Deline, NWT - Birthplace of Hockey?

Discussion in 'The History of Hockey' started by Fugu, Aug 17, 2006.

  1. Fugu

    Fugu Administrator

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    Picked up by the Vancouver Sun today from Canwest News Service is a report that Deline, NWT is ready to declare itself as the birthplace of hockey. Many of the historians here probably have been following this debate closely, but it was news to me. I also learned that Stephen Harper is working on a book about the early days of the NHL and is an historian of the sport. I didn't know that.

    Here is an excerpt from:

    Hockey's northern origins take centre ice on PM's N.W.T. tour

    Randy Boswell, Canwest News Service
    Thursday, August 17, 2006


     
  2. saskganesh

    saskganesh Registered User

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    is hurley "hockey" even if its called "hockey"?

    "hockey" has a 16C origin according to etymonline.com

    fascinating reference though. the bizarre Franklin legend grows.
     
  3. taunting canadian

    taunting canadian Registered User

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    I'd imagine that Deline is laying claim to the birth of true hockey, otherwise known as ice hockey, while the 16th century origin of "
    "hockey" refers to field "hockey". :teach: ;)
     
  4. 72projectmgr

    72projectmgr Registered User

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    I also believe that Jesus walked on water.........The history of Islam will soon be king of the hockey world. Sorry I got a little off track there-The time Jesus walked on water is the time that hockey was invented. For all you non believers IT WAS FROZEN and if you dont believe me ask Father Bauer, and for all the other people praying (I mean Maple Leaf Fans) since the spelling mistake ("LEAES"):biglaugh: on the Stanley Cup you have not won-get out the Liquid Paper and fix it.:bow:
     
  5. Iain Fyffe

    Iain Fyffe Hockey fact-checker

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    People need to be more careful in general in their use of the word "hockey" when discussing history this far back. The word used to simply mean hitting a thing with a stick, not necessarily the game we know now.

    They also need to drop the whole "birthplace" thing. It's sensationalist but ultimately meaningless. Does anyone really believe that a particular place and time, someone sat down and said "You know what would be a good idea for a game?" The game evolved over time into its present form. The birthplace of something as vague as "hockey" is long lost to the mists of time.
     
  6. sparkychewbarky

    sparkychewbarky Registered User

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    Beautifully stated, and maybe we should leave it at that. It adds to the mystique of the game.

    With so many "origins" (don't forget the theory of it evolving from the Scottish game of shinty- hence the origin of the word "shinny"), perhaps the beer commercial is right...

    It's a game that just grew from the land.
     
  7. Nalyd Psycho

    Nalyd Psycho Registered User

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    You are absolutely correct. People want there to be an "aha" moment because some sports like basketball have that.
     
  8. tarheelhockey

    tarheelhockey Highest Boss

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    In any case, it's a fair bet that ice hockey evolved so gradually out of other sports (field hockey, football, rugby) and in such a manner that its "birth" was likely not apparent even after it had happened. Where do you draw the line between hockey-on-ice and ice-hockey?
     
  9. Analyzer*

    Analyzer* Guest

    Some Brit playing field hockey probably got pissed and drilled some other brit. He got banned from Britain and went to Canada. While in Canada he introduced field hockey, but with a twist. During one winter day they were playing "field hockey" on a slippery surface. This same brit drilled some other guy who slid on the ice and crashed into the snow bank. Everyone was impressed by this new addition so they adapted it. Over the course of 100 years the game slowly changed added cow patties, sticks and some protection for the keeper of the net.

    That's how hockey came to be. If one place isn't the birthplace of hockey, it's Renfrew.
     
  10. tarheelhockey

    tarheelhockey Highest Boss

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    Those Brits wouldn't have needed to travel to Canada to play field hockey on ice; it was already being done on their own island. Not quite ice hockey exactly, especially as they weren't yet using skates, but clearly a culturally connected activity.

    I'm reluctant to say this as an outsider to the cultures involved, let alone a rank amateur among historians, but from what I have read it seems that Canadian sources tend to discount the British influence of the sport, preferring to emphasize the colonial and indigenous influences. Could that be tied to the 20th Century construction of Candian cultural touchstones? I really don't know. But the idea of Renfrew or Deline or even Montreal as the birthplace of hockey rather than Great Britain seems to have a touch of patriotic reconstruction.
     
  11. Analyzer*

    Analyzer* Guest

    I'm not sure about the others claims, but Renfrew lays claim to being the birthplace of hockey more in the sense as the birthplace of the NHL. Except aside from M.J. O'Brien/Ambrose O'Brien from being from here, there's not much else that connects Renfrew to the NHL.
     
  12. Killion

    Killion Global Moderator

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    ... pretty much. Early 14th century Flemish & 17th century Dutch paintings depict pastoral scenes of river & pond activity with skaters playing games with sticks so clearly the games history, beginning are shrouded in mystery. According to the Society for International Hockey Research based in Toronto, on North American soil in written references from Diaries;

    1825 - Franklin refers to "playing hockey" however its assumed it was field hockey on ice sans skates.

    1839 - Welland River in Ontario, again, references made to "playing hockey" on the frozen Chippewa (as it when called) but no reference to skates.

    1843 - Sir Arthur Freeling of Kingston Ontario with "began to skate this year, improved quickly, had great fun at hockey on ice".

    One would have to assume from the entry by Freeling that it wasnt just "invented" in 1843, that it had been played on skates and likely for quite some time in Canada before he decided to partake.
     
  13. kaiser matias

    kaiser matias Registered User

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    Was in Warsaw during the summer, and saw a picture done in Flanders circa 1493 that is somewhat relevant to this:

    The first picture is the painting. It is from the era or something, I can't remember; that wasn't important. But something in it caught my Canadian eye right away.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The bottom is a closeup of the middle. It shows some people on ice with sticks, playing a game that resembles hockey. While obviously not any evidence of anything, I thought that it was interesting that the artist thought this sport to be important enough and perhaps popular enough to warrant being included on this painting.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2012
  14. jumptheshark

    jumptheshark McDavid Headquarters Sponsor

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    Deline can say whatever they like but MANY european countries can produce evidence that hockey or a similier type game was played 100 years before it was called hockey in Canada. I believe Scandavia or the Russians can lay better claim then any Canadains city
     
  15. jumptheshark

    jumptheshark McDavid Headquarters Sponsor

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  16. Killion

    Killion Global Moderator

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    ... I agree, long before even the Dark Ages of European history. Amongst the northern indigenous peoples of Scandanavia. Borje' Salmings ancestors and so on, working its way southward through what is now Finland, Sweden, Norway, the lower countries like Holland etc. Its' the development of the "Modern Game" that seems to be the issue. Which came first, the Montreal or Halifax Rules (?) that seems to engender the greatest debate.
     
  17. Crease

    Crease Chief Justice of the HFNYR Court

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  18. Killion

    Killion Global Moderator

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    ... ya. the earliest skates fashioned from carved antlers, animal bones, Sister Sara's tibia.
     

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