Detroit Red Wings #10 Prospect 14-15

[Brandel*]

You can make a good case for both.

It's not that they're underrated by us really, maybe we perceive it that way because we have so many good prospects right now but honestly our top 10 is just awesome

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Isn't it easier to get higher points in the OHL compared to USDP (what is this really, a developement team with the best americans in each birthyear sort of? playing against what teams?)

In their draft year they play a combination of USHL teams and colleges. Then they usually show up and walk up and down teams in the U -18's mostly because they play together according to other nations. I would argue a great deal of it is they get good practice time in and careful development in strength and other good habits. They play against older players a lot, but it is hard to argue the USMNTDP isn't paying off big time. The uptick in talent churned out and lately what looks like more elite talent is hard to ignore. To be a member of that program and really specifically a higher first round pick says a lot, not a whole lot of failures to look at in terms of that.

 

[odin1981]

Yeah, are we voting on a mix of both NHL-readiness and potential?

I remember at the start TZE said this was in part to see who values what to see how much it reflects in the standings. I am one of the more controversial types that likes readiness over ceiling and have stated it many times. So this to me is a textbook case. That is not to say I will ignore ceiling but I personally don't value ceiling anywhere near as much if a player hasn't proven anything at the Sel/Khl/fin hockey league (forgot initials at the moment, or ahl. If a prospect hasn't proven in a professional mans league there game to me is too unpredictable to rate. Because they will change as players at two distinct levels (both tiers of pro leagues) that makes there ceiling unpredictable at best.

I personally believe AA is overrated but that is because when he got time in GR last year he played like 5 games tops and was then benched. Also our prospect center problem as well I believe inflates his value because most want him to be good because then at least him and sheahan might both get to learn at least for a year or two with dats and Z on the wings. Which is kinda funny because he was terrible at center in his few games in the ahl and moved to wing then moved back to center, then benched. This is not to say he won't make it or whatever but I also believe because he was one of the leaders at mini camp he is probably getting a tad too much credit as well. Until enough games have been played by him in a pro league to make a decently accurate guess how he will play at the next level he won't be underrated in my eyes.

 

[Frk It]

I remember at the start TZE said this was in part to see who values what to see how much it reflects in the standings. I am one of the more controversial types that likes readiness over ceiling and have stated it many times. So this to me is a textbook case. That is not to say I will ignore ceiling but I personally don't value ceiling anywhere near as much if a player hasn't proven anything at the Sel/Khl/fin hockey league (forgot initials at the moment, or ahl. If a prospect hasn't proven in a professional mans league there game to me is too unpredictable to rate. Because they will change as players at two distinct levels (both tiers of pro leagues) that makes there ceiling unpredictable at best.

I personally believe AA is overrated but that is because when he got time in GR last year he played like 5 games tops and was then benched. Also our prospect center problem as well I believe inflates his value because most want him to be good because then at least him and sheahan might both get to learn at least for a year or two with dats and Z on the wings. Which is kinda funny because he was terrible at center in his few games in the ahl and moved to wing then moved back to center, then benched. This is not to say he won't make it or whatever but I also believe because he was one of the leaders at mini camp he is probably getting a tad too much credit as well. Until enough games have been played by him in a pro league to make a decently accurate guess how he will play at the next level he won't be underrated in my eyes.

He had 3 pts, and 2 goals in his first 2 games, and looked great.

Being benched means nothing, pretty sure Sproul was benched after being called up last year.

Getting benched at 19 years old when you're called up during the last 10% of the season is really not even worth holding against a prospect.

 

[Eastopia]

larkin at 9

Bäckman at 8.

Larkin and AA are about where they should be, AA I would actually put one down as I voted for Janmark here. The guy looked good against men on a team that really was Buffalo bad relative to their league, though it was close. But I don't think either AA or Larkin should be much higher than where they have ended up for now, this could easily change after AA has had a year in GR but for now 10th is fine. Bäckman, on the other hand, should be #4, he's better offensively than Ouellet while similar defensively, much better defensively than Sproul while having a similar offensive upside as him IMO. Good skater too, he really should be ranked as our best prospect on D; I understand why he's not and that's fine, like AA fans I will have to wait a year for him to take the position he deserves.

 

[ricky0034]

He had 3 pts, and 2 goals in his first 2 games, and looked great.

Being benched means nothing, pretty sure Sproul was benched after being called up last year.

Getting benched at 19 years old when you're called up during the last 10% of the season is really not even worth holding against a prospect.

hell even Pulkkinen got benched eventually last year and he was older and coming from a mens league

he did just fine this year

 

[Brandel*]

Bäckman at 8.

Larkin and AA are about where they should be, AA I would actually put one down as I voted for Janmark here. The guy looked good against men on a team that really was Buffalo bad relative to their league, though it was close. But I don't think either AA or Larkin should be much higher than where they have ended up for now, this could easily change after AA has had a year in GR but for now 10th is fine. Bäckman, on the other hand, should be #4, he's better offensively than Ouellet while similar defensively, much better defensively than Sproul while having a similar offensive upside as him IMO. Good skater too, he really should be ranked as our best prospect on D; I understand why he's not and that's fine, like AA fans I will have to wait a year for him to take the position he deserves.

I was actually going to say Backman @ 8 but I personally think Larkin is a lot better than he's been given credit for. Backman is my favourite of all four D prospects.

 

[Mijatovic]

Nosek

 

[RedWingzz]

AA easily

 

[Laser Rayzor]

Man this is a really close race.......


Voted AA, add McNulty

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Said this on the top 10 page on the main prospect page.

But it is pretty insane when you look at this list and realize very likely 9 of our top 10 are going to spend time growing and developing on one of the best teams in their league if not the very best. They are already building chemistry and playing together. That is something a lot of other teams don't really get, our top end future is together minus Larkin, I expect big things and while angry over some of the off-season moves, this angle of these guys playing for a year and probably dominating while they learn each other and potentially their future coach is probably the envy of a lot of front offices around the league.

 

[Frk It]

Said this on the top 10 page on the main prospect page.

But it is pretty insane when you look at this list and realize very likely 9 of our top 10 are going to spend time growing and developing on one of the best teams in their league if not the very best. They are already building chemistry and playing together. That is something a lot of other teams don't really get, our top end future is together minus Larkin, I expect big things and while angry over some of the off-season moves, this angle of these guys playing for a year and probably dominating while they learn each other and potentially their future coach is probably the envy of a lot of front offices around the league.

Good point.

Will be interesting to see who Pulkkinen plays with, and how that goes. Every time I saw his name on the boxscore it was some combo of Pulkkinnen+Jarnkrok+Almquist. Will be interesting to see how he'll do without those two. Feel like that trio on the PP was virtually unstoppable in the 2nd half of the year.

 

[Shaman464]

Good point.

Will be interesting to see who Pulkkinen plays with, and how that goes. Every time I saw his name on the boxscore it was some combo of Pulkkinnen+Jarnkrok+Almquist. Will be interesting to see how he'll do without those two. Feel like that trio on the PP was virtually unstoppable in the 2nd half of the year.

Then you only watched him for a short period between the end of January and the trade deadline. Pulkkinnen played with a revolving door of linemates last season.

 

[Frk It]

Then you only watched him for a short period between the end of January and the trade deadline. Pulkkinnen played with a revolving door of linemates last season.

Read the last sentence of my post again.

I was pointing out that was a trio that seemed to really click, and both those guys are gone now. I wasn't saying it was the only players he played with, just sure seemed like that's who he had most success with.

 

[Shaman464]

Read the last sentence of my post again.

I was pointing out that was a trio that seemed to really click, and both those guys are gone now. I wasn't saying it was the only players he played with, just sure seemed like that's who he had most success with.

His scoring was pretty steady last season, that was my point. He actually increased his scoring clip after Jarnkrok was traded, even after being pushed down to the second line in the playoffs.

 

[Frk It]

His scoring was pretty steady last season, that was my point. He actually increased his scoring clip after Jarnkrok was traded, even after being pushed down to the second line in the playoffs.

Fair enough. Wasn't trying to knock him. Fwiw I voted for him over Sproul at #5.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

He played quite well with Nestrasil and Jurco a different points last year as well. Was over a ppg player after Jarnkrok left and in the playoffs when Almqvist was KO'd in the first game of the first round.

In my opinion he will play with Jurco and Miele/Porter/Nosek.

Have to wait to see if they re-sign certain players and ultimately waive some pieces, but I think Pulkkinen and Jurco will be the top line wingers on that team. Scary version is that allows Mantha to learn playing second pairing D-man and Athanasiou getting likely third pairing guys.

You also have to wonder if Nestrasil's chemistry will win out in terms of those guys. Either way it is loaded for bear at that level. Whatever line they play on they are likely to enjoy significant talent advantages especially with the way that D transitions.

 

[ricky0034]

Said this on the top 10 page on the main prospect page.

But it is pretty insane when you look at this list and realize very likely 9 of our top 10 are going to spend time growing and developing on one of the best teams in their league if not the very best. They are already building chemistry and playing together. That is something a lot of other teams don't really get, our top end future is together minus Larkin, I expect big things and while angry over some of the off-season moves, this angle of these guys playing for a year and probably dominating while they learn each other and potentially their future coach is probably the envy of a lot of front offices around the league.

the only problem is the absolutely massive logjam forcing all these guys to stay down instead of getting long looks at them at the NHL level is going to create

right now we're headed down a path where it's gonna be really bad if Holland doesn't make some trades soon

and if he does make trades I just plain don't trust him to get good returns

I foresee a future where in a couple years Holland is panicking about all our defensemen suddenly being out of waiver options and practically giving up some potentially really good players in trades to avoid having to waive them

and on top of that when he's making those panic moves you better believe the relative lack of NHL experience is gonna both affect the return and make it a lot harder to decide which ones to get rid of

the way the Wings do things is incredibly frustrating in part because it objectively makes the NHL roster worse at times,but that's what really scares me about this whole thing

I honestly think it is going to have some fairly serious long term consequences

 

[Shaman464]

Fair enough. Wasn't trying to knock him. Fwiw I voted for him over Sproul at #5.

Yeah, I am really high on him, I have a signed Jokerit jersey and a signed Griffins picture from him, and have seen him in play in Finland and Grand Rapids. So I've kept close tabs on his development. I really believe that he will be a guy who will average 25 goals and may even have a 40 goal season in him.

 

[Brandel*]

the only problem is the absolutely massive logjam forcing all these guys to stay down instead of getting long looks at them at the NHL level is going to create

right now we're headed down a path where it's gonna be really bad if Holland doesn't make some trades soon

and if he does make trades I just plain don't trust him to get good returns

I foresee a future where in a couple years Holland is panicking about all our defensemen suddenly being out of waiver options and practically giving up some potentially really good players in trades to avoid having to waive them

and on top of that when he's making those panic moves you better believe the relative lack of NHL experience is gonna both affect the return and make it a lot harder to decide which ones to get rid of

the way the Wings do things is incredibly frustrating in part because it objectively makes the NHL roster worse at times,but that's what really scares me about this whole thing

I honestly think it is going to have some fairly serious long term consequences

that's why Smith won't be a red wing in 3 years

 

[Mijatovic]

Smith wont be a Red Wing totally depends on how he plays this year I think. Defence though. Oulette/Marchenko/Backman/Sproul. I feel for them. Only 2 probably have a chance of making it at Detroit.

Most of them run out of waivers next year right?