like Kemmel but that's just me. If we want to be the Toronto Maple Leafs/Edmonton Oilers, than yeah... going with offensive skills only will only bring you so far. Again, talking like Gauthier is the new version of Mike Rupp is, well, wrong.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

We don’t even know what the composition of the roster looks like in 2-3 years when the player we select is ready to come up. I don’t know enough about any of these players to have an opinion, but I do know you shouldn’t draft for what your immediate needs are.

 

[Eggtimer]

If they do win the lottery, 100% they should look to move down.

If there ever was a situation to trade down , this would be it .

 

[Eggtimer]

We don’t even know what the composition of the roster looks like in 2-3 years when the player we select is ready to come up. I don’t know enough about any of these players to have an opinion, but I do know you shouldn’t draft for what your immediate needs are.

Normally I think no way you draft off of needs and take BPA , however , I think we are at a point in the rebuild where you look a little more into need that usual. I’m not saying taking a need that is ranked a shit ton behind the percieved BPA , but if it’s a player you have ranked a couple spots within your current pick , then I’d go need.If the gap between BPA and a need is not significant , then go need instead of BPA

 

[My3Sons]

I don’t know that I would say he’s playing behind a mediocre team. The Devils are a top 15 team in xGF%, a top 3 team in HDCF% and a top 10 team in GF. They’re second to last in the NHL in SV%, so the reason the results are “mediocre” is because of the goaltending, not the rest of the team that the goalie is playing behind.

Daws has been a serviceable goalie behind a good on-ice team. That’s at least promising for a young goalie.

If you look at Bernier, MBW, and Daws' results this season each of them are a .500 goalie in win percentage and each are around 90% save percentage. That's three goalies with very similar results. I imagine we can all have different interpretations of "mediocre". To me an NHL 500 team is mediocre, but it's not bad. I think NJ has to go from bad to mediocre (call it "meh" if you prefer) and from there they can start improving to good and hopefully very good and then great or excellent. Fitz noted they need improvement in team defense and that impacts the goalies on some level. I am excited for Daws' potential and future. You have to imagine he's at least 10% better in the next couple of years. Maybe that gets him to a .910 goalie. Then if he can add another roughly 10% at his best he's right where you want a starting goalie to be. It's a long road to hoe and I hope they aren't counting on him achieving this without help and patience. No way I'm asking him to be anything more than a callup next season. I'd hope one of Bernier or MBW plays along side an established goalie heading into next season.

 

[MartyOwns]

What? No it isn't. It is not critical to draft top 5 at all this year.

to get a potentially decent player? it’s not. to get a blue chip prospect in an area of need? yes it is.

 

[Camille the Eel]

Ha this conversation is now unofficially about the draft

 

[Unknown Caller]

Goddamn has Byron Bader ever poisoned the prospect discussion. Imagine putting Kemell in the same sentence as Ovechkin. That should tell you how useful his model is right there.

Nobody said Kemell is going to be Ovechkin, just that they have comparable production as prospects. If anyone thought Kemell would be Ovechkin they would be sprinting to the podium to take him 1st overall, not discussing him around 5th-7th overall in a draft year without an elite prospect.

People who write off the predictive nature of pre-draft production are just as annoying as those who solely follow Bader. It very clearly has demonstrated value of indicating which prospects will be elite producers at the NHL level (mainly for forwards, it has a much weaker correlation for defensemen).

With that said, it would be incredibly shortsighted to draft some like Cutter Gauthier just because the Devils roster is perceived to need "interior players". He has limited offensive upside compared to others in his range. Given that Fitz literally said this week that he's directing his scouts to go find him a star, I don't think Cutter Gauthier is going to be the pick.

Plus you can go draft a comparable player to Cutter Gauthier in the second or third round if you're that enamored with drafting a big boy with a little scoring pop.

 

[My3Sons]

Nobody said Kemell is going to be Ovechkin, just that they have comparable production as prospects. If anyone thought Kemell would be Ovechkin they would be sprinting to the podium to take him 1st overall, not discussing him around 5th-7th overall in a draft year without an elite prospect.

People who write off the predictive nature of pre-draft production are just as annoying as those who solely follow Bader. It very clearly has demonstrated value of indicating which prospects will be elite producers at the NHL level (mainly for forwards, it has a much weaker correlation for defensemen).

With that said, it would be incredibly shortsighted to draft some like Cutter Gauthier just because the Devils roster is perceived to need "interior players". He has limited offensive upside compared to others in his range. Given that Fitz literally said this week that he's directing his scouts to go find him a star, I don't think Cutter Gauthier is going to be the pick.

Plus you can go draft a comparable player to Cutter Gauthier in the second or third round if you're that enamored with drafting a big boy with a little scoring pop.

His stats are lopsided but his goal scoring numbers are really good. I imagine he requires an eye test.

 

[Blackjack]

Nobody said Kemell is going to be Ovechkin, just that they have comparable production as prospects. If anyone thought Kemell would be Ovechkin they would be sprinting to the podium to take him 1st overall, not discussing him around 5th-7th overall in a draft year without an elite prospect.

People who write off the predictive nature of pre-draft production are just as annoying as those who solely follow Bader. It very clearly has demonstrated value of indicating which prospects will be elite producers at the NHL level (mainly for forwards, it has a much weaker correlation for defensemen).

With that said, it would be incredibly shortsighted to draft some like Cutter Gauthier just because the Devils roster is perceived to need "interior players". He has limited offensive upside compared to others in his range. Given that Fitz literally said this week that he's directing his scouts to go find him a star, I don't think Cutter Gauthier is going to be the pick.

Saying that Bader is an utter charlatan is not the same thing as dismissing the importance of pre-draft offensive production. But while we're on the subject, Gauthier is producing more than Zacha did in his draft year, and far more than Tom Wilson did.

Seems silly to make some imaginary distinction between "star" and "supporting player" and then decide that you know who will be which.

 

[Eggtimer]

Sorry for bring up Cutter lol. I was more trying to say that if Jiricek Slafkovsky Nemec are gone , then mah e entertain the idea of trading down , acquire more assets , and still be in a position to take a plaher we have a need for .

 

[Buck Dancer]

Nobody said Kemell is going to be Ovechkin, just that they have comparable production as prospects. If anyone thought Kemell would be Ovechkin they would be sprinting to the podium to take him 1st overall, not discussing him around 5th-7th overall in a draft year without an elite prospect.

People who write off the predictive nature of pre-draft production are just as annoying as those who solely follow Bader. It very clearly has demonstrated value of indicating which prospects will be elite producers at the NHL level (mainly for forwards, it has a much weaker correlation for defensemen).

With that said, it would be incredibly shortsighted to draft some like Cutter Gauthier just because the Devils roster is perceived to need "interior players". He has limited offensive upside compared to others in his range. Given that Fitz literally said this week that he's directing his scouts to go find him a star, I don't think Cutter Gauthier is going to be the pick.

Plus you can go draft a comparable player to Cutter Gauthier in the second or third round if you're that enamored with drafting a big boy with a little scoring pop.

The kid has 30 goals in 42 games, while playing mostly up and down their lineup. One can just imagine what #'s he would have if he was a lock on the top line.

He is just getting better and better and better. Tom Wilson got picked 16th overall by the Caps and everyone would absolutely love to have someone like him ridding shotgun alonside their star player on the top line. I think Gauthier would bring the same type of element Wilson does to the Caps and Gauthier has a better ceiling in terms of goal scoring.

 

[glenwo2]

Meanwhile, the Devils lost to the Laffs.

So what else is on TV? *click*

 

[Guttersniped]

Daws played 4 years for my home town team (OHL Guelph Storm) .... how's he looked so far for a rookie goalie in the NHL? In Guelph he had no quit, I'm rooting for him ....his save % doesn't look great so far ... is it a reflection of him or your defense/defensive system? Give him time and I think you'll find he can learn an adapt, sure did in his time in the OHL.

He’s been great considering he definitely should not be playing in the NHL. He’s a rookie with very little pro experience and only played 10 games last season in the DEL league after the OHL league was canceled, he should be in the AHL. Both our starters have long term injuries, so we need him.

And he’s getting leaned on a lot because we’re have two other healthy goalies in entire system right now and our coach doesn’t trust the scrub we picked up for Future Considerations. (The other healthy AHL goalie is currently playing almost all the AHL games.) He’s played both games in two b2b already.

He’s a very poised kid, his game has some holes, but he’s just getting used to NHL grade shooters. I wouldn’t sweat his numbers two much. He’s a 21 year old rookie (and he turned 21 in December) , this is a promising start he can build on.